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Edited by Onyx Guard:
3/5/2018 9:04:01 PM
14
Relationship between the Vex and the Hive
You seem like a reasonable bunch.
I request assistance.
What is the relationship between the Hive throne worlds and Vex teleportation/time travel?
Any information you provide will be helpful towards the future plans of my personal [url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/242853482/0/0]wooble[/url], story thing.
Not the most noble of requests, but figured I should ask the people that know the background before I try to swoop down like a C-5 with no landing gear.
Edit: thanks for the info so far.
Need to tie up the final act of the current plot before going into the second that deals with the topic at hand.
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The Vex had teleportation abilities and supposed time travel (quantum science I would assume) before they even came to our reality. They seem to operate by traveling between realities can be more or less used as bootstrap time travel Hive Sword Realms are little bubbles of reality that are tethered to our reality. They do not exist in our physical plane or follow our physics and act as a way to contain the power of the Hive that created them since that power cannot exist within our reality. To pass into, out of, and between Sword Spaces the Hive have to cleave through the fabric of space and time, effectively making a doorway from a tear in our reality. This obviously can create some problems One day Crota made one of these tears (a Wound, as they call it) leading nowhere in particular and accidentally opened up into a different reality. According to the Books of Sorrow, this is the first time they Vex existed within our specific reality, but they had existed for eons in many others (alternate timelines/realities). At that moment the Vex used that encounter as an anchor to invade our reality as they had in the others, and also to invade the Sword Realm which was totally new to them In the fighting that ensued, the Vex learned a good deal about the Sword Realm and Darkness and began experimenting. They created the Black Garden’s Heart with a fragment of the Darkness’s power and also made the Vault of Glass. The Vault actually surpassed the Sword Realms in almost every aspect. As soon it was completed it came to exist in every reality in every point of time; this probably allowed Vex to spread more efficiently to other realities that hadn’t been explored yet. The Vault is the ultimatum of the Vex; it is thought to exist in all realities (known to exist in a numerous ones already) and connects the Vex through all of them. Inside the Vex reign supreme over physics, space, and time on a scale that easily dwarfs the Sword Realms. The problem is that its connections to all realities make it easily enterable everywhere if you can just get through the door, while Sword Realms are only accessible through Wounds and the places they are anchored to (except in the case of Oryx’s, which requires physically fixed entrances due to its mobile state)
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6 RepliesAren’t the Hive the reason the Vex entered our world? I could have sworn I remem reading the Hive cut open a dimension and the Vex came pouring out of the opening.
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Edited by Mar: 3/6/2018 8:53:55 PMhive throne worlds are pocket dimensions very powerful hive, IE - oryx, crota, savathun create. Because its basically a seperate reality they create they determine the rules (sword logic). If they die in the throne world they die a "real" death (though they may be able to be brought back still by extreme means). The vex teleportation/time travel thing is the vex network and is sorta similar to a degree, not much is said about what it is exactly but it seems to be a separate reality or dimension that is outside of time. They seem to be able to create gates that allow them to pop in and out of that network. Ghosts and computers can access it by plugging into it through vex tech and it seems like the network might be a actual space like the throne worlds just much much bigger. The relation between the 2 is that one can lead into the other if done correctly. They both work on their own rule sets and both are totally different "places" but as shown in the book of sorrows a portal can be opened between them. Once a vex is inside a throne world it must obey the laws of that world (sword logic), i'd guess the opposite is true too that if a hive went into the network it would have to obey the laws of the network. Think of it in terms of 2 different buildings both without doors. Only those inside the buildings can make a door leading into the building and you need a key to get into that door. When crota tore open a hole in reality he accidentally popped a hole into the vex's building (think in terms of knocked a wall down by being stupid) and a few walked through the hole. Oryx and crota resealed the hole and killed all the vex (minus a hydra he sent to savathun to have some "fun" with). and as far as the vex and hive themselves, they are enemies but neither are "friends" to guardians. The hive worship servants of the darkness (the worm gods), so they are allied with the darkness itself. The vex want a future where only the vex exist, meaning no light or dark only the vex. They are enemies to each other but they also both want us gone because the hive want to kill the light to prove they are worthy to exist and the vex want us dead (or converted to vex) because we don't fit into their plans. [spoiler]on a separate note. "A reasonable bunch"? what forms are you reading cause this is the most unreasonable bunch of crazy's ive ever seen.[/spoiler]
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is called pheromones
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10 RepliesLittle Baby Crota cut open reality and unleashed the Vex
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7 RepliesHive won the war against the Vex
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4 RepliesEdited by TrolleyProblem: 3/6/2018 1:58:56 PMIn the books of sorrow, the 3 heirs of the osmium throne, aurash, sathoma, and xi ro travelled to the deep within the gas giant fundament. In doing so, they found the worm gods and went through symbiosis to grow In power so they might survive the god wave started by that strange white orb from the sky, and avenge their late father. Thus, Savathun, Xivu Arath, and Auryx were born. and with them, the hive also came into existence. and they all needed to commit constant murder and genocide on any and all they came across to appease the worm God's insatiable hunger; lest they be consumed by their larvae. fast forward a few thousand years and the 3 hive gods have conquered fundament and hundreds of planets in the process. Auryx temporarily toppled the worm god akka, and as a result, gained the tablets of ruin and the ability to take; now making her Oryx the taken king. along with that, Oryx bore his children Crota, and the daughters (ir anuk and ir halak). as well, the original give gods had all developed their own throne worlds due to their sacrifices to the worm gods. One day, the clever sister, Savathun tricked her nephew, crota, into tearing a wound in reality as an attempt to make his own oversoul. out of the wound flooded the vex with the axis mind Quria leading them. Oryx promptly punished Crota by sending him away and then began to deal with the vex. naturally, the Quria attempted to analyze Oryx but failed. for Oryx in his current state had far too much ontological and paracasual power. in a desperate attempt, Quria created a proxy, a simulation of Oryx without the worm gods or his power: Aurash. through this, Quria learned the hive became this powerful through symbiosis with the worm gods. it was the worms that gave them this throne world and almost complete control over paracausality . Quria did not dare taint the vex' s radiolaria with the worms though. instead, it sent out directives to fabricate the vex' s version of a throne world with atheon as a catalyst for research. Oryx then partially took Quria, and handed it, along with the rest of the vex, off to his sister Savathun. [b]tldr[/b]: the vex were brought into this version of reality because Crota got too ballsy in a game of chicken. they started simulating everything but couldn't, cause Oryx was too powerful. so then Quria decides to copy the worm gods and build its own version of throne worlds through the Vault of glass.
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Edited by piratepatchy243: 3/6/2018 12:35:27 PMThe Books of Sorrow would be a great start, I'll just go over the Vex stuff in it. Savathun being herself tricks Oryx's siblings with Crota being the main dumdass, he cut a space where the Vex happen to be. Within a short amount they found out how the Hive throne world's worked, and fought for many years until Oryx caught wind if it. The Vex were caught off guard but quickly made a mind Quria, Blade Transformed and made further headway into the workings of their Blade Logic and worship. However they were still no match and retreated, and even their next encounter failed but a lot of knowledge was gained. They deduced that the power they faced is what's needed to become part of the universe, but becoming slaves to the worms was not an option. With that they decided to seek the darkness another way, how I see it though is in two parts. The information gleaned was heavily used by the Hezen Protective( VoG ) and Sol Divisive( Black Garden ). Imo they're different sides of the same coin, Hezen Protective is their test stage( paracausal research ) with the Sol Divisive pushing the end result( application of research, heavy worship as well ). The Heart of the Garden is still a mystery though, did the Vex find it or is it the other way around. The way it looks now is that the Vex maybe higher than the Hive, even though we destroyed important minds in CoO( which we know little to nothing about, smfh ). We're they able to fully simulate guardians, were we able to quell it? It's very evident we hit important assets, they always pull Vex from every timeline during those encounters. We definitely need more info on current Vex, but for now the Hive need to make their next move or die by the standard they hold.
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3 RepliesI think the Vex and the Hive have a relationship with the Darkness in common. There appears to be a link there because it seems the Vex gained the ability to "cut" space-time after Crota opened a portal to their world, and the Vex began worshipping the Darkness. A key distinction is that the Vex did not allow the Hive worms to infect their "mind-fluid." This is important because it means the ability to cut space-time is not dependent on symbiosis with the Worms, only by worshipping, or maybe more accurately serving the Darkness. The Taken are also important here, because the ability to "take" is a power granted by the Darkness, and the grimiore seems to suggest that the Taken are beings outside of normal space-time. It's a big reach on my part, but I suspect that since only living things can be "taken," (we learn this from a ghost scan) only living beings can gain the ability to cut and travel through worlds, so Guardians cannot travel the way the Hive, the Vex, and the Exo Stranger can (because they're dead). Like the grimiore, [i]you are a dead thing made by a dead power in the shape of the dead.[/i]
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5 Replies<Long ago, Crota (being a dumbass), cut a wound into spacetime to wherever the Vex come from. The Vex, being new, decided to start transforming the place. Crota retaliated, but the Vex did a "Ritual of Better Thoughts" (Crota=idiot 2) and created Quria. Quria deduced the Hive's Sword Logic and captured a Worm (possibly the Heart of the Black Garden). Quria then hid himself and got out of Oryx's Throne World (presumably during the building of the Dreadnaught). Meanwhile, Oryx came in and forced the Vex out of his realm and chucked Crota through the portal (Crota=idiot 3). Quria then met Oryx to simulate him... didn't work. Quria then simulated a younger Oryx, which worked. Oryx got pissed and Quria sent everything it could to the Vex Collective before being Taken. Fast forward and now the Taken/Hive and Vex are locked in War.>
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5 RepliesYour tags are off... [spoiler][i]folklore[/i], Destiny[/spoiler]
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1 ReplyThe hive hate the vex. Fin
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3 RepliesThink of it this way. The vex cut into time and the hive cut into space. What is bounded together? Spacetime.
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1 ReplySome people think that the vex learned how to cut through space thanks to crota cutting into their space. Look up the books of sorrow.
