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Discuss all things Destiny 2.
Edited by BNGHelp5: 11/30/2017 2:03:15 AM
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The State of Destiny 2 (Now with Podcast)

Hello all, We've recently updated the blog with the "[url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Detail/News/46504]State of Destiny 2[/url]" article. This details some upcoming changes to Destiny 2, and also states goals we have moving forward not only for the game, but our communication surrounding it. We're actively monitoring for feedback. Let us know your thoughts. I'll be collecting posts and community feedback to pass along to the development team. Moving forward, we're looking to have more conversations like this. [b](Update - 6 PM PST)[/b] Hey again all, We've also uploaded a Podcast to iTunes and Android with commentary from Luke Smith and Mark Noseworthy. If you've given a listen, let us know what you think. Cheers, -dmg04
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  • My initial impression of the blog post was this: "Hey, we still think that our general decision was right and you should play Destiny only for a few hours per week. But if you 'Advanced players' insist on playing every day, we will make some changes. But we have only a handful of developers, so this will take some time." I welcome these changes as they bring Destiny 2 in the right direction: back where Destiny 1 already was. Over the past weeks I so often asked myself: "Surely Bungie must have thought about this. Surely Bungie must have tested this. But then why is it so? Why wouldn't they tell us why this is so?" Questions include: Why is the vault space so limited? Who thought it was a good idea to do weapons and armour in the same vault space? Why is the mod space so annoyingly small? Why can't I see my fireteam on the map? Why can't I choose my crucible game type? Why can't I choose a specific strike? Why is there no reason to do normal strikes? I would really, really like it if you could answer questions like that over the coming weeks and month, perhaps in the form of a weekly live stream or a weekly podcast instead of us guessing and listening to rumours.

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    • The problem with making a "crafting system" via Masterworks, that only allows you to affect the Weapons' Stats, and not the -PERKS- on the weapon is: Nowhere in that Blog Post did Bungie say or allude to a cap on the level scaling for the enemies you face. Regardless of what Planet/Moon/Centaur you're fighting on, the enemies directly and proportionately scale to your individual character level. Thus, it takes the same amount of time to kill any level-tier of enemy at Light 300 as it does at Light 100. If Bungie were to implement an upper-level-cap on how high the enemies scaled, then it might feel like your character is actually growing more powerful over the course of the game, and with the higher amount of time you spend in the game. If say... a Fallen Captain had a level scaling cap of say... 260; there would be challenge to defeating said Captain, all the way until you passed Light 260. Once you're past that point, enemy damage to your character becomes less, your damage to the enemy grows proportionately to the ever-widening gulf between your character light level, and the enemy that will never grow past Light 260. So you -FEEL- more powerful, and there will be a noticeable reduction in Time to Kill as your more powerful character has grown. So since Bungie failed to even mention placing a level cap on the enemies, it doesn't matter in the slightest how high you "Masterwork" any given weapon. The weapon power directly figures into the algorithm that decides your Light Level. The higher you "Masterwork" the weapon stats, the higher the power level of the weapon goes. The higher the power level of the weapon, the higher your Light Level averages. Then, the enemies you face directly scale to match your Light Level, thus keeping your Time to Kill exactly the same, as the game has now scaled damage and enemy health/defense in direct proportion to your higher Light Level due to the "Masterwork" higher stats of the weapon you've been slaving to upgrade. The "Masterwork" upgrades for Weapon Stats, and weapon stats only (we're all still stuck with Static Perks on all of our weapons, meaning that even after these updates, if you've received one Nameless Midnight, you've received every Nameless Midnight that it's possible to ever get...), is a [b]paper tiger[/b] update. The game itself, and the basic structure that Bungie built the mechanics around, cancels out any upgrades you will ever hope to apply to your weapons' base Stats. This new Blog Post was a whole lot of nothing. Nothing is going to improve in the game. They've used smoke and mirrors to make you -THINK- that they've added in weapon crafting, when the base mechanics of the game directly cancel out any upgrades that this crafting might apply to your weapons. The Blog Post and the coming updates are pure bullshit. Nothing will be changing beyond aesthetics, and the game will still play in the exact same boring manner that it does now. The game will still have the mind-numbing boring "Loot" that we've been suffering with since the game launched. Bungie outright lied, and used misdirection and false equivalencies yet again, in a feeble attempt to placate Player rage. But once you sit down, look at the planned updates, then actually apply the game mechanics to those updates, it's easily proven that these future "Updates" change nothing in the game. I for one, am not fooled; and I'd imagine that, if one were to sit down and take the time, this [b]Paper Tiger[/b] model of game management would be found to apply equally to every single aspect of Destiny 2. TL;DR: You guys at Bungie aren't fixing anything. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that the whole "Blog Post" was nothing more than what you had planned for the game any way, but due to Player anger, pushed it up in the development schedule. That does not, however; change the fact that none of your "changes" are anything more than thinly veiled aesthetic changes that will not affect the game in any meaningful manner.

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    • Bring back exotic swords

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    • Edited by GakMan: 11/30/2017 4:38:53 PM
      Are we going to get something similar to Wolves Prowling, Taken infestation or any other pre DLC addtions in the public patrol areas prior to the DLC dropping Tuesday like in D1? Or has that been removed from the game franchise as well?

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    • We shouldn't place our guard down and continue the pressure on Bungie.

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    • Definitely intrigued at the direction things were heading. I have thoroughly enjoyed many hours on this game thus far, and plan to spend many more after the new stuff drops!

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    • Yes because we'd love to have the bullshit that filled out eyes now fill our ears, hard pass.

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    • Edited by oOUTSIDERo62: 11/30/2017 4:13:41 PM
      I don't see much changing, but heres hoping.

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    • It personally saddens me to see a community that was once so great, diminish into the comments and jabs people have been throwing at this team lately. I just want to say that I appreciate the work you guys have done, and I acknowledge the changes and sacrifices that are being made so that the demands of the community can be met. As somebody who remembers when a game was only what was packaged, I can appreciate the live fixes that are being applied. As a member of the IT Community, I can respect the work that goes into implementing a change like this, and the longer hours that you guys are working to please a player base that feel the need to threaten and belittle. As a gamer, I appreciate all that you guys do so the rest of us can have an escape. Hold your heads high, and thank you.

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      • light problems need solving 1. INCREASE VAULT SIZE - my vault is full already, i cannot gather more weapons and armor. 2. Make an option to save "SETUP EQUIPMENT" for fast equipment change. at least 3 set can be save. 3. MOD , hope fully more option.like increase ammo by %. 4. hopefully show NUMBERS IN EXPERIENCE BAR. 5. show number in cooldown of skill in hub. 6 FULLY SHOW DETAILS OF CHARACTER, like HP, ARMOR, cooldowns. 7. Skill tree customization not a set please.

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      • I just read the update on the blog but have not listened to the podcast yet. I am disappointed that there was no mention of additional vault space or better vault sorting tools. There are many Guardians that are struggling with full vaults and having to make collection decisions on what to keep. This is even worse for those that have purchased items using cash for silver dust but now have to delete those items because of not of enough vault space. To me this is a travesty as our vaults do not store actual items but only numbers that represent items. The amount of memory required to store these items is so small compared to the amount of memory in the console that there is no way that it can impinge on game play. In fact I cannot imagine the current vault space taking over 2KB of memory (actually 300 * 4B for really spacious storage, giving 1.2KB of required storage). That is less than 0.00002% of the consoles memory (assuming you are storing it in RAM, an even small percentage if storing on the hard drive). SPACE is NOT an issue. You could multiply the vault space by 50 and still be less than 1/1000 of 1% of system memory. Please open up the vault space. [spoiler]No, you do not need to increase the vault space by a factor of 50, that is just an example (if you do though, please improve the sorting and give us other vault tools).[/spoiler]

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        • There was some good things in their blog, but It's not going to be enough for me. The problems I have with the game go beyond what they are willing to change. 1. Two Primary load out system 2. Less Space Magic 3. Slow lumbering movement 4. Weak unbalanced grenades 5. Rarely feeling like a powerful guardian It's going to be hard for me to want to go back to this game with this garbage still in place.

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        • Destiny 1 dominated my life for years and I counted myself among the angry masses when Destiny 2 turned out to be for casuals. But after reading the blog post I realized something, I haven't played Destiny 2 in weeks and the pittance that they are a so proud of just helps increase this aversion. I no longer stay up all night grinding for that perfect Hopscotch Pilgrim nor do I spend countless hours hoping for a glitch free run on Crota. Bungie, you may have conned me out of my money but you did gave me back my life.

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        • Edited by DuBChiri2: 11/30/2017 3:58:13 PM
          I will be perfectly fine with masterworks once it gets fleshed out a bit more. As it currently stands...dropping orbs from multikills isn't bad, but I would like something more. Like debuffs, buffs, burning etc and if any of those prove to be an annoyance in PvP, just prevent those perks from being active in PvP to preserve balance. That way people would have a reason to have more than one gun, one for pve and one for PvP, because stats aren't really an issue in pve. I would also like to see perks like armor piercing rounds, dragonfly, and third eye to become mods applicable to weapons, that way there's a little more customization we can do with our weapons. Add some new perks too, perks that aren't just stat boosters for once. I think people have voiced their opinion enough on picking their game type. My idea for a weapon system change: https://www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Post/239356732?page=0&sort=0&showBanned=0&path=1 I don't want more tokens damn it! Although I like not having to complete the raid anymore to turn in tokens, haven't gotten a single completion yet but I have like 50 tokens. Strike specific loot going to be a thing ever again? Did the CoO handcannon only do 47 damage a headshot? What are we doing with mods? No news on weapon balancing, the only part I'm worried about ._. Fixing exotics that suck, FINALLY. "We're sorry, hardlight isn't allowed to be buffed" DAMN IT

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        • I liked the update, I'm curious to see how the updates will be in game. Here is some feedback from a dedicated Destiny player. Now I am primarily a PVE player, so my feedback is more directed to that area. - The Masterworks weapon forging could be interesting, but it also depends on the perks you can have and adjust on the weapons and the variety there will be. The one thing I didn't like about D2 was the static rolls on the weapons, I believe this was to balance PVP. I truly believe that separating PVP and PVE environments would benefit Destiny immensely. - I wasn't too keen on seeing 3oC make a come back, I personally used them in D1 for leveling up. The Fated Engram was not needed. Any D1 player will tell you that when you did get that rare exotic to drop like Icebreaker or Ghally it was epic. It's too easy and seems to be getting easier now. Maybe have Xur sell Masterworks mods, ornaments or other wares? - More uses for the shards and tokens, I like where this is going, ornaments have always imo been something individuals liked to show off their characters. - Strikes are definitely looking up, again I want to experience it, but it seems to be moving in the right direction. Heroic strikes definitely should not have been removed when D2 came out. Strike specific loot would be nice. Perhaps placing ornaments as random rewards, or Masterworks mods (if they are mods). - XP issues, this needs to be addressed, players notice this kind of stuff, the same goes for chest and planetary material cooldowns. If there are cooldowns, be upfront about it tell us what the cooldown is, some will complain yes, but others will adjust their farming techniques to accommodate. I have purchased both DLCs, I have logged a lot of hours so far and gotten my money's worth in entertainment. I really like the Destiny franchise, D2 has beautiful graphics and worlds to explore. The changes in the weapons is what moved me from loving it to liking it. You adapt and play with it, but I know that I play much less now than D1 cuz I have much less to grind for, heck I haven't even completed the raid with my group cuz the weapons are nothing special. I really miss random rolled weapons and raid weapons with special raid perks. Bungie has to stop sacrificing PVE to balance PVP, I don't know why this is (there are many reasons out there). I look forward to the DLC and the next one to come and future updates and changes to the Destiny environment. Just some honest constructive feedback from a loyal Destiny player. :)

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        • I think the update is good, but there is much work to do. I also think the masterworks is nice, but doesn’t fix the gun problem. I also am concerned there is nothing to help solo queuing in Crucible. And the pledge to communicate more is nice, but you said the same thing in year 2 and here we are again. We are nerdy people, we love delving into the details, but by removing random rolls you remove the details we love. For example, think of car guys. They will say they love a car, but then delve in to the motor it was optioned with, manual or auto, tire size, suspension, etc. The old system was like that. /it had nuance that made it interesting. You might have made guns easier to talk about, but you lost the nuance we love to talk about. We used to discuss at length which perks we preferred on a gun and now we don’t. I was hoping the gun mods would be gun parts, like swapping out a barrel a stock, scope, or a magazine type. Then we would build our guns and would lead to a lot of discussion and research in to the best combos. We got nothing that interesting. One of the reasons my play has reduced greatly is that I play mostly PvP with friends and unless you go on with a full fireteam you are at a severe disadvantage, so I wait until I see my friends are playing. Unfortunately they are doing the same thing, so none of us ever get on to play. If we had modes of PvP that allowed solo players or smaller parties to still be competative, we would likely still be playing. For general feel of play, just compared to D1, we feel weaker. It is not as satisfying playing a game knowing my character has advanced, but it weaker for it. We got our light back, when do we get back to full strength? That seems like an anti-reward for our hard work defeating the enemies of the Traveller. And lastly, communication... Frankly, you suck at it. In Year 2 we were in this same place withyou promising better communication. Why are we here again? For that matter, why do you have these forums? You rarely respond to people in your own official forums. ‘you are far more likely to respond to Twitter or Reddit posts. This leaves people thinking you do not listen, so they yell louder and louder to get your attention until we are in the place we are now: A toxic community that is boiling with rage. You seem to be willing to make quality of life improvements in game, why not out of game? Why not a larger community engagement team that will respond to people on your official forums? It doesn’t help when Deej, the guy who should be engaging with us,goes on GamerTagTV and says he only takes feedback from popular streamers and leaders of large clans. That tells us we have no voice and that we must petition those people to speak for us. Please talk with us, don’t just issue statements to us.

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        • So I have never used itunes how does one listen to this? And can I do it on the laptop?

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        • The Blog stuck two fingers up to the community in the opening letter. It's all about friends and the new name for casual players (Hobbyist). It was more "We listened but now stfu as we know best and this is what your getting".

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          • Edited by LightEater: 11/30/2017 8:04:48 AM
            I don’t trust Bungie anymore after seeing Destiny 1 gameplay... [url]https://youtu.be/gIp7vZuYzoA[/url]

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          • Definitely moves in the right direction. Hopefully a functional chat system for PC will be added to the list in the future. At the minimum, guild chat so that we don't have to leave the game to actually talk to guild mates...

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          • Easy fix. It is the LOOT, and OVER ALL FEEL OF THE GAME. It’s not meaningful and too balanced that’s it. Make the movement and ttk and damage ratio back to Destiny 1 (I feel like I’m moving in slow mo.) People aren’t complaining about BIG THINGS. It’s the little things. It’s Destiny but, doesn’t feel like Destiny. That’s the issue. CRUICIBLE MOVEMENT AND AIMING LACK OF MEANINGFUL PERKS ON WEAPONS AND GEAR (WHY GRIND FOR THEM?) VAULT SPACE TOKENS ARE SILLY THAT’S IT MAKE A SANDBOX UPDATE NOT THAT DIFFICULT READ THE COMMENTS. (Exotics that reload a portion of my auto rifle aren’t Exotics........) Make it feel like Destiny, again. We’re having technical issues not content issues.

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          • Easy fix. Make the movement and ttk and damage ratio back to Destiny 1 (I feel like I’m moving in slow mo.) People aren’t complaining about BIG THINGS. It’s the little things. It’s Destiny but, doesn’t feel like Destiny. That’s the issue. CRUICIBLE MOVEMENT AND AIMING LACK OF MEANINGFUL PERKS ON WEAPONS AND GEAR (WHY GRIND FOR THEM?) VAULT SPACE TOKENS ARE SILLY THAT’S IT MAKE A SANDBOX UPDATE NOT THAT DIFFICULT READ THE COMMENTS. (Exotics that reload a portion of my auto rifle aren’t Exotics........) Make it feel like Destiny, again. We’re having technical issues not content issues.

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          • Easy fix. Make the movement and ttk and damage ratio back to Destiny 1 (I feel like I’m moving in slow mo.) People aren’t complaining about BIG THINGS. It’s the little things. It’s Destiny but, doesn’t feel like Destiny. That’s the issue. CRUICIBLE MOVEMENT AND AIMING LACK OF MEANINGFUL PERKS ON WEAPONS AND GEAR (WHY GRIND FOR THEM?) VAULT SPACE TOKENS ARE SILLY THAT’S IT MAKE A SANDBOX UPDATE NOT THAT DIFFICULT READ THE COMMENTS. (Exotics that reload a portion of my auto rifle aren’t Exotics........) Make it feel like Destiny, again. We’re having technical issues not content issues.

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          • Easy fix. Make the movement and ttk and damage ratio back to Destiny 1 (I feel like I’m moving in slow mo.) People aren’t complaining about BIG THINGS. It’s the little things. It’s Destiny but, doesn’t feel like Destiny. That’s the issue. CRUICIBLE MOVEMENT AND AIMING LACK OF MEANINGFUL PERKS ON WEAPONS AND GEAR (WHY GRIND FOR THEM?) VAULT SPACE TOKENS ARE SILLY THAT’S IT MAKE A SANDBOX UPDATE NOT THAT DIFFICULT READ THE COMMENTS. (Exotics that reload a portion of my auto rifle aren’t Exotics........) Make it feel like Destiny, again. We’re having technical issues not content issues.

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          • Easy fix. Make the movement and ttk and damage ratio back to Destiny 1 (I feel like I’m moving in slow mo.) People aren’t complaining about BIG THINGS. It’s the little things. It’s Destiny but, doesn’t feel like Destiny. That’s the issue. CRUICIBLE MOVEMENT AND AIMING LACK OF MEANINGFUL PERKS ON WEAPONS AND GEAR (WHY GRIND FOR THEM?) VAULT SPACE TOKENS ARE SILLY THAT’S IT MAKE A SANDBOX UPDATE NOT THAT DIFFICULT READ THE COMMENTS. (Exotics that reload a portion of my auto rifle aren’t Exotics........) Make it feel like Destiny, again. We’re having technical issues not content issues.

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          • I like the part in the Podcast where Noseworthy talks about the code being downloaded to your XBox and Luke had to jump in and say "Or Playstation".

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