Can i just say that before you read the following text that this was not my post but i totally agree with what the original poster said so i have copied and pasted it as it outlines the state of gaming as it stands and just how pathetic fanboys are at defending broken or poor quality games.. This isn't a salty post or a bungie-luv post either. It's a serious question about the mentailty of consumers today. I noticed this division on the forum of people either accepting the product as it is or others calling out the maker for faults that clearly and/or assumingly exist. What's odd is that the "accepters" acknowledge some of the faults, they know there are problems, but not only accept them, they defend them! Even go as far as giving the excuses for the maker of the product. As an active commission only sales person for decades, I would have loved these types of consumers! They never existed though. At least I never came across them. If I ever sold an inferior, faulty, or falsely advertised product I'd either loose the customer, refund, exchange, or something. Look, when an automaker makes a car, they won't advertise the seatbelts. We assume they are with the car. We don't expect to pay extra for them as an add on later. Also, if the previous model had lights, windshield wipers, and wheel, it's assumed those would be on the new car as well. We also assume that after making a previous model or models, the newer version will have advancements and be fine tuned from the previous model. Problems from before would be no issue anymore. If the maker advertised, said, or in some way conveyed the car would get 40 mpg, we'd expect to get at least 40 mpg. If we buy the car and only get 30 mpg, there would be a class action lawsuit and recall (true story). I can't imagine a new car owner saying, "...well the last model was faulty too and it took them three years to get to fixing the several issues my car had. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt again, and this time let them get to the dozen of issues with this newer model over the next three or four years. Maybe the next model will be better! I'll preorder once again." Most normal, logical, sensible people would never give that automaker another look. Seriuosly, I can not imagine that anyone on these forums would accept poor service at a restaurant, lousy customer service at a store, willingly be okay with a faulty mattress purchase, or anything of the sort. I understand this is just a game, but there is still a point here. When did people start becoming so compliant? Just accepteing the slop plopped in front of them? These "accepters" are called "lay downs" in the sales business. Can you imagine the spouses they settled for? The cars they drive? I'm just imagining them sounding like Eeyore with their gloomy, depressed, anhedonic retorts of "that's the way it is." I honestly think it comes down to this. Sometimes we fight with ourselves, and defend ourselves from others, for being so stupid as to fall for the same trick. We don't want to look stupid, so we devoutly defend our decision. The "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me." is a tough pill to swallow Destiny has lied to gamers from day one and yet still gamers try to defend it, its time for real gamers to make a stand and no more pre order titles, it is destroying the games we loved.