If I see any post saying that Year 1 Nightfalls were rewarding I instantly go 🤔 Busting your ass for an hour just to get 2 motes of light or 1 ascendant energy was "rewarding"?? Been a player since Alpha and I agree with a good portion of this post. Y1 may have been fun and interesting but it was just as, if not more tedious and dumb back then. Especially now when players say the game is too grindy.. (Have you really played Y1?) People were crying over having to farm material for the exotic sword quest for God's sake.. Obviously you never spent 4 hours running around on the moon getting helium just so you can upgrade 1 node on your armor.. lol

What bungo killed was the enjoyment of spending 4 or 5 hours playing this game with friends. That is my one memory of Y1, playing in a team!!! All of my raid team has moved on now. Its very sad how the ruined this game with stupid decision making, that always benefited the pvp side of the game.

Bungie wrote the manual on how to make a video game less fun to play over time. Whenever the Developer dictates to the player base on how the game is to be played as opposed to letting the players play the game the way they want you're going to experience a let down. D2 will not be any different because the same individuals that slowly and methodically removed the FUN from Destiny are still employed at Bungie. Best gun mechanics in any FPS I've played which is the one saving grace when you weigh the good versus the bad. You can't fix stupid. Stupid sometimes learns. Most often change must occur before improvement happens. Let's all hope Activision cleans house sooner than later and assumes immediate control of the Destiny franchise. The current Sandbox and Dev. Teams have all failed to make Destiny anything but a mediocre title at best.

Thanks for highlighting my post. The fact that so many other players are in agreement does give credit to what I said. I expected people to say I was wrong etc, however we are entitled to our opinions. Maybe these are the people who forget that the game was never sold as being a pvp game. They clearly told us it was a pve game, with optional pvp. We also were told that a day one weapon would be relevant to whatever direction the game took. They aggravated people by completely doing a u turn on this, leaving many stuck at 170. If people feel it necessary to repost what I said, this to me just gives further evidence we agree. It's then funny to note that people said my observations of Y1 is the result of rosetinting, and I was wrong. I'm that wrong, that they are making raids relevant again, bringing back older weapons. They also have made AR better again, after the pvp nerds rendered them useless. It is also funny that people are assuming I'm wholly praising year 1, when I simply listed, in time order, things that I remembered from the top of my head. All of the points I made, weren't borne from negativity. They actually happened. So if you choose to focus on one aspect of my comments, rather than the whole post, you'll fail to see I simply pointed out what was done incorrectly, or things that were done that resulted in a poor experience. I am sure a lot of people are happy with the game how it is now, I merely gave my opinion on things that actually happened in the game, that left many of us disappointed.

If Bungie keeps doing dumb things like excessive, unhelpful nerfs or taking content away from us only to give it back and make us grind for it again, I'm not too optimistic about D2.

[quote]"There wasn't a singular thing that ruined the original Destiny experience. It was a culmination of multiple errors.[/quote] Correct. But people forget that many of those errors were at the community's behest. [quote]You had a nightfall that when you were launching in, you were a tad nervous. Because you knew you could spend an hour or so trying, just to lose it all very fast, and be booted to orbit. The sense of achievement when you completed it was excellent. The rewards were good too.[/quote] The post game rewards weren't any better than now. How many times did people get Sharded? How many times did people get a few motes? Your chance at an exotic wasn't any better than now. Granted, the extrinsic rewards were worth it - the blue flame and the XP bonus. But don't forget - you [i][b]needed[/b][/i] the XP to help level up, and if you didn't do NF as early as possible, you missed out on all that bonus XP. Don't forget how bad it sucked spending all that time leveling up gear only to find out it sucked. RTO and 3X damage did make it more intense, can't deny that. [quote]You would run the raid, and be ecstatic to receive the VOC. Then, you do Atheon over, and over, and eventually, the Vex Mythoclast dropped. And the grind just is SO worth it. You'd relive the moment with destiny pals when they saw you had it.[/quote] Raids were the focus and pretty much the only place to get good weapons. Vendors were useless once you hit Max light. Lost count of how many times someone did an entire raid and got nothing but mats, not even a Chatterwhite. It rains loot now. Which, IMO, is a bit much. Somewhere in the middle is the sweet spot. KF probably had the best drop rates. The only problem with that was getting something with higher light. That part sucked. [quote]Year 1 felt relevant. There was an end game gun we chased. We felt rewarded.[/quote] Many people felt shit on for reasons above. Don't forget those times when you [i]finally[/i] got a Legendary engram to drop you were so excited, only to have Rahool -blam!- you in the ass with 2 blues or some shards. It was so rewarding having 10 bounties to choose from, yet only being able to carry 5 and having to run to the Tower to turn them in. [quote]We saw parts of the cosmodrome that were locked away. DLC. But already on the disc.[/quote] This tripe has been debunked countless times. I wish you people would do your own research on how games are developed these days [i]and [/i]how TDB was created [i]alongside[/i] Frankenstein Vanilla. You also seem to forget the massive downloads prior to each expansion. What do you think was in each D/L? [quote]Then year 2 arrived. And it started to feel like the best parts of the game were slowly being removed. We were told by Bungie that we were playing the game wrong. They had perks on guns, and when we used them effectively, all within the realms of the game, we were told we were using them wrong.[/quote] Blame the community. People bitched and moaned about perks like Final Round and Kneepads. Reforge only exacerbated the problem. [quote]Then we started to feel the affects of nerfing. Guns which we had worked so hard to get, became useless. The variety of weapons available was still big, but nerfs forced players to use very few. auto rifles started to fade, our game was being directed by the requests of the supplementary PvP aspect of the game.[/quote] Nerfs would've happened regardless. Sure, many of them were head scratchers, but keeping the Y1 format wouldn't have kept nerfs from happening. [quote]Updates came that meant previous content we paid for, was made useless. Game modes that are supposed to encourage team work in pve were forgotten. You aren't allowed raid matchmaking but, we shall matchmake you a pvp session with 11 people from all over the world resulting in a terrible experience.[/quote] How much of a difference would it have to Y1 players if VoG and Crota were brought forward in Y2? When PoE came around, people were already tired of doing them. They'd been done 100x over. By October you'd stopped doing them completely if you had everything. "Oh but I would have for the chance of exotics!" Really? 3oC would've changed your mind on that. Much more efficient farming routes. [quote]We won't matchmake nightfall, because you might get someone who is bad. That's better than no matchmaking right.[/quote] Why this isn't a thing I can't tell you. Yes, the content has been dumbed down, so there's no reason to hold back OMM. [quote]Then, we got told previous gen was holding back vault space.[/quote] I Google'd this and had a satisfactory answer in about 5 min. Do some research and you'll have insight as to why RoI couldn't bring more. [spoiler]just because hardware has 8gbs of RAM, doesn't mean software can use it all...[/spoiler] [quote]Trials further toxicated the game. Bungie based game updates on trials. YouTube streamers. The community was ignored. The game grew towards trials, bungie pandered to this, pve got a few more stabs in the back. Lag switching. Bungie didn't seem fussed.[/quote] Agree here. I get that Trials was introduced as an outlet for Top PvP players. But when interest in the mode grew, Bungie should've altered the format to accommodate the new interest. Now, new people play it for a week and GTFO. [quote]We became iron Lords, and we were happy for a bit. That mountaintop. That raid. But it fizzled. More nerfs. Friends list didn't show Destiny as much.[/quote] Don't forget the part where RoI outsold Vanilla in digital sales for launch month and grossed $60 million dollars. [quote]The last gen vault space limitations seemed a lie. It didn't increase when last gen wasn't included.[/quote] Again, a 5 min search... [quote]Then Age of Triumph. Bungie thank us for participating in a 3 year beta, and begrudgingly make year 1 relevant again with some new year 2, but on their terms.[/quote] What did you expect? Bungie created a looter/shooter. People wanted more MMO aspects, more RPG aspects, more this, less that. One of the vid docs from before launch had a dev stating "one of the challenges of making this game was having enough content to people engaged for 50-100 hrs, or 30 min to an hour a day..." So they create a game tuned to 50-100 hrs, and people want more. Rome wasn't built in a day. [quote]Oh you want elemental fatebringer? Thats fine, but it'll take an exotic slot instead.[/quote] That's Bungie listening to the community. Go back and read any thread about elemental primaries and you'll see all the people that suggested and claimed would be happy if exotics were elemental. [quote]If Destiny 2 can avoid the blindingly obvious mistakes that happened over the last 3 years, they could have a fantastic game in the making."[/quote] Sometimes there's only so much you can do with old/reused/recycled material. D1 is that result. Ever watch that show with Jesse James where he and his team are challenged to turn a car into something else with budget of $2000 and a week to do it? It's challenging, and results often varied. Imagine if he had 3 months to do it $100,000. How much better would the results be? I agree with some of your statements, disagree with many. Some of your points are nostalgia, rose colored glasses, or just flat out wrong information. Yeah, Y1 had some pros, but it also had cons. Y2+ has had cons, but also alot of pros. Many of the changes were for the better, and many were sparked by the community that Bungie doesn't listen to. If you don't the direction this game has taken, well, this is what happens a dev lets the community drive major changes instead of standing firm in their vision. But they'd caved because this community doesn't understand that sometimes it's ok for a business to tell it's customers "No. We're not doing that." Because this community gets off on forever putting Bungie in no-win situations. And this community doesn't understand that this game has attracted the attention of multiple genres of players - RPGers, MMOs, Shooters, PvPers, Casuals, etc - and no change is going to be universally liked. Deal with it.

PvP does not belong in Destiny.

All I know is that my destiny friends went from several pages online - every day- to maybe a half dozen or so a few weeks into the original trials of Osiris.

Bungie used to know how to build a great game. I don't understand how they went so wrong with Destiny. Honestly, I think if they added a forge mode and custom playlists (not just private matchmaking), we could see a positive impact on the game. It's all a big numbers game and Bungie honestly doesn't know which baskets to put their eggs. Back in the Halo days, players had much more control of the game. Custom playlists for days. And the best of them? They became Halo standard. Zombies? Made by fans and became an official game type. Shotty snipers? Same thing. Hell, even grifball started from a fan that watched RvB. And let's not mention the mountain of forge maps that ended up being redone and added into map rotation. Now, players have ZERO power over the content, and this results in Bungie having all the power. Thier reputation stemmed from how they interacted with the players, and that reputation is becoming more tarnished as they release more DLC. Players helped point Bungie in the right direction, but players can't do this anymore. All we seem to do now is whine and complain. That power to influence the game from the ground up is gone, and there's nothing players can do unless Bungie makes it possible for us. Guess we can hope for something that accomplishes this in Destiny 2. But even that is just wishful thinking.

Whiners killed this game. Like week one of release, loot cave and whiners would just sit in the spawn areas on their sparrows. The game is about enjoyment and not being told how to play it. Making year one weapons obsolete and then there was ghally, didn't see or here about its update for months. Now there is Truth, nerfed down so bad you don't want to waste an exotic slot. Over all I still feel this game is like crack, can't get enough of it but saying it can be a lot better.