Hey, you're that guy who posted that bullshit wall of text where the guy couldn't do addition and had a lot of factual errors. Why am I not surprised to see you here?

He had very little error. He admitted to doing some math wrong, but other then that, he was spot on. Don't accuse others of errors when you haven't even provide any counter evidence. That makes you look uneducated.

Stop trying to present information you know is outdated and inaccurate and use it as the basis for an argument. It's intellectually dishonest and makes you look unethical. If you aren't willing to actually engage the opposition on the merits of your own argument, instead choosing to regurgitate the work of others, it makes you look like a fool.

What are you talking about? Seriously. What in the 9th hell are you talking about? You have yet to provide any evidence as to why this is incorrect, non the less: [quote]Outdated[/quote] Please enlighten me. Why is this factually incorrect? Go. Please provide evidence of your records like: https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/202754298/0/0/1 Scroll down to the comment.

Okay, so you already have been enlightened to the factual inaccuracies of the information you continue to post. The OP drones on about how he personally tested and then compared, and argues based on the values. So during such testing firebolt grenades yielded a range of 3m. Googling this from the shitter at work: http://www.destinygamewiki.com/wiki/Firebolt_Grenade whoa look at that, 8 meters of range. Totally not inferior to incendiary grenades, but let's not actually include accurate values in our presentation. There is no documentation of the methods used to test. His comparison is based on the assumption that Viking funeral is not being used either. If we're going to argue it's underpowered, why not include values for maximum potential on both ends of comparisons? Other than being a pretentious and biased dick, of course. Here's those values that I didn't have to pretend to test for, by the way https://m.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/3421y9/sga_use_firebolt_viking_funeral_mida_or_same/ [quote]A firebolt + viking funeral does 167 damage (97 damage + 10 ticks of 7) [/quote] This is just the shit I'm doing on the fly from work. Going around the internet like an intellectual presenting false arguments is horseshit. Get your head out of your ass. You can say firebolt grenades aren't overpowered, but don't give me a diatribe about how titans have it amazingly presenting this dogshit as gospel.

Yup. You obviously didn't read my original post. Of course we are arguing that Viking Funeral isn't used to balance out the class skill trees. That's where you are flawed. The guys whos post I copied did his own handtest testing for every scenario. Of course you don't even believe your own sources, on the other hand. Read my post again, top from bottom, then respond. Damn son, don't you have work to be at? I got lunch break LMFAO.

I read your original post. The entire thing consisted of a quote, indicating none of it was your thought and credited to the original poster, Mr moth. But if you really want me to read it as yours, then I can recommend to you directly that you further or actually complete your education before you start spouting psuedo-intellectual garbage all over the forums. [quote]Of course we are arguing that Viking Funeral isn't used to balance out the class skill trees. That's where you are flawed.[/quote] Then why are you factoring in things like aftershocks and melting point? I understand having consistency in your argument is detrimental, but [quote]The guys whos post I copied did his own handtest testing for every scenario. Of course you don't even believe your own sources, on the other hand. Read my post again, top from bottom, then respond.[/quote] When the entirety of your argument boils down to, "your stuff is better because the numbers are higher" but the numbers are wrong, your argument isn't valid. It's not specific points or semantics, your argument isn't worth anything. [quote]Damn son, don't you have work to be at? I got lunch break LMFAO.[/quote] Ad hominem, but based on the rest of this, you don't know what that is so I'll let you google it.

You're a man? At least I think that's what it says. Latin Teacher? Probably cause you're still in Highscool. Anyways. I did the handtest testing by Moth. Everything stated was true EXCEPT for the Vikiking funeral. You are seriously disagreeing with fact other then that mistake he owned up to. Sorry, but if you are at work, test it when you get home. I check notifications during class changes at my college.

[quote]ad ho·mi·nem ˌad ˈhämənəm/ adverb & adjective 1. (of an argument or reaction) directed against a person rather than the position they are maintaining. "vicious ad hominem attacks"[/quote] Are you using askjeeves? Mother-blam!-er, this was before the first result in Google. Google knew how stupid people can be, so they didn't even leave you to bother opening a link. They put that shit right in front of you but you went and ignored it. Bless you and your poor academic advisor. Do me a favor, while your doing course request go ahead and sign up for Freshmen English. They usually have debates incorporated into the curriculum. That way you'll be able to form cohesive thought and won't gunk up the world with your spouting from your underdeveloped frontal lobe.

Hmm... This is weird: https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/202787804/0/0 I've done my part here. My point being that Titans aren't over powered. The point is that you better check your own class before go on accusing others. Also, think about what you're saying. The original poster IS A TITAN. He's justifying whats right.

Heres the original post. Them likes tho: https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/202677981/0/0 First thing you need is support. I got it all.

Again, move down the line. But you'll have a lot of lovely reminders that you can edit posts, so at least you learned that.

https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/202497998/0/0/1

Latin, literally ‘to the person.’ -Wikipedia

Oh, my bad. I guess you didn't know you litterally copied Latin letter from letter. Idiot. Anywho. My tests remain correct. Tell me, do you have any support and or likes on your comments? My original has a ton of support with Moth.

Are you an ESL individual, you know english as a second language? It seems like you have trouble understanding the words on the page. I'll copy the rest for you: [quote]short for argumentum ad hominem, is a logical fallacy in which an argument is rebutted by attacking the character, motive, or other attribute of the person making the argument, or persons associated with the argument, rather than attacking the substance of the argument itself.[/quote] Also, consensus does not equal validity, idiots shouting in an echo chamber hear a lot of the same ideas. If your tests went well please share video or screenshots. Which should be easy given modern consoles built in capabilities. Otherwise I'll continue to assume you are full of it.

The second nerf is coming, sorry

Nope: [quote]DEAR GOD QUIT IT WITH THE COMPLAINING ABOUT THE DOT I have an amazing quest for you, Something no titan has ever done. Equip Sunbreaker and punch an enemy, Swap to Sunsinger and Equip touch of flame and Viking funeral, hit someone with a firebolt grenade and Scorch (The melee), Watch All Damage numbers. Compare them Sunbreaker: 104 + 12 ticks of 7 (12x7) for a total of 188 damage (More than Possible for all other melees) Sunsinger: Firebolt: 86 + 6 ticks of 7 (6x7) for a total of 128 (Slightly above melee) Scorch: 122 + 6 ticks of 7 (6x7) for a total of 164 Now I can probably guess what you are thinking "See? We are weaker, -blam!-in dumbass". Let me point out a step I said earlier; "Equip touch of flame and Viking funeral" Viking funeral improves DOT correct? Now let me compare the DOT of both classes. Sunbreaker: 12 Ticks of 7 (12x7) Sunsinger: 6 ticks of 7 (6x7) Wait. . . . . . . But warlocks need a perk to do this. . . . but you get it regardless. We also need 2 perks for our grenade to get a slight improvment over other grenades. . . Where's the proof you say? let's take the number from up top for the Firebolt grenade Firebolt: 86 + 6 x 7 = 128 ,Now lets compare other TITAN grenades (the ones Titans say are stupid) [u]Sunbreaker grenades[/u] Fusion: 167+ 80 stick damage = 247 damage total, Kills a full health guardian. 247>128, Firebolt weaker Incendiary: ~170(range from target)+ 5 ticks of 7 (5 x 7) = ~205, ~205 > 128, Firebolt weaker Thermite grenade: 4 ticks of 47 (4x47) = 188, can't kill. 188 > 128, Firebolt [u]Technically[/u] weaker [u]Striker grenades[/u] Flashbang grenade: ~170 (Range from target), Can't kill, 167~197 > 128, Firebolt weaker Lightning grenade: 3 ticks of 122 (3x122,4x122 with aftershocks) = 366, 366 > 128, Firebolt weaker Pulse grenade: 4 ticks of 61 (4x61) = 244, 244 > 128, Firebolt [u]Technically[/u] weaker [u]Defender Grenades[/u] Suppressor grenade: ~170 (Range from target), ~170 > 128, Firebolt weaker Spike grenade: 17 ticks of ~20(Range from target) 20 x 17 = 340, 340 > 128, Firebolt weaker Magenetic grenade: 122 + 79 stick + 80 secondary blast = 281, 281 > 128, Firebolt weaker After all that, keep in mind that the Firebolt grenade NEEDED 2 perks to do that damage, and in every case, Firebolt came out on the Bottom, Only exceptions are the Pulse grenade and the Thermite grenade, of which are only weaker because once they are thrown they rarely get more than 1 tick of damage in. I have not even gone into detail over the fact that Thermal vent on Sunbreaker can OHK low armor guardians (Takes 5 seconds, but still a OHK) which can then give you an Overshield (Flame shield anyone?) TL:DR If you are bitching about how weak Sunbreaker is, quit it, Try out Sunsinger and come back (Before you B**** about the other Sunsinger grenades, you get one and the other can't kill) Edit 1: Some people pointed out range saying Firebolt is clearly stronger, I also tested range, but it had the same results with Firebolt always having less range. Will add it anyway [u]Grenade Range Comparison[/u] Firebolt: 3M, Blocked by cover, Can't tag through cover [u]Sunbreaker grenade ranges[/u] Fusion: 1M, 1M < 3M, Firebolt [u]Technically[/u] stronger (Tracking and Insta-kill for fusion) Thermite: 7M single line, 7M > 3M, Firebolt [u]Technically[/u] weaker Incendiary: 10M Blast, 4M kill radius, 10M > 3M, Firebolt weaker, 4M > 3M, firebolt weaker [u]Defender grenade ranges[/u] Suppressor: 10M Blast, 10M > 3M, Firebolt weaker Spike grenade: 10M Cone, 10 > 3M, Firebolt weaker (10M at Radius of Base, Combine with slant and height for actual Volume, Height is ~13M, had a tough time testing) Magnetic grenade: 1M blast radius + 4M secondary blast, 1M < 3M, 4M > 3M, Firebolt [u]Technically[/u] stronger [u]Striker grenades[/u] Flashbang Grenade: 10M, 10M > 3M, Firebolt weaker Lightning grenade: 10M Cone radius, ~13M Cone height (Tough testing) 10M > 3M, Firebolt weaker Pulse grenade: 5M Vortex Radius, Damage not stopped by cover, 5M > 3M, Firebolt weaker (as a metric I used the titan punch, Which is Roughly 1M) Last but not least, The DOT lasts the same amount of Time for the Sunstrike,Incendiary and Burn + Viking funeral. They are all the same, Sunstrike has a much faster tick speed than Viking funeral. If I am wrong about it and Viking funeral lasts longer, Remember It takes 2 perks for it. Edit 2: I would like to Thank RollThisScooby for Correcting me, Magnetic Grenades are survivable with a Max armor titan or Max armor warlock with the ram If they sprint at top speed Before the second detonation. Any amount of damage kills them as they are left with 1 Health Also did a Double check on my Damage numbers and found That the addition was wrong with a few, but Total damage was correct, E.g I said Magnetic grenades did 61 extra if they stick and 140 with their regular blast, True damage is 79 if they stick and 122 regular explosion. End result is still 201 + 80 secondary explosion Edit 3: A few people have Praised me for Protecting my warlock brethren and Some others accuse me of being a -blam!- warlock who just wants to defend his class. I Play all 3, In fact if you look at my guardians you might Notice My titan has the highest Light and play time of all 3. Again Not saying Titans need a Nerf. I think defenders need a buff. What i am trying to point out is if you complain about firebolts and Viking funeral, you may want to check your own class first.[/quote]