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Edited by JSeery720:
2/11/2016 10:49:22 PM
38
Oryx was weak?
My theory is that the Oryx that we fight in the King's Fall raid is a weakened oryx. This is due to the complete cutoff of tribute from Crota and his entire court.
In the Books of Sorrow, it is said that killing is used to feed the worm within each hive spawn. These worms are what give the hive immortality, so if they are not fed, the worms instead feed on the souls of their hive. It is also said that each hive must tithe their excess killing to their superiors in order to help them feed their worm.
In the 50th calcified fragment, oryx states that he depends greatly on his tribute, and if the tribute were to go away, his worm would feed on him, making him weaker. Our killing Crota would result in a massive amount of tribute being lost, because all of the tithing done by the hive in our system would not go to him
In the grimoire card about Oryx, Oryx says he feels his son's absence like a hole in his stomach, because that's literally what it is: a hole in his stomach. His worm isnt being fed enough so it is eating oryx. Oryx doesn't come to our system to avenge his son, he clearly thinks that anything killed in their own throne world deserved their death, oryx is here to make up for lost tribute.
So oryx is being eaten by his worm, and even more so as you approach him, having killed his entire ascendant court. He is dying before you get to him, and so there is no way he was fighting at full capacity when he was defeated. The implications of this are as such: were a different hive ascendant, say xivu arath or savathun to come to our system, they would be much stronger than oryx was at the time, because we haven't killed any of their court. Frankly that seems like something fun to look forward to, right? :)
Edit: It was brought to my attention that since guardians have killed thousands of things, we have obtained the sword logic from them as well. This definitely played a factor in how we destroyed oryx and his court, given that their entire society revolves around the sword logic. [i][u]Credit to [url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Profile/254/4984753]Saint 14[/url] for enlightening me on this.[/u][/i]
If you have any issues with what i have said here, please comment down below. Any comments or criticism is greatly appreciated!
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14 RepliesBig question though... how does gender play a part in the hive? Oryx was Aurash(called her) and the Auryx(king) and Oryx(king)... Quite confused because Xi Ro and Sarathun never are referred to as males even after they are given worms.
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Nah man its agree 100 % , I wouldn't be surprised.
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Spot on
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7 RepliesEdited by Lunafox: 2/11/2016 10:28:55 PMBump for later. (No more than one).
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3 RepliesWhen it comes to the actual encounter, I fell like Oryx isn't week but the encounter is simple compared to other raid encounters.
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1 ReplySo you just realized what the entire mission was? That's why Eris has us kill Crota and weaken Oryx's court...I mean, literally the point of it was to weaken Oryx.
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2 RepliesAnything to do with the hive is not fun or to look forward to. I've had enough of the damn hive
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19 RepliesYou're absolutely right that oryx was in a weakened state but our ability to beat him goes far beyond that. Oryx's Throne World is ruled by pure sword logic, so not only has every single Hive we've ever killed caused his tithe to diminish but it made ourselves stronger by Oryx's own rules. Due to all the members of his court and other ascendant hive we've killed by the time we reach Oryx he is not only the weakest he's been since becoming Oryx, we are by definition the 6 most powerful guardians to ever exist. Even then, with oryx at his weakest and us at our strongest we still aren't able to beat him. He's so stupidly powerful that even after all that it requires Toland pulling strings in the Hive netherworlds to even give us a chance. But even after denying his tithe, empowering ourselves through sword logic, and with Toland helping us, we still aren't strong enough to disprove the fundamental idea on which Oryx's life depends: that he is by definitions the most powerful entity to ever exist. The only reason he dies is because we're able to deny him and his worm sustenance long enough in his weakened state and fight hard enough, not to disprove his strength, but to prevent him from proving it, causing his own worm to consume him.
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Yea. I think so
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4 RepliesSomething with that doesnt make since. Oryx has to be known through out the solar system and farther. He most likely has millions of planets under his control or infulence. Crota helped him yes, but was it enough to actually make him weaker? Im not sure
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2 RepliesYes, it's practically the same thing we did to Crota. Their greatest strength, numerous members who pay tribute and fight for them, is their greatest weakness. Taking out the Fist, Might, Eyes, Will, etc of Crota is the only reason we're able to contend with him. This also directly affected Oryx, and we only made it worse by fighting his Court. Savathûn has her High Coven, which shouldn't be too too difficult depending, but it's really Xivu Arath we should worry about. Her equivalent to a Court or Coven is armies, not just a couple strong entities who know how to fight, armies.
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you pretty much nailed it. Even if we didn't blow up a couple century's (probably more) worth of light in his face he could still be taken down relatively easily with bullets and 6 guardians
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2 RepliesThis is exactly what was said in the destiny ghost stories books of sorrow part two podcast a while ago
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5 RepliesWhat about the oryx we killed in the story mission? How many oryx's are there?
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2 RepliesThat's why its easy to kick his ass
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1 ReplyNot really in to all the Destiny lore. This is really good though. Well thought out and a very plausible explanation.
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2 RepliesEdited by Valvatorez: 2/12/2016 2:08:47 AMGreath theory. But since next big thing will be vex we cant know for sure. We're going to alter time dimensions to get Mara (a theory). Uldren will come to us soon. Mark my words EDIT: The books of sorrow is truly a fascinating read. People who haven't read it i highly suggest you do.
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2 RepliesYeah well, Saturns atmosphere took care of him, I would assume.
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1 ReplyEdited by lil dUb wiezy: 2/11/2016 5:34:03 PMin the book of sorrows oryx travels to her sisters home moon and kills the other for there power they remain in her mind and manifest themselves into forms from time ro time so we shouldnt see them again unless they just change story like with the traveler in ttk (he was weakend and dying not dead, then the start of ttk the first thing ghost says is the traveler dead...) that being said everything else you said was awesome
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1 ReplyCrota wasn't giving any tithes to oryx because his soul was trapped the whole time, he came for revenge he was getting weaker when we started killing the bosses during the raid though, and oryx was the strongest of his siblings
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4 RepliesWell me and my friends were having a beer when we beat him, i guess we wern't fighting him at our full strength too.
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2 RepliesEdited by remige: 2/12/2016 1:04:17 AMWell, that and the fact that we're 286 light levels higher than we were when we defeated Crota. Seems legit to me.
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10,000 Glimmer awarded to you
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18 RepliesHere's my thought (based on thoughts from others), there seems to be a link between the worms and ahamkara. Notice when Oryx dies, he crystallizes. I think that when a worm is strong enough and its host dies, the host becomes a "cacoon" and later an ahamkara will emerge (hence all the moths in the dreadnaught, like a for shadowing). Now, with all the power that Oryx received before his death, I'm hoping that a future battle will revolve around Oryx's worm as a super powered ahamkara. But not too soon. I wanna get back to more vex lore or have some of the fallen join us.
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That's not quite how it was explained. He doesn't necessarily always need to keep killing. Oryx specifically can't stop journeying to understand and snuff out the Light. The worms fed on him when we finally killed him. He wasn't weak when we fought him. He's just not omnipotent. Six powerful Guardians who made to far enough to fight Oryx would probably be strong enough to take him out. Guardians are actually pretty strong, especially when prepared. The Oryx we do fight is after revenge. He did love Crota, and if Crota died, he must've deserved it right? But Oryx wavered on that belief system The Hive only thought like that because of the Worm gods. The Hive are not even really free.
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This is great
