There are constantly hints that Humans are in fact decendents of the Forerunners. Spark even says it. However, we must consider what company made these games. Bungie has a habbit of leading you to believe one thing and then shoot you in a completely different direction. The fact that Spark says Humans are Forerunner should be proof enough that Humans are Precursors. If Humans were direct decendents of the Forerunners then Spark would have most likely identified them as such and called them his masters and obeyed their commands. Instead Humans are called Reclaimers.
When you think about this it does make sense that Humans are Precursors. The argument that the Forerunners copied Precursor tech in the same way the Covenant copied Forerunner tech is plausible and has merit. The Forerunners, at the end of their war with the Flood, talked about how they failed the Mantle that was passed to them. They talk about how it was their responsibility to protect the inhabitants of the galaxy and that is their Mantle.
The fact that this Mantle was passed to them supports the existence of Precursors. As many theories suggest, the Precursors were the ultimate soceity in the universe. They reached the highest level of advancement possible. The Precursors had many worlds in many galaxies. It is also believed that the Flood came to Humanities galaxy from another galaxy. This also supports the theory that Precursors did exist. If the flood did in fact come from another galaxy then the statement made by the gravemind, "Child of my enemy, why have you come? I offer no forgiveness of fathers sins, passed to his son." if I got that right, has even deeper meaning then we thought.
If the Precursors did exist then they would have undoubtedly fought the Flood, and I personaly believe they created the Flood. The Flood would be the balancing force to the Precursors, their exact opposite. Perhaps the sins that the gravemind is refering to is in fact the Flood. The Precursors tried to play God and ended up creating the Flood. The Flood is bascally unstopable. The Forerunners couldn't stop them without killing all sentient life in the Galaxy. The Precursors most definetly fought the Flood and perhaps after seeing their creation cause massive destruction and chaos then they might have decided that their time at the top was over and they went on a Great Journey.
The theory that the Great Journey the Covenant talk about is in fact a real thing that the Precursors went on after being almost wiped out by the Flood is plausible. After seeing their own creation do so much damge they left on their journey and put lesser races in charge of the galaxies they once ruled. The Forerunners could have been one of those races that was put in charges of protecting their galaxy. It is not that big of a leap to conclude that the Flood was perhaps limited to one galaxy when the Precursors left and the Precursors left some of their tech to lesser species in galaxies near the Flood controled galaxy so that those galaxies had a chance of defending themsleves against the Flood. The Forerunners talk about a Mantle that was passed onto them and perhaps the Mantle was passed to the Forerunners by the Precursors. The Precursors put our galaxy under the protection of the Forerunners.
If the Forerunners knew about the Precursors then they would have known about their abilities and tech and what they looked like. Several theories say that Humans are a species created by the Precursors in their image as a perfect species. The Forerunners often call Humanity a treasure that they discovered near the end of their war with the Flood. If Humans were direct decendents of the Forerunners then why would we be a treasure? If we are a treasure then it gives support to the theory that Humans were created by the Precursors or their decendents. Humans could have been created as the Precursors final act before they left. Perhaps they saw creating Humans as a way of balancing the creation of the Flood.
The fact that Spark (EDIT: and all other Forerunner AIs) Identify Humans as Reclaimers does support the theory that Humans are either created by or are decendents of the Precursors. The Precursors might have set in place plans to have Humans Reclaim the thrown they once had when they were know by a different name, Precursors. Many say that because we can use Forerunner tech we are decendents of the Forerunners. Would it not be a big stretch to conclude that once the Forerunners activated the Halo Rings they planned on following in the Precursors footsteps and leave the galaxy and go on their own Great Journey. There are several hints that the Forerunners no longer saw themselves as fit to protect the galaxy and that they wanted to leave the galaxy and let the individual species in the galaxy rule themselves. The Forerunners felt that one species ruling the whole galaxy weakend the galaxy and left it open to attack by the Flood.
The Forerunners had many shield worlds and the ark. These instalations were designed to protect the Forerunners and all sentient life from being completely destroyed by the Flood and the Halo Rings. Would the Forerunners have activeated the Rings while they were still exposed to their effects? No, and a terminal entry suggests that the Forerunners were already in their shield worlds before they activated the rings and someone had to be sent to activate the rings. The Forerunnes knew well in advance that they were going to activate the rings. So if the Forerunners survived the activation of the Rings then where are they? Like previously stated, would it be a big leap to say that they went on their own Great Journey?
There is no doubt that the Forerunners survived their war with the Flood. After the Rings were activated the Forerunners repopulated the galaxy and, as many theories have stated, set in place plans for the Humans to Reclaim what was once theirs. If the Forerunners believed that the Humans were decendents of the Precursors or were created by the Precursors as a perfect species made in their image and the Forerunners wanted to see the Precursors return to power then it is not that difficult to conclude that they set all of their technology so that only Humans could use it. This accounts for Humans being the only species that can use Forerunner technolgy.
Many say that because Spark says we are Forerunner that there is no way we are Precursors. Yes he says it but as we have seen, Spark's comments and actions were under review and were not to be trusted. It is almost as though they think Spark might be Rampant. I think that it is obvious Spark is Rampant when he tries to kill MC in Halo CE. Spark never tells MC how the rings work and tries to kill him when he refuses to activate the rings. I doubt the Forerunners would have set their technology to be able kill the Humans. The exception is of course the sentinels at Onyx. They kill Humans but that is the fault of those who encounter the sentinels. They deny that they are Reclaimers and the sentinels see them as a threat.
Spark is Rampant so we cannot trust what he says. The Forerunners left all their technology to the Humans. If Humans are not direct decendents of the Forerunners then why are we called reclaimers? Perhaps because we are either decendents of the Precursors who once ruled the universe or we are the last creation of the Precursors and we were made in their image as a perfect species. This answers the question of what we a reclaiming. We are to retake our place as the dominant species. The Precursors made humans as the answer to the Flood. Look at it this way. The Flood and Humanity are both, in a way, children of the Precursors. One is evil and artificialy created with its evolution accelerated and made with all the technology the Precursors had. The other was made as a normal species with no enhancements or accelerated evolution. The Precursors made humans and laid plans for them to one day defeat the Flood throughout the Universe or in its home Galaxy.
If I am right and the flood were confined to one galaxy when the Precursors left on their Journey and the Flood came from a neighboring galxy, then it would seem that the Flood is trying to find its old enemy. The Flood most likely came to our galaxy looking for the Precursors and then the Forerunners tried to stop it but failed. It is obvious the Flood doesn't see Humanity as a threat, but it also knows Humanities' origin. The Flood believes itself to be unstoppable. This is clearly evident when the Gravemind is speaking on the last level of Halo 3. It comments on how it beat fleets of thousands and consumed a galxy of flesh and bone. I believe it is refering to the Floods home galaxy. The flood had not consumed the entire Milky Way galaxy because the Forerunners stopped it using the Halo Rings.
I believe the truth of the Gravemind's statement about beating fleets of thousands and consuming a galaxy of flesh and bone is that the galaxy the gravemind is refering to is not only the Flood's home galaxy but the Precursor's home galaxy as well. The two are in fact the same. The flood were created by the Precursors and they took over the Precursors home galaxy. After the Precursor lost their home galaxy they left on their Great Journey. I think Humans are called Reclaimers not only because we are going to Reclaim all the technology and knowledge of the Precursors, but we are ment to Reclaim the Precursors home galaxy and destroy the Flood completely. The Precursors failed and were beaten by the Flood so they planted a seed on Earth and made a species with all their qualities and none of their weaknesses so that one day the species they created could undo their terrible mistake and rid the universe of the Flood once and for all.
EDIT: Most of this comes from Wolverfrog's thread, but because I had so much to say I made my own topic so that all of this would not be lost in pages of comments.
[Edited on 09.30.2009 4:46 PM PDT]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] xNACHOVEZx i don't think precursors have anything to do with humans. humans aren't descendants of the forerunners. they have similar DNA, but that's about it. the forerunners chose humanity as the heir to them while they took them and all other tier 7 civilizations to the ark while the halos activated to kill off the flood.[/quote] Even that info is not completely certain. We don't know for sure if we are decendants of the Forerunners or not.
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I agree that there is a lot we don't know, but my theory comes from reading the transcripts of the terminals. There is a lot more info in the terminals then most realize. If you read the text and really consider what is said in them, my theory makes sense, and although it is thin, it is just as solid as saying we are Forerunners. However, I think the proof that we are not Forerunners is in the terminals. The Librarian talks about a species he/she discovered and how he/she built a portal to the Ark on the same planet as that species. The Librarian also talks of how special this species is. The species he/she is refering to is Humanity.
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@Assault I've read your theory and it has some very nice ideas. But it doesn't have any substance/evidence/fact that makes me think "This sounds very plausible". Probably, assume and if are bad words to use in a theory if you want it taken seriously, the theory suddenly becomes conjecture and speculation. My point about what Forerunners are is that we don't know enough. And if we don't know much about Forerunner we know almost nothing at all about Precursors. You could say Elites are descendants of Precursors, but again theres just no evidence.
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i don't think precursors have anything to do with humans. humans aren't descendants of the forerunners. they have similar DNA, but that's about it. the forerunners chose humanity as the heir to them while they took them and all other tier 7 civilizations to the ark while the halos activated to kill off the flood.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] flamedude [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] TheHollowDeity I dont think the AI are mistaken when calling us Reclaimers. Also, Im not totally convinced that the forerunners are an organic race. There is not a single clue to them being organic. Suppose you are right that the Precursors created the flood. When they decided to return to cave people, or leave it to the humans. Wouldnt they create something to insure that it all ends up in the hands of the humans? In come the Forerunners. A creation of the Precursors made to do its best in eliminating the flood. Once its mission is complete, or complete as possible, it vanishes leaving everything to the humans. Everything you say can be fit into this theory! Think about it for a minute.[/quote] There is nothing that explains what Forerunner even means right now. Are they a single species? Are they multiple species (like The Covenant)? Are they a mixture of organic and machine races (like The Culture)? Multiple AI's call humans Reclaimer throughout the Halo games. Whatever Human's really are, they are definitely the Forerunner's Reclaimers. But that is all that is definite. Making the link to Precursor is quite a stretch. And it would be extremely disappointing/tacky/cliched/boring if once again Humans turn out to be the mysterious aliens who built all this big scarey stuff.[/quote] The Forerunners are definetly organic. Why else would the Forerunners build shield worlds for themselves if they were machines? Machines are not affected by the Halo rings. The Forerunners built shield worlds to protect themselves from the effects of the Halo rings. Read my theory carefully and entirely. I said that Humans were created by the Precursors to one day Reaclaim all that was once theirs, but it takes millions of years to evolve. The Precursors laid the seeds for Human life on Earth and left our galaxy. They put the Forerunners in charge in the mean time because the Forerunners were most likely the most advanced race in our galaxy at the time the Precursors left. The Forerunners talk about a Mantle that was passed to them. I think the Precursors told the Forerunners to keep life in this galaxy safe so the the Forerunners would protect Humanity. I think that somewhere the Precursors left something for Humans to find. They were way more advanced then the Forerunners so the Precursors could have hidden things from even the Forerunners. I think the Legendary endings of Halo 3 ODST and Halo 3 will most likey have to do with Humanity beginig to Reclaim what was once theirs. I agree that we still don't know exactly what a Forerunner is, but I think we can assume that they were an advanced race or multiple races that were given the Mantle of protecting life in our galaxy by the Precursors. If Humans were the direct decendents of the Forerunners then we are the creators of the Halo rings and our race failed to defeate the Flood once before. If we are in fact created by the Precursors and my theory is correct then there are a few Precursor surprises waiting for us and the Forerunners most likely discovered that and so they set all of their technology to only respond to us because they knew that the future is in humanities hands. "I have beaten fleets of thousands and consumed a galaxy of flesh and bone!" These words were spoken by the Gravemind in Halo 3. I believe what he is refering to is in fact the Precursors home galaxy because the Flood never took over the entire Milky Way galaxy. The Gravemind would not have said a galxy if he didn't meen it. Humanity is ment to Reclaim all that the Precursors once had and defeat the Flood. The Precursors and Forerunners were both unable to stop the Flood. Even the activation of the Halo rings didn't completely kill of the Flood. It didn't starve to death like the Forerunner hoped.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] TheHollowDeity I dont think the AI are mistaken when calling us Reclaimers. Also, Im not totally convinced that the forerunners are an organic race. There is not a single clue to them being organic. Suppose you are right that the Precursors created the flood. When they decided to return to cave people, or leave it to the humans. Wouldnt they create something to insure that it all ends up in the hands of the humans? In come the Forerunners. A creation of the Precursors made to do its best in eliminating the flood. Once its mission is complete, or complete as possible, it vanishes leaving everything to the humans. Everything you say can be fit into this theory! Think about it for a minute.[/quote] There is nothing that explains what Forerunner even means right now. Are they a single species? Are they multiple species (like The Covenant)? Are they a mixture of organic and machine races (like The Culture)? Multiple AI's call humans Reclaimer throughout the Halo games. Whatever Human's really are, they are definitely the Forerunner's Reclaimers. But that is all that is definite. Making the link to Precursor is quite a stretch. And it would be extremely disappointing/tacky/cliched/boring if once again Humans turn out to be the mysterious aliens who built all this big scarey stuff.
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Nothing ever said the forerunners where killed by the halo. They only disappeared after its activation.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] TheHollowDeity I dont think the AI are mistaken when calling us Reclaimers. Also, Im not totally convinced that the forerunners are an organic race. There is not a single clue to them being organic. [/quote] The clue is called Halo. It wipes out all organic life in it's radius. The Forerunners were killed off when they activated it. 2 + 2 = 4.
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I dont think the AI are mistaken when calling us Reclaimers. Also, Im not totally convinced that the forerunners are an organic race. There is not a single clue to them being organic. Suppose you are right that the Precursors created the flood. When they decided to return to cave people, or leave it to the humans. Wouldnt they create something to insure that it all ends up in the hands of the humans? In come the Forerunners. A creation of the Precursors made to do its best in eliminating the flood. Once its mission is complete, or complete as possible, it vanishes leaving everything to the humans. Everything you say can be fit into this theory! Think about it for a minute.
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Sience my comment got lost ill coment again Humans and Forrunner are the same I sated this on wolfrogs already read it page six i dont feel like typin that lil bit again. Basically How did the stars align that earth was the only world that the precoursors faded on cant they have made it to other worlds to therefore the forerunners are a sibling race to ours. Thats how we are mistaken for forerunner by their AIs.
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Sound theory just like the other thread. However, it is all speculation. Its kind of like religion. Everyone has their own idea about what's going on but none of us will know until we die..i mean until bungie tells us. I do think they will throw a twist or two when we find out. Maybe they did create the flood, or maybe the flood are the precursers!! haha
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Spark calling them Reclaimer was just my example. Humans are called Reclaimers by all Forerunner AI.
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But you dismiss "you are forerunner" as being a product of spark's rampancy, meanwhile using "reclaimer" as the basis of your argument... something fishy here. if sprak is rampant, then we can't use reclaimer either, can we?
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Wolverfrog [url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=36430414]Could this not have gone in my thread? You basically use my ideas and add a few more of your own :S[/url][/quote] Lol. I started by making a reply to your thread but it got so long I thought it deserved its own topic. I also took info from some other threads as well. It is kinda like a mix of a few plus my own thoughts.
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China called, they want their wall back. This probably should have gone in the other thread related to Humans=Precursor. I think Wolverfrog made it. [Edited on 09.30.2009 3:04 PM PDT]
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[url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=36430414]Could this not have gone in my thread? You basically use my ideas and add a few more of your own :S[/url]
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I don't think so.
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You say Bungie likes to lead us on, then shoot us in another direction? Then wouldn't that mean, that saying "You are Forerunner." was intended to make us think that Humans are Precursors, then, when we believe we solved it, they shoot us in another direction, and show us that Humans are indeed Forerunners?
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It's a nice theory. But right now there is not enough evidence to strongly link Humans to Precursors. We don't know what a Forerunner actually is, let alone a Precursor. Bungie are sneaky yes, but linking Humans directly to Precursors is way too obvious in my mind.