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10/17/2015 7:48:56 PM
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How about everybody just stop crying for free shit?
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  • [quote]How about everybody just stop crying for free shit?[/quote]

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  • We would, except for the fact that America used to be a land of opportunity for all. Now those opportunities require, at minimum, a college degree. From an employment perspective, college diplomas are now necessary in the same way high-school diplomas/GEDs were necessary a few decades ago. We give our people free schooling up until 12th grade, which gives them a borderline useless high-school diploma. That will get them nowhere in terms of gainful employment. College has also become prohibitively expensive for most Americans unless those students decide to saddle themselves with $100,00+ of student debt that they are loaned at a higher rate than the banking sector borrows money from the government for. When did it become acceptable to burden young people with massive debt before they achieve gainful employment? When did it become acceptable for banks to balance their checkbooks on the backs of college students? It is completely unacceptable, especially given that the ultra-rich (1% of our population) have "earned" more than 90% of new income in this country over the past few decades. Most other developed countries offer affordable college tuition, as well as universal healthcare, paid maternal/paternal leave, fair taxes on the rich, and many other things you would call "free shit". This shit used to be affordable. Now it is not. Our best course of action as the people of this country, after getting shafted for 30+ years, is to demand our fair share of the wealth. You might call that wealth redistribution. I would say the same thing of the economic climate over the past 30 years. That's where the real wealth redistribution happened. Now we're trying to make this country fair again to all people, not just the ultra-rich. Plus, the people bailed out Wall Street not 10 years ago. Is it really that unfair to ask them to pay their fair share of that tab in the form of something proactive and productive for our future generations? [spoiler]Sad thing is, Conservative/Republican policies prey on the middle-class that they claim to be helping. They do not help us. Republicans in the pockets of the rich. Don't believe me? Look where Reagan economics started. That's where the middle-class started to get screwed over in this country. And that is why modern Conservatives/Republicans idolize Reagan.[/spoiler]

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  • Wait a second, I need a degree to prosper? Strange I make $160k+ a year with a high school diploma and not a day of college. Work hard and pay for your own shit. If you can't do that, don't expect the rest of us to do it for you.

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  • This isn't the case for everyone, clearly. You can't get anywhere without a college degree. Even those with college degrees are still having a hard time. Get with the times.

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  • I'm speaking about the population at large. If you were able to look outside of your own situation, you would see that you got an opportunity most people would not be able to get without a college degree. Statistically, there are outliers in every category. You are one such outlier. However, you are (hopefully) aware that you are not the norm. Without a college degree, most people will never have access to the opportunities that you have. Just because something worked out for you doesn't mean it'll work out for everyone. Show some damn empathy for your fellow human beings.

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  • Survival of the fittest. Most people are weak and lazy with absolutely no drive to better themselves. Don't try and say it isn't true. I've worked around 100's of people that could be in the same position I am but were too lazy, or too dumb to take advantage of the opportunity staring them in the face.

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  • Edited by TheQ5: 10/17/2015 10:45:32 PM
    Your generalizations of the entire population of a country based on "100's of people" are disheartening. Survival of the fittest is true in nature/places without civilization. Sadly, we live in a civilized country. Perhaps you'd be more happy in a lawless utopia such as Somalia where survival of the fittest is the actual way of life. And please take the chip off your shoulder, while you're at it. We get it. You beat the odds. Good for you. But the odds are still stacked against most people. That is not a valid reason against tuition-free college degrees. True, many people would not graduate for one reason or another (laziness, in your eyes). But at least they would get a f**king chance. That's a hell of a lot more than most people get currently. I don't see the logic of your argument. It seems like it's based out of your own personal experience which you have a hard time understanding is not the norm. Put simply: you got lucky. I'm sure you worked your ass off. Not trying to denigrate that aspect. But at the end of the day, you seized an opportunity that the vast majority of Americans would not have. What's so wrong with trying to do everything we can to make the people, and therefore America, more successful as a whole?

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  • Jobs that lay that well without a degree are not the standard and you know that. You got very lucky.

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  • Oh, I'm lucky. I thought it was I chose a career that involved more skill than flipping burgers, showed up on time, learn my job, excelled at it, and earned it. The fact is most people are lazy. They like to show up late, leave early, do as little as possible, and have no drive to learn new skills because that would mean they'd be excepted to use them. With 16 years in the workforce and 12 years of those working in management positions I've only met a small handful of people that don't fit into those categories.

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  • No, you were lucky because you chose a field that actually has jobs available that pay as well as yours does and doesn't require a degree.

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  • Sure, that's it. I guess that's why 3/4 of the people that work under me are here on work visas from Mexico, and they make damn good money too. The fact is most people think they're too good to work outside doing physical labor, sweat a little, get their hands dirty.

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  • Edited by Britton: 10/17/2015 10:30:26 PM
    I agree with the last sentence, I love working outside and I like doing manual labor. But that doesn't change the fact that those types of jobs that lay extremely well are not common and are dwindling. Insulting everyone around you doesn't validate anything.

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  • [quote]How about everybody just stop crying for free shit?[/quote]

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  • I see nobody crying for free anything.

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  • Have you not seen the hoards at Bernie rallies clamouring for free college?

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  • I honestly don't understand why anyone would be opposed to tuition free college.

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  • Because nothing is free. You are just shoving the burden onto another's shoulders. Now, if you didn't have to collect income tax, but could still fund all the essential gov't functions plus college, I'd be all for it.

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  • Edited by Britton: 10/17/2015 9:07:36 PM
    The tuition free college proposal would be funded by a .5% tax on wall street speculation transactions. Not income taxes.

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  • You are right, disregard what I said about income taxes. But my point still stands that any tax (whether it effects me or not) is not a good thing. You are shoveling the burden of a nation's college tuition on those that (as I understand it) buy or sell stocks and bonds. Why should I have to pay for you to go to college?

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  • Edited by Britton: 10/17/2015 9:20:34 PM
    Because it's in the best interest of the country and therefore your best interest as well. Why is it not OK for them to carry the burden of paying for college tuitions .5% at a time. But it is OK for them to cause a recession that destroys many American lives financially, and then receive our tax dollars to get bailed out, only for the American tax payer to get nothing in return?

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  • It is debatable what exactly was at fault for the recession of 2008. But even if they were solely responsible are we still trying to punish them? Maybe even some that haven't been involved in any way.

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  • No, they are not solely responsible. http://www.factcheck.org/2008/10/who-caused-the-economic-crisis/ But they were bailed out to the tune of 700 billion dollars, so I see no issue with a .5% tax for them to help the American people.

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  • But again they weren't solely responsible, there were many parties involved and we can't hold all of them responsible. So are you suggesting that we have a .5% speculation tax for as long as it takes to recoup $700 billion?

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  • Edited by ScarceTripod: 10/17/2015 9:43:51 PM
    This^ The banks got bailed out with our tax dollars and then paid it back later. A college student will go to school on our tax dollars and when they get out with a better job then flipping burgers (we all know how burger flippers shouldn't be making a living wage) they will be paying into the system instead of being a taker. So they pay it back in taxes as well.

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