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10/1/2015 11:08:41 PM
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The Taken King: Its awesome, but also potentially destructive for the game itself.
I'm a lawyer (been for more than 20 years), but before that I was a Middle School teacher (for five years and then left to finish my law degree). The principal and the older teachers have a certain rule, old rule, but wise rule: "If more than half of the students in a normal class fail a grade, its not their fault, its the teachers fault."
Taken King is excellent, but the endgame is extremely frustrating to say the least!
34.48% success rate for beating Oryx is alarmingly BAD for the game. DeeJ: you see this as some guardians are 'better' than others?? Really? You're creating a far worse type of elitism than the Gjallarhorn ever managed to achieve!!! The problem is NOT the players. It's the game and the way Bungie made it.
People enjoy BEATING a boss multiple times in multiple ways and with different teams and stuff, not playing for hours and hours just to beat it once. That's why we did the raids so many times. And yes because of the amazing gear as well. But now, it's like Skolas first weeks all over again! Insanely difficult unless you had the Gjallarhorn and/or top level gear. Now the Gorn is gone and its nigh impossible right now to acquire 310 light level!!! Now it all depends on an insane amount of skill, LOTS AND LOTS of time at your disposal, and not so good gear, in other words: Just an elite few. Then why do you market the game towards casuals??? You like telling half-truths that much? You're shooting yourselves on both feet!
I have noted that sherpas (I am one of them, I admit) are getting frustrated and angry beyond anything I've seen in this community so far (which I'm part of btw). The PvE portion of the game is becoming like PvP ... In a very bad way. Its no longer about helping, its a competition. Who does Oryx and who didn't. Who got the Black Spindle and who didn't. You said you didn't want this behaviour so you nerfed the Gally. But now created a worse form of elitism. The ideological kind. You're either good or you're useless. Utilitarian elitism. Wow!!! Bungie, you managed to take a problem and make it even a bigger one! You wanted to get out of the hole you dug yourselves into by digging even DEEPER!!!!!!! You don't increase the value of a game by making it harder to achieve, you do it by making it BETTER!!!! )Which you did make better in a lot of awesome ways but at the expense of a REWARDING endgame!! The endgame right now seems nowhere to be seen and the 'rewards' so far are not a joke, but an INSULT!!)
Bungie, you need to fix this, FAST.
And the exotic missions are monstrous and part of the same problem!! Black spindle (Hammer nerfed, and still waiting to be MORE nerfed), blades, and stuff, make the Thorn bounty look like a kids game!
Taken King is Bungies greatest achievement, but at the same time it has the seed of its own destruction (yes, overly dramatic for just a game, but its their fault for marketing it as "Become Legend").
Bungie, get off your high horse quick, before this game ends its run before its even begun it!!! You need to start seeing reality now.
Make 310 (or higher if possible) gear accessible right away (stop with all the nonsense about not taking about caps, its an RPG game!!!!!!), so that the hard missions are still hard but at least PLAYABLE to the majority of players!!!
English
#feedback
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Your rule may be valid for middle school, but there's a lot of domains where it's not. End game content is meant to be hard.
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TL;DR: Bongy I need to get better gear to beat the raid. The raid was hard the first time I did it, and obviously practice is not a thing. Make 310 available super easily instead of achieved through playing endgame content.
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2 RepliesI'm a casual player, and I've reached the point where TTK is not fun anymore. Every enemy is a sponge who deals more damage than I can. Nightfall this week was zero fun. I'm getting to hate strikes at heroic level. Bounties are worthless as gear is soooo slow to level, and largely useless anyways. I thought TTK was great the first week or two, but I just dread it for the grind and zero fun bosses. I wish I wouldn't have paid the $40...
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1 ReplyEdited by Aetheric: 10/4/2015 6:02:58 AMThere is so much wrong with this post I scarcely know where to begin. The short of it is that I disagree with virtually every one of your points. There is no elitism because a 290 can do the raid as easily as a 305 as long as they're playing well. Gear doesn't matter in Kings Fall outside of a good sniper and a good LMG but even a high level blue is all that is needed. My team beat it day one a few hours behind the world first crew, and we were a rag tag team of random people, some friends, some weren't. Light levels ranging from 285-295. Yes it took us about 12 hours but that's because we were figuring out the whole raid ourselves for the first time. This same group now will do the raid start to finish in just over an hour, no wipes, no yelling, just casually strolling through it. The reason your so angry about this is because now you CANT be sherpa'd through this raid, not in the way you mean. Every person needs to be a productive and efficient member of the team, playing their role and doing it well. This isn't like Crota where one guy soloing can carry 5 dead bodies through, or Atheon where you only needed 2-3 people who really knew what they were doing. Every boss has strict mechanics that need to be adhered too, with little to no room for error. It's a true challenge, not because of enemy difficulty or gear requirements but because of team coordination. It's everything a raid should be. Gear makes things easier, but gear doesn't matter if you can't follow simple instructions. If theirs elitism, it's well founded because now the issue with your run isn't the lack of G-horns, it's a lack of good players, or truthfully, average players who know how to follow directions. And 310 is utterly meaningless if everyone has it. The difference between 300 and 310 is a few % dps, but that few % is the reward for completing this challenge. Without that, the raid has no purpose.
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2 RepliesSorry but life is tuff..... those who cant don't deserve a handout I would help anybody but to make a game dumbed down because its to hard for the soft.. Well that's like saying hey can I have half the money that's in your wallet because mines empty and a don't want to work for it.
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Went in with a group I've never played with before and we took his butt down.
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1 ReplyThat's a crap motto to live by. What is 'normal'? Classes these days aren't 'normal', the teacher can only do so much in a classroom setting.
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1 ReplyWow.. You are an idiot
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1 ReplyEdited by Mavsy 81: 10/3/2015 2:11:46 PMI prefer it this way, good players want to be rewarded for being good. Stop being so uber liberal, and promoting mediocrity.
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1 ReplyAs long as you think DeeJ "created" anything in this games like you said, no one will take you seriously.
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2 RepliesEdited by BIGBOYPANTS: 10/4/2015 5:13:42 AMThe one thing you not factoring is most people use Google or watch a YouTube vid to figure out how to beat bosses and how get past puzzle. Meaning as a game designer if make it to easy your game gets beat to fast then people bitch that it was to easy. Back in the day before the Internet you had to solve puzzle and boss fights on your own now the same day a game comes out we have how to vids up.
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1 ReplyWell said. This will be problem down the road. I was just talking about this very thing earlier today. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. The elitists are in a world of their own so they'll fail to understand your point, but well put. I hope Bungie has considered this.
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4 RepliesThe issue I've noticed with myself ( Kant speak for others, but I'll purpose the possibility) is that I'm dissuaded to help others by the tedious and laborious natures of the challenges. They should be, above all else, fun. I should [i]want[/i] to complete something more than once and when I am without any personally stake in it. Instead, I primarily dread helping others when I've done it enough myself because it's just not actually fun.
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Bump this is good stuff...
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7 RepliesI haven't seen anyone else comment on this, so I'll throw it out there. Year 2 PvP bounties are no longer doable by casual players. Year 1 PvP bounties were things like kill X number of class Y. This might take someone bad at PvP a long time to grind out, but it was doable. Now the bounties are things like kill 5 players in one life. For me, and I suspect many others, this isn't just difficult, it's impossible without boosting. I'll never be able to do bounties like that, not in a million years. And considering that I wouldn't do any PvP whatsoever if I had another means to get Marks and fulfill weapon bounties or quests, that means I will NEVER fulfill ANY regular PvP bounties. Which means, by the way, that there was no benefit to having Vanguard and Crucible Marks consolidated, because I'll NEVER be able to purchase any Crucible or faction gear under this system. Bungle has turned their cooperative FPS into a free-for-all.
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4 Repliesgit gud
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I agree . Would you invite me to the raid ?
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1 ReplyDamn it! If you were XB1, I'd take you into the raid. This raid is for highly coordinated teams. That's the only real skill required. Everything else is just memory of what to do. Once you beat oryx, it gets much easier after that.
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I am a casual player who can only get on early mornings before work and every other weekend or so. Destiny is fine for me. Games should be skill based to an extent. Like 9 years ago when WoW dropped end game content involved 40 man raids. Trust me destiny is a bit more casual being able to start a pug with 5 kids. They can't make the game too easy. My expertise: bird law
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We are at the daughters after 6 hrs..players would drop and we'd have to find new ones so only 4 of us were the original team...I think it's fun as hell
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3 RepliesIv done the raid 3x if ur on Xbox and need help
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That success was just oryx. And other gear can be earned. Also the best strategies are still in development
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You realize the raid has only been out for a couple of weeks right. People are still getting the mechanics down while trying to level high enough to complete it. Also given that this raid actually requires teamwork means that people are going to stumble. It was the same thing with the previous raids. Once the official strategy makes it rounds the success rate is going to go through the roof.
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What did you teach and what is your area of practice ?
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1 ReplyWhat happens if we end year 2 and there are players who tried and failed to beat the new raid? What if all the new content is like the secret lost to light mission? Some players are better than others, yes, but there aren't enough of those players to make "Destiny" a success. I think back to Skolas. PoE 35 was a multiple weekend trial marred by the need to sleep, a power outage, and a severely in-fun game activity. I finished it once for the emblem but I would have rather have done it for fun. Instead of focusing on how hard the content can be, Bungie should focus on how fun it can be.[spoiler]What's fun? Swords are fun. Mayhem is fun. Destroying Fallen with a rocket as they emerge from their dropship is fun. Sniping with Ice Breaker was fun. Vault of Glass was fun when it wasn't as buggy as hell. Soloing the lamps in Crota's End as an invisible hunter was fun. Pre-nerf shot gunning yellow bar enemies in the face was fun. The new strikes are fun.[/spoiler]
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Or just have a group of helpful and fun people, not even considering these things.
