Pretty much another Thorn inspired post... (+ other exotics)
So many people say the Thorn is fine and not OP'd. Some add that other weapons should simply be buffed in order to compete with it. They also add that these nerfing cycles only destroy weapons and their respective classes. The funny thing is (and I don't know how many people have noticed this) an inherent contradiction within the philosophy of exotics.
According to Bungie in one of their Destiny update articles (https://www.bungie.net/7_Destiny-Update---12012014/en/News/News?aid=12433), exotics are meant to “feel” overpowered but “are not supposed to break the balance of the game.” How exactly do you create a balanced set of weapons when specific weapons are meant to be imbalanced? I am not sure this is possible. And it seems that the weapons people have complained most about have been exotics (Thorn, Vex, Suros, The Last Word, etc.).
All that said, I don't want to see other exotics be buffed (unless...). So far, we have had balancing cycles, not just nerfing cycles. Weapons have been nerfed but weapons have also been buffed (and the Thorn is one of them). Starting up a buffing cycle will only reduce TTK and continuing it will bring us closer to CoD's TTK. Now, that may be fine if that is what you like but, personally, I like that Destiny's pvp gives you a little more room to counter opponents and I would like to keep it that way in the regular crucible modes.
With that in mind, I think (and this is my personal opinion) that exotic weapons should be removed from regular crucible modes. It's difficult to allow exotics to feel overpowered without denying fair play in the crucible. Instead, a new crucible playlist could be created that allows all overpowered exotics to shine (other exotics would then have to be buffed to match the power of the Thorn and more special and heavy ammo crates would spawn during the match to allow all categories of exotics to shine). This would be a mode where the objective is pretty much to abuse exotic weapons' power while you forget that you're also carrying two other weapons. Knowing that the exotics are going to be overpowered, rather than asking “is it fair?” you could ask “is it OP'd enough?”
Considering that so many complaints in the crucible have been about exotic weapons dealing too much damage too quickly, this could make the crucible core experience a little more balanced while the exotics excel in the one playlist (or type of playlist like Inferno) with an insane low TTK. On the pve side, exotics could potentially even perform better because of their buffs (I don't think the minions of the darkness will mind).
But that's just my opinion...
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1 ReplyPretty i sure i already bumped... but... bump
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If crucible were limited to legendary weapons and below only I would be stoked.
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Bump!
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2 RepliesCant you just suck it up
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2 RepliesBump!
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1 ReplyYou do it by making the user-experience of the gun top-notch. Example, the N7 Hurricane from Mass Effect 3. The equivalent of Exotics, the five N7 weapons could only be got by completing fortnightly special events. The Hurricane was an SMG, except turned up to eleven: massive fire-rate, massive damage, massive noise, massive recoil. The Hurricane wasn't overpowered compared to any of the other guns, but it was was more extreme and situational: the recoil that the player had to fight to keep it on target meant that its great DPS, low latency, and general badassery was countered by a very short effective range. Skilled players could control the flow battlefield so that it was never out-of-range, could charge-down distant enemies without getting sniped, could use the right skills to fill in its blindspots, and so on. With skill and practice, it was possible to get it pointing in the right direction despite the recoil. This is kinda the point of exotics, I think: an exotic weapon should be harder to use, should ask more from the player if he wants to get the best out of it. An exotic weapon should, if you try to use it like any average weapon, be average, or worse.
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I definitely would enjoy the crucible more if every weapon got an across the board nerf to bring all TTKs up to halo-esq levels. Even if hand cannons were still the best option, it would make them require more skill to be effective while bringing auto rifles back into viability.
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3 RepliesSomething needs to change. I am getting very tired of TLW and Thorn. The Crucible can never be taken seriously in its current state.
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1 ReplyThis is not the game for you. The Master Chief Collection whent that way------------------------------------>>
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3 RepliesIt isn't easy to be a destiny noob now. Everyone has an awesome primary exotic. I would hate to walk into the crucible now with a preacher shotty, and khvostov. With that being said. Yes it's not balanced because everyone is using them..
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3 RepliesJust -blam!-ing play CoD for -blam!-s sake!
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1 ReplyLol so you want a non competitive multiplayer to be balanced? Ok. Then why not just remove iron banner, and ToO, because those are not balanced game modes. The crucible, imo, is not meant to be balanced it if were, it would have been from the beginning don't you think? The point of the crucible is just to play for fun and victory. That's all. Nothing competitive unless it's the iron banner or ToO.
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1 ReplyAgreed... I am not one to jump on the Halo/Destiny > CoD or visa versa argument. I think they are both great games, and the MP for both are fun. But I personally PREFER the mechanics of Halo/Destiny to CoD and other 'twitch' shooters. As such I dont want to see Destiny move to TTKs similar to those games. If thats what I wanted to play, I would play those games. I personally think that no primary weapon (except say NLB or UR) should be able to kill anyone in anything less than 3 shots. People seemed to be pretty happy with this ever since the original Halo pistol. Granted, there are a lot more factors now (impact, rof, etc), but that should give designers idea of reasonable TTKs. Great post!
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29 RepliesAll that and your entire premise is wrong because legendaries are every bit as good as exotics. Each exotic will give you one unique perk, but they aren't game breaking. Now you might not have found a legendary you like better yourself, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. As for any imbalance that does exist, the game isn't meant to be perfectly balanced weapon to weapon, but the level of secondary weapons, grenades, perks, supers and abilities at our disposal give us more than enough ways to counter anything in this game.
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1 ReplyEdited by XTempistX: 6/11/2015 3:01:54 PMWhen we click on a PvP game type, there should just be an exotic weapon enabled option or exotic weapon disabled option. It would make some players feel at ease about PvP. You wouldn't have to worry about fan fire, players getting full health after a kill, special weapons in primary weapon slots, poison, rockets with op tracking that never miss, players gaining their supers mad fast with weapons that increases super energy gained with each kill while at the same time instantly reloading their weapon and so on. Sure there will be legendary and below rarity weapons with the same stats as these exotics but these op perks will not give plays such a headache. Buffing other weapons will only make every weapon's time to kill be like 1-2 seconds making Destiny another CoD. Halo was awesome because someone could have put in 3-5 bullets in me and I could turn around and kill them out of skill without ever having to hide to regain health. This game how it is already prevents that most times, especially when you're being shot by an exotic weapon.
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1 ReplyUmm when i think of the fastest ttks a bunch of legendaries come to mind...... Three little words Efrideets spear Felwinters Any legendary fusion rifle..... The messenger Exotics like thorn just have cheap ass perks
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COD had a time to kill in less than 0 seconds due to lag compensation, you can kill someone on your screen before they get hit on their screen
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Edited by Carvoic: 6/11/2015 8:14:09 PMAgreed. The only solution is to ban exotics from PVP. That or ruin them in PVP which would also SCREW PVE. Which I personally think isn't an option.
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3 RepliesI agree with your stance on TTK. TTK is already too low. The best part about halo 2 was it took skill and stratagy due to higher TTK. I don't think it's fun to get instikilled just because someone saw me first.
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1 ReplyI say just keep a gun's pvp an pve performance separate. You can nerf a gun in pvp without changing it in pve. Its kinda simple.
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Agreed. Bump. I am sick of lowering the ttk ever again buy buffing everything to .36. This is not cod... but it will become
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I use to use Thorn all the time now I just use Lord of Wolves. It takes a lot more skill because you have to find strategic ways to get close to the user. It's a load of fun too.