Since you talk about competing with weapons, I assume you are referring to PvP. I think many autos are still quite viable in PvP, because even though their [b]damage per hit[/b] were reduced, their [b]hits to kill[/b] and thus time to kill was not. This applies to most medium ([i]Monte Carlo, Hard Light, For The People[/i]) or low impact ([i]Atheon's Epiloge, Silimar's Wrath[/i]) autos, but high impacts like Suros or Vanquisher took the brunt and are admittedly slightly less viable. Long technical post below: [u]As an example: [b]Monte Carlo[/b][/u] This beauty used to deal 22 headshot damage in PvP before 1.1.1, it deals 20 now. [i]See, this clown is an idiot, it deals so much less damage![/i] True, it is almost 10% less [b]damage per hit[/b], but let's do the math. Guardians has about 200 health in regular Crucible. 20 damage means you need 10 headshots to kill a previously uninjured opponent (20x10=200). Do the same for 22 damage and we see that we accumulate 220 damage after 10 hits. [i]See, get lost you jackass, that is much higher damage![/i] Yes, but what if we take a shot off and count 9 hits of 22. That end up with 198 damage dealt - meaning your enemy will survive. He/she will probably die from getting struck by a feather, but your foe remains breathing nontheless. [i]O.o[/i] See where I am going? Even though the pre-patch Monte Carlo gets to 20 excess damage after the fatal bullet strikes the victim between the eyes, the amount of [b]hits to kill[/b] remains exactly the same as the post-patch one. If your enemy was ever so slightly hurt before, it would be a 9-headshot kill, but if at full health you will need 10 hits. This applies to Hard Light as well, since it has the same impact, and in very similar shape for other medium impact autos. Atheon's Epilogue went from 14 to 13 headshot damage, which translates to that the pre-patch Atheon's were a 15-hit kill (210 total damage) while the current one needs just one more pea to splat against the enemy's visor (for 208 total damage). [i]Hah, it sucks now because it need one more hit to kill![/i] Yes and no. Since the rate of fire is so crazy high, needing an extra hit means time to kill only increases by a hundreth or two of a second and therefore more or less a non-issue. As for Suros and Vanquisher, it is slightly more dicey. Suros went from 34 to 31 damage when aiming, turning the 6-hitter into a 7-hit kill while I heard Vanquisher went from 27 to 23 damage (never used it myself so I am not sure there) becoming a 9-hit killer instead of the previously 8. With the lower rate of fire, this increase to time to kill still isn't extreme, but it is noticable. In the end, low and medium impact autos suffer more from the range decrease than they do from the damage reduction, while high impacts took some heavier toll from damage decrease as well. In PvP, I could live with slight increase to damage among the high impacts, just so that they reached the lower hits to kill threshold (Suros back to 34, Vanquisher to 25). While I prefer the medium autos myself, I think both reduced range and requiring one extra hit was slightly too strong nerf for the high impacts. In PvE I want the entirety of autos back to pre-1.1.1 because that massive nerf was just uncalled for.