Strikes and raids don't get worse for the people that play them when the people that feel no reason to play them don't play them.

So a 12% increase in playercount is how you justify completely reworking what adept loot means? By this exact logic, I should be able to go in to a GM, and as long as I get 200 kills, I should get an adept.

You get a free Adept weapon as long as you complete the GM, and there are many GM's that can be easily farmed in under 20 minutes.

You get a free adept weapon whenever you go flawless on a card, many maps taking less than 40 minutes for 7 matches. Your point?

7-0 (or 7-1) in PvP is significantly harder and far less consistent difficulty than doing a GM. Also most GMs can be done in ~30 mins. And most Timelost guns are about 15 mins, and Master VoG isn't very hard when you're closer to the level.

For some people, sure. I don't find going flawless difficult at all, it's simply a time commitment. As for GMs, sure, they can be easier than going flawless due to the amount of time you have to prepare for said GM as well as the massive amount of buildcrafting you can do. Things such as volatile rounds and elemental wells don't really work in trials. Assuming it is just more difficult, why is the argument for improving the game making trials adepts easier to get and not making GMs more difficult?

My point is that getting adept weapons in GM's is waaay easier than getting adept weapons in trials. You compared getting 7 wins on a confidence card, then continuing to win on that 7 win card, to just going into a GM and getting 200 kills. This would be like going in to a GM, that you already beat this season, and then having an additional 50/50 chance at an adept weapon dropping on boss kills. For the record, one single team managed to go flawless in under 40 minutes this week. The 10th fastest team took over 52 minutes.

So that's your logic to wanting adepts to be even easier to get? Anyone and their mother can get 7 wins, it is a simple time commitment, even moreso with freelance. Not only that, but wins after are also a simple time commitment, there is no skill requirement. Regardless, they still did it. A team speedrunning a GM can do it faster, but your average player won't do a full gm in 20 minutes.

No that's not my logic at all. What I said in the original post, is that more loot = more player retention. If adept loot is easier to get, then more people will play trials, and that's good for the longevity of the game mode. People get carried in trials, GM's, and raids. Skill isn't a huge factor in getting Adept/Timelost gear when you have a good team. Look, I see your point. "There will never be an easy way for single players to get GM loot or Master Raid loot, so why should there be one for Trials? " But as A_mo said, GM's and raids don't get progressively harder as the player population falls.

A lot of people didn't even know about that glitch. That's basically just from word of mouth. GMs just aren't as subject to having to worry about player population. And in PvP even a 12% increase can make a huge difference in terms of quality for the people that are already playing. People might not need to have the ability to farm 38 adepts but its definitely something that should be considered. Plus PvP is something where if more people play it it somewhat justifies more rewards being applied to it. So if it has a buzz around it there's a possibility that could result in more adepts or maybe even something like the flawless pool becoming another tier of recognition. I can totally understand wanting to have the same status applied to trials as gms and raid rewards but the solutions to PvP things might not always be the same as solutions to other modes. The good vibes in PvP can get sucked out really quick. So it would be a way to keep people having a positive relationship to the mode.

No, it wasn't. Practically every destiny streamer, youtuber, and even bungie employees talked about it the entire week. But there wasn't an increase in quality. Did you not see how many people still complained about trials? Even more than usual because now you have good players not going flawless because it's easier to farm wins in the non flawless pool? How does it need to be considered? The only people that could've are those that have gone flawless this season and thus already are playing trials. Once again, a 12% increase in player count does not warrant what is essentially an entire rework of the trials reward structure and how adepts are defined. How is the solution not the same? GM rewards and trials rewards are both Adept, both require endgame content to be completeted that is very challenging. If a glitch allows people to farm adepts in normal strikes, should we then just allow that to be the norm now because there was a small increase in playercount? People only have a negative relationship with pvp if they are either A. Bad and don't accept that pvp isn't for them or B. Take pvp too seriously and don't understand it's not life or death. A 12% increase in players doesn't warrant reworking the reward structure of the entire mode. Simple as.

A whole lot of the people that might be interested in something like that probably don't watch or listen to community oriented stuff like that super regularly. With a lot of the people we're talking about it would be a mistake to think they're always plugged into the latest developments in a mode they feel like they have no reason to play. I'm not sure if there was truly an increase in quality or not. And that's something neither of us can tell. But 12% is half as many people as what went flawless last time I checked so its not a small number. Definitely not a small number in terms of PvP by any means. And it shows potential. People are always going to complain about trials. The complaints are going to be pretty subjective but overall I (who am no one) would say Trials has the best matchmaking quality that PvP in this game has ever had. That's taking into account many different things that could be considered "quality." The problem is more just getting people to engage with it. And the increase in quality would most likely be felt the most by the people who would need it the most. Which would be the people that might have a harder time adapting to some of the things they might encounter. It wouldn't be a massive rework of the reward structure that is going to have to get tweaked periodically anyways. Unless it doesn't, which I hope by now most people would understand that doing something in PvP and leaving it exactly that way forever is not always the best approach. The people not playing in the flawless pool is the perfect example. Good people, or people that have gone flawless should want to play in the flawless pool. The quality of competition goes up in the flawless pool but its something that is very much subject to player population. So something that would bring more people in general would almost have to have a positive effect on encouraging more people to stay around. Adepts are important to trials just like they're are important to the other modes and I get why you want them to have the same level of significance. Its just how they're important in terms of the effect they can have is going to be different in a PvP environment than a PvE one. They can do a lot of things for the mode or they can do things against it as well.

So you're trying to argue that somehow, the people that would be interested in getting adept loot for free, are not atleast somewhat in tune with destiny news or have 0 friends that are also in tune with destiny news? If you're honestly wanting to use that as a way to argue this is a good idea, I'd like to see some actual concrete evidence of that. There wasnt. A majority of good players had no reason to go flawless this week and thus just stayed in the non flawless pool, keeping the mode exponentially sweatier and forcing a lot of 5-0 blowouts. When I first went into trials this week I was going up against players that had absolutely no chance to win against me. That is not fun for either of us. It is a small number. 45k players. Along with less players going flawless. They already have the same level of significance. Thats the entire reason people want to go flawless. They already do everything they need to do to the mode. They're the chase. People are going to do whatever they can to get them as efficently and quickly as possible. This would lead to every good player and their mother just farming them with wins rather than going flawless, massively increasing the playercount in the non flawless pool, thus increasing the amount of sweats in said pool. This would lead to bad players getting more upset than they already are, which they would then leave the mode. You would lose more players in this than you would ever gain, as well as now setting a standard that Adept weapons are no longer rewarded for difficult, endgame activity. As I said. Let me go into a GM and get 200 kills for an adept. Then we'll talk. So your idea would do nothing other than devalue the worth of the loot, lessen the value of going flawless, and give absolutely no reason for people to try for the lighthouse anymore, yet you say people would still have the complaints they have now? How is it logical to completely rework and breakdown a mode whenever as you said, people will still complain? But there already is a very large amount of players engaging with it now? And even with this glitch, there was not a proportional increase that would garner it being a permanent addition? Sure, if it was 150k more players, changing reward structure would be smart, but 45k? Even if more people engage with the mode, you've just completely watered down a mode that is just now starting to get to a place it needs to be. It would. 99% of players that go flawless do so for the weapon. The people that can consistently go flawless don't really need the materials, nor do they really need the memento. If you make it so you no longer need to go flawless to get adepts, what is the point of trying? You'll get matched with sweatier players, have to try more, and get less loot. This would then completely annhilate the entire reason of the change, to get more people into the mode. Because now, when someone tries the mode out, there is an exponentially higher amount of sweatlords in the mode and there is no way for them to not get matched with said sweatlords. Why would they want to play in the flawless pool? They want the loot? Going flawless gave you less loot than you going and just farming with a confidence card. This is a fact. It gave you more of EVERYTHING you got from going flawless for exponentially less work.