[quote] We cannot as a community enjoy playing Destiny 2 for fun, because we have been taught that if you aren't getting something for it that is an upgrade, it's not worth doing. You can't just play strikes or crucible for the fun of it, because once you hit 305, there is zero point in playing it for anything other than fun [/quote] This is the biggest bit of truth on this forum

Fair comment, but as others above me said I think, as far as a fun factor is concerned, Destiny 2 fails. Again, as stated above, this has to do with the players feeling less powerful. I HATE bringing up the Warframe name, but look at that game. It has only been growing, and it treats its players like super gods. That's all people want. Not balance, not at all. Of course, this has been covered in a trillion youtube videos and all that. It sucks, but Bungie effed up.

If I could use shotgun/sniper on my secondary weapon and got a solar burn modifier for NF, I will definitely play it like I did in D1 without any rewards! Because the every moment would be FUN! But now, I just be boring shooting shooting with always AR or SR.... BORING AS HELL！！！！

It was never about the grind for me, don't have much time gaming these days, so I'm looking at enjoyment first. D2 is nowhere near as fun. Even PvP, which kept me playing D1, is now repetitive and choice-less. Sigh...

Loot aside, it's not as fun to play. The feeling of being powerful isn't there. Weapon loadout - 2 primaries, less powerful supers, melees, grenades, less build options, slower movement, etc. Loot is a big problem, but there are plenty more.

Lol reach had more extensive grind for gear than destiny

[quote]I wouldnt call it a great shooter. Too long of TTK. Abilities take so long to recharge they would be better off refilling only on deaths.[/quote] I also think the gunplay feels sluggish.

I've got two 400 LL characters in Destiny. They have there for quite some time. My Warlock was T12 before I even knew what that was. Really. There really isn't any further they can go except to play for fun and to collect. I played Strikes and Raids for fun. I didn't play much PvP because I found them less fun. The exceptions were Iron Banner and anytime Mayhem was option. Those were a blast. They are - at least at this time - more fun to play than either of the mid-290 PL transfers to D2, which is for all practical purposes a maxed character in D2. Even though the D2 characters are relatively equally equipped to the D1 pair. It's not a matter of the loot as a reward. In D1, the loot wasn't the reward, it was the fact of recognition for playing well that was the actual psychology of the reward. Often the gear was a game-tangible representation of the work required to achieve an accomplishment. Raid armor, being a great example. It's not the upgrade but the success that was the matter of pride. By contrast, in D2 I have Raid armor without even running the Raid. I have max power guns that required no effort on my part. Basically, some of my best gear, I simply don't have the satisfaction of having earned. It's not that I'm not a capable enough player. It's that the game didn't even give me the opportunity to excel. It just gives it to you. Fully upgraded. Fully unlocked. That latter goes against the human need to pursue excellence. Destiny 1 held people even though they had gotten all the loot because it fostered the pursuit of excellence. Destiny 2 does not hold people because there is no expectation of excellence, beyond what we bring ourselves. That is why it fails.

[quote] Destiny 2 is a fantastic game from a shooter POV. It falls short on the loot side for endgame, pretty hard. It's sad, really. We have this great game, and most of us can't enjoy it because we've been conditioned by the very game itself not to.[/quote] That is the problem. Destiny 2 wasn't sold as a pure shooter game, it actually WAS sold as a looter game (Ahem - Cayde 6). There is nothing wrong with expecting great rewards for playtime when you play a looter. When I played Reach, the reward was never the armor/rank because it was meaningless. Sure, I loved to customize my Spartan like everyone else, but once I liked how he looked, I changed him very little. The reward in Reach was killing other people and getting to teabag them - because the game was PVP-Oriented game. As a PVE-Oriented game, Destiny 2 just gives you no reason to do anything more than once. Its a looter game that effectively operates like a generic shooter in that once you play through the campaign a few times, your effectively done. You can either move on to play PVP or move on to play other games - which is what A LOT of other players are choosing to do.

The more you play a game the more repetitive it become that's not just destiny

the bullet sponge bosses that teleport, preventing you from doing damage, the limited power ammo preventing you from being able to unleash on them and the slow cooldown of abilities. I think its simple, we were conditioned to feeling powerful in Destiny 1 and now you have to take down a boss with 2 auto rifles. Its boring as hell.

amazing