Okay, after a few hours of playing the Beta I feel I have acquired enough understanding and experience with the new Gunslinger to confidently say it is the worst subclass so far. In Destiny I played as Hunter the least because I am a much more offensive player and the Hunter's frailty just never gelled with me, but I do use the class casually and I know how to play the character. That said, I feel the new version of Gunslinger is no improvement.
First off, at least with the Way of the Outlaw tree, there is little synergy between abilities. Two perks (Deadshot and Six-Shooter) solely affect the super, but do not improve it. Deadshot increases the stability and accuracy of Golden Gun, and that would be incredibly helpful with a six shot GG, but you can't deal precision damage with the GG Outlaw branch. Which means, even if you land all six shots in what should be precision spots you will still deal the same amount of damage as shooting it anywhere else.
Which ultimately means you'd be better off packing a sniper rifle, grenade launcher, or really any gun that can put damage down range and some Heavy Ammo bricks (Seriously a sniper rifle precision hit will do almost equal the damage of two GG precision hits).
But that's just the super which, if you've been playing you know, takes forever to charge even if you're actively killing. Explosive Knife, one of the other two perks, meanwhile doesn't kill most medium size enemies it hits, and the AoE is so small it might as well not even have it. And if you want to use Gambler's Dodge to give yourself a second knife you'd first have to be out of range of a normal melee to throw your knife, close in for the perk to proc, and perform the dodge all in order to get another ranged knife; defeating the purpose of having a ranged attack altogether. Chains of Woe can be useful, but if you are using Marksman's Dodge or a gun with a decent reload time it can be somewhat frivolous when it comes to reloading your own weapons.
But the problem doesn't come from the perks alone being weak, rather these perks have almost no correlation. Neither Explosive Knife nor Chains of Woe help attain your super (The long recharge times make enemy kills nearly negligible when it comes to shortening the time) and neither affect your play style or assist in helping you recharge other abilities.
An excellent example of a subclass that does this right is Arcstrider. Way of the Warrior revolves around striking and dodging. Combination Blow mixed with Combat Flow, Deadly Reach, and Gambler's Dodge is incredible and it feels amazing. I have been able to clear entire mobs with the Combination Blow health/ damage boost and Deadly Reach. That tree is beautiful and it is the complete opposite of Outlaw. Attacks feed into more attacks and it feels excellent to just clear out groups, which makes Gunslinger all the more disappointing.
Finally I want to bring up the Dodge ability as a whole. The Dodge just seems too... simple. Dodge doesn't seem very good at actually evading damage and I don't think I'm ever going to use Marksman's Dodge. Instantaneous reloading seems a bit useless, especially when the Titan's Rally Barricade allows for instant reloading and it actually provides cover. Gambler's Dodge isn't bad by any means especially when its mixed with a melee ability that destroys anything in its path, but again, Dodge is simple and given the fact that the Titan's and Warlock's abilities can assist the team it's just odd that the Hunter's ability is weirdly selfish.
Those are my thoughts anyways. Anyone else feel the same? Ya disagree? I want to know and I really feel like Bungie needs to do something to improve the Hunter's Outlaw branch.
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I thought supers couldn't one shot each other anymore (Excluding Nova bomb). I just killed 2 Golden Guns with my Arcstrider and each of them died in one hit. Neither of them had taken damage beforehand. I saved the video and slowed it down to make sure [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSZaKZQTv8g[/url]
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9 RepliesY1 gunslinger .. pop super and go on hunt Y2 gunslinger .. Pop super and go on hu........... ohh shit it's over.
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I disagree with hunters being less supportive and here's why... First hunters, no matter the solar or arc class, are more focused on dps and getting fast kills than the other classes are. I say this because they have lass health, but their abilities are all highly offensive. The gunslinger outlaw tree combined with the marksman dodge allows you to pump out more dps. Try using guns that have great impact handling and stability with low reload, ex. A high impact hand cannon or others similar where there's a high payoff for landing your precision shots. Then when it's time to reload you have chains of woe to shorten the reload time if your getting precision kills. Then you have the option of using the dodge to also help you reload allowing you to use your guns more. Since you can take slightly more damage in D2 there has been times where the enemy stops shooting to reload if your good at evading their shots, and that's when you use marksman dodge to jump to a side that will catch your opponent off guard and finish with a headshot because the are standing still and reloading. With the gunslinger you have to be more focused on gunplay than the other classes. In pve the titans specialize in their defensive capability and control which makes them so strong. They can build a stronghold in any setting and use it to their advantage and lockdown an area. Warlocks specialize in power and creating chaos. So they can overpower their enemy by throwing a rift down to heal or strengthen their weapons as long as they stay in that rift. They also make large explosions and manipulate the battlefield so that you will feel helpless as you take increased damage from a bunch of little explosions and fields of dots. This makes them a difficult enemy because of how overwhelming they can be with that power. The hunter specializes in being evasive and precise, they are the assassins of the battlefield. They aren't highly defensive or extremely powerful when facing a group, but their ability to dodge harm and deal high damage to an enemy with precise movement is what makes them unique and can make them hard to kill depending on the amount of skill they have. At face value hunters appear weaker than the other classes because of how easy it is the tank or overpower with the other classes. They also have a very small amount of team play abilities making them selfish players. So when you have a skilled hunter on your team you may not appreciate their selfish ways and going out on their own, but they can focus on quickly killing the higher valued targets, while the team focuses on defending and taking out mobs of enemies because it is easier for them given their unique abilities.
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Man U won't believe how bad is voidwalker super. At least u can get a kill or 2 with gunslinger.
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1 ReplyThat's because you're only playing it one way. When you can unlock the rest of the subclass, I'm sure all the hunters will stop crying.
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lol it's fine for me, just gotta know when to pop it, and as far as damage goes it destroys the enemies that I face.
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I think it's fair to say most people hate all classes for pve.
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Yeah honestly I though GG would be my main in d2 as I was using it all the time in d1 especially once nighthawk was released. But now in PvP where it was amazing the only thing I really like is the tripmine. Super is too short and chain of woe which was one of my favorite perks in d1 doesn't seem as useful. The dodge should have at least a heal function instead of recharge melee because it is so far behind the other 2. Sucks because I loved gunslinger in d1 at least arcstrider is super fun
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Hunters got shafted. Im a warlock main and i can still admit hunter mains got the shit end of the stick.
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It's pretty bad. Takes like 2 shots to kill ONE cabal... A RED HEALTH CABAL
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5 RepliesIt's a -blam!-ing joke. There is a reason no one is running it. They have ruined the hunter.
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It is weak. All 6 shots can't even down a yellow bar enemy. Not like buffing the damage will make it more of a ohk in PvP.
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1 ReplyDodge needs to be replaced with smoke bomb. Invisibility or Defensive Coating. Just off the top of my head.
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Edited by Knight: 7/21/2017 10:41:54 PMIf they made it were you could select a perk in the tree to have 3 shots instead of 6 and added extra damage and duration I think that would solve most of the problems.
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8 RepliesIt's the weakest subclass out of all 6, by a large margin imo. Zero synergy between abilities, 6-shooter damage + length is pathetic, and too many abilities that rely on super, which we build so damn slowly now. 100% agree. From what I've seen, subclasses best to worst: Striker = Voidwalker > Sentinel = Dawnblade >> Arcstrider >>>>> Gunslinger.
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2 RepliesI stopped playing gunslinger as soon as I used my super for the first time and saw that golden gun couldn't one shot a red bar.
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22 RepliesHunter seems the weakest class, the new shadestep is horrible. Warlock feels great, the healing ability and pyro super work really well. I'll probably stick with maining a Titan as it feels the best overall imo. But yeah, hunters got screwed big time.
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3 RepliesGunslinger was never really that great in d1 pve either.
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Just need the other block and then i might use it
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2 RepliesI agree, hopefully the other path will be better, but then anyone who uses gunslinger will just use that one build. Unless Bungie changes the perk system as the game progresses (which I hope they will)
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Way of the outlaw is hot garbage for PvE and PvP. All it has going is chain of woe. But there is perks for guns to reload faster anyway.
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Being stuck in the bland 6 shooter mode is rough.
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I do with the current build we got to play with
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I agree with most of this, but I'm hopeful for the other perk tree. Guess I'll just have to wait until release to find out
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I really like the explosive throwing knife. That's about it.
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Edited by Piggyback: 7/20/2017 11:38:06 AMThe damage output of Golden Gun is far too low for it to be viable in PvE. Every other super deals significantly more damage and can clear a higher volume of enemies per cast, whereas GG struggles to one-shot even some low-tier ads. The range benefit feels redundant, when every other subclass does it's job better. It's disappointing to say the least, especially since the changes made to Gunslinger made it look like a PvE God.