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Edited by HappyMeal75:
8/29/2016 5:34:06 PM
378
Raid Matchmaking: THE DEBATE
Today I pose a question to you! How do you feel about raid matchmaking? Are we fine how we are now? Or would it be a great improvement?
LETS DEBATE:
[u]Pro Matchmaking[/u]
Adding matchmaking to the raids will allow for more players to participate in them. No longer will you be forced to use an LFG site or recruitment threads if you don't have any friends online. Just launch the activity and [i]Walla[/i] you are in a full fire team!
While some would argue that some people would get matched with lower light levels or just players who don't know what to do, this offers for players to teach others each encounter. This would add to the social aspect of the raids even more! And hey, if you still wanted to go on LFG, you can! Nobody is stopping you.
If you think the new raids would be too hard, that's okay. We could have matchmaking for VoG and CE but not Kings Fall, because those raids are much lower light level. That way newer players can run through those old raids for the first time much more easily, or old players can do the same just for fun. [i]Problem Solved[/i]
[u]Con Matchmaking[/u]
Matchmaking for raids is a terrible idea! This would lead to more frustration than ever. People with very low light levels, inexperienced players, people instantly leaving, players with no mic, these are the players you will be getting matched up with, and the list just goes on and on. Adding a matchmaking system is a waste of Bungies time. With half the player base on LFG and the other half raid matchmaking, wait times will be longer than ever. And when you finally do get a match, people could purposefully troll or go AFK with no one to kick them.
How do you expect checkpoints to work? If I have Golgoroth cp , will I only get matched with people at Golgoroth? If so, wait times will be even longer. If not, I might lose my checkpoint and miss out on the Golgoroth loot I still needed to get.
Getting through a strike with Randoms is hard enough, doing a raid with Randoms would be near impossible.
[b]So what do you think? Should raid matchmaking be a thing or not? What other topics are worthy of a Debate?[/b]
EDIT: Wow, glad to see everyone voicing there opinions in the comments. This post has gotten more love than I expected. Fun to read these comments.
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No raids should have matchmaking period!!! The people who would use this would not like raiding afterwards. Let's say someone wants to do a raid for the first time, they get started and have a whole bunch of other first timers and only half of them have mics. They would get so frustrated getting coordinated that half of them will quit. Now that those people quit how are they going to get a replacement? Another random person? What if that person doesn't want to start where the that group is at? Then he/she will leave also right? And what if they next person to join was afk? Just hoping to get carried through, people do this is strike you know... and would most likely do this is the raid. Also I want to say about 20% of the population are just trolls and will just pay around. The only thing that would help people who don't want to use LFG is to put a chat in the tower, and expand the population of the reef and tower to 50 or more people. Since we are dropping legacy consoles hope Bungie can do this. It's so damn easy to get get on a device and go to LFG or go to bungies website to find people also.
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2 RepliesThey need to get the numbers up for ppl doing the raids. Lfg and recruitment isn't working out, maybe the new raid won't be so strict regards roles etc..
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As long as it is optional (don't have to have a full fire team and it won't auto replace fire team if someone leaves an non match made raid. Also it must have filters for the stage, challenge/no, level/completions count that must work for all, and a penalty for leaving too frequently, not if kicked, with vote to kick only available out of combat, and not during a reward claim timer.
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2 RepliesIt would have to have parameters you could set; not unlike Battlefield. Otherwise it couldn't really work well imo. I really don't care either way though. Lfg wouldn't go anywhere and I think matchmaking would be for the lfg outcasts, misfits, kids, trolls, people who aren't very good, etc.
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Walla?
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I have been squarely and staunchly in the pro-matchmaking camp on this issue. So much so that I was met with ninja justice in my last series of posts about it. Which is a bit ironic because I got ninja'd while I was writing a reply to a counter argument from a guardian who made an excellent point - it softened my stance quite a bit. I wish I could tell you his/her name, but that thread is locked for me know. Anyway, the salient point was that while optional matchmaking seems to ensure that no one is affected by any negative effects except those who choose to use the matchmaking, that's only true in the short view. Yes, here and now with the raid content that is currently completed and available, only those who choose matchmaking will be affected by any negative consequences that go with it. But, what about future raid content? If enough people embrace raid matchmaking only to find that all of these predicted problems are real, and then they take to the forums with endless complaint posts . . . Could this lead to a dumbing down of the difficulty, mechanics, and quality of [i]future[/i] raid content? That guardian thought so. I'm inclined to agree. And that [i]would[/i] affect all guardians, even those who [i]don't[/i] choose to embrace raid matchmaking. That said, I still believe that most players who opted into a match made raid would be there for the right reasons, would be willing to learn and listen, and would not just be a troll or AFK. Most of this is just as much of an issue with LFG a anyway. A couple of easy fixes have been suggested - allow player kick by vote, allow minimum level/light level requirement, etc. and the idea of only allowing matchmaking for previous raids is brilliant as well. TL;DR - Allowing raid matchmaking could cause future raid content to be dumbed down and that would affect everyone, but there are answers/ways to allow matchmaking without that happening.
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Just make it an option, simple, bring a fire team or role the dice.
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An in game LFG would be the best solution. You can still post what the group needs, and can still require a MIC, and can kick someone for going AFK, or trolling, being a douche ect. V/S getting that random, who hasn't got a mic, won't join the chat so he can at least follow along with the strat the group is using. Can't kick them ect. Not to mention situations like you join, and find yourself with a group at the last boss. You want the entire raid. You back out because that's not what you feel is best for you. Of course those you left behind are a bit frustrated because that's going to be an issue. Not that this is likely to be a big problem, as a matchmade team is likely not going to get to the last boss.
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Wow we are about 50-50. I disagree with matchmaking. It makes it too casual.
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Edited by Scizmo: 8/28/2016 7:42:44 PMI don't see why we can't have both, but also for strikes too! Why can't I choose to pick a group for me, or let me find my own? Summary: As a user, I want to be able to choose whether or not to utilize matchmaking for strikes and raids. Preconditions: * The user, who is solo or is fireteam leader, has chosen a valid strike or raid destination. Scenario A: Given the system prompts the user When the user selects 'pick for me' Then the system will utilize matchmaking when the user launches the destination. Scenario B: Given the system prompts the user When the user selects 'pick my own' Then the system will disable matchmaking when the user launches the destination.
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Optional matchmaking is fine, that way people can't complain about not knowing what they are getting into
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I don't think its an issue as long as there is a vote to kick option, and the same flexibility in looking for a group as there is in the Private Matches interface.
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1 ReplyI haven't seen a real argument except "I wouldn't use it" against [b][u]OPTIONAL[/u][/b] matchmaking.
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1 ReplyAs long as it is optional. Why not?
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There is no debate when you add OPTIONAL matchmaking.
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3 RepliesOptional matchmaking hell yes. finally I can do raids without the crap that goes with that.
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When a raid is first released, it should have no matchmaking. Once the hard mode version of a raid comes out, normal mode should have matchmaking. Hard mode should get matchmaking once the subsequent raid's release date is announced.
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7 RepliesEdited by Dooodley: 8/28/2016 5:54:05 PMThe con-sayers have obviously never played a MMO with raid matchmaking before. Knowing your role is way more important and challenging in those games yet it somehow works. There are usually also systems in place to make sure that not just anyone can join. Reasonably I'd say that MM should be for people who have already done it before AND/OR can meet a light requirement that is higher than what's needed when going in with a team. So let's say that the minimum req for going in with a fireteam is X, then MM would be X + 10. It's basically to save time for those who do raids every week but don't want to -blam!- around with the shitty #LFG forums on various sites. And why are people against something that would have no effect whatsoever on them? If you're not interested then don't use it. Pretty sure they wouldnt make it so that a fireteam with only 5 players will be forced to play with a random 6th. Waste of resources? I could say the same thing about private matches. I don't know if you have noticed but this is probably the least competitive FPS on the market and the netcode is ruining it for those who want to play it that way. The ONLY good thing about private matches - that will have a positive effect on a larger portion of the population - is that we're finally able to explore the maps before getting thrown in there, most likely in a backfill just after heavy spawn.
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Couldn't care less. But I call it now if mm gets put in raids. Hate posts as following Sick of getting grouped up with scrubs Sick of people rage quitting Bungie make it so people have to have a mic to enter raid Loads more I just can't be bothered writing them all done
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Go ahead, you want raid matchmaking, I don't want to stop you. But when it crashes and burns horribly, I'll be the first to say "told you so".
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2 RepliesEdited by Joker_Karasu: 8/28/2016 6:49:30 PMThe only way I would be ok with raid matchmaking is if it's optional and you could set filters such as min/max light level, # of completions, and a user rating system for people who are great to work with and those who are not so much. It could be good, satisfactory, and bad - rude/unhelpful/etc.
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Optional matchmaking
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1 ReplySorry only read the title as I'm responding from my office (bathroom). Just make it optional. If you want to choose matchmaking just do so with the understanding experiences will vary. Btw if you're wondering if it's #1 or #2 that's none of your business! That means #2 (Macgruber)
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Why the hell not? Just put an option to turn matchmaking on and off.
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Can we stop pleading for matchmaking? There's a superior option that I've only seen considered so often. You want an in-game LFG, not standardized matchmaking. Trust me when I say that you don't want the average strike random to be your random. You want emotes and a social area that are specifically meant for picking up players to do activities. You want a tool that allows you to tailor your team to the activity you're doing. I feel like this has been recommended so little because most that want matchmaking haven't even bothered to try LFG to see how much better it is. Tell me right now how you'll complete endgame activities with 5 other random players with zero coordination. Most people who use LFG currently are taking the initiative and are most likely honest players. ( Some are too honest. Like that guy who thinks you need to wait for the end screen to get exotics. )
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1 ReplyEdited by TOAD 4000: 8/28/2016 4:23:14 PMI voted for all raid to MM. I will never use it because it would be terrible, but if others want it, why not? I will continue to use LFG. I would also like ToO to MM. That way I could jump in and help people get to the lighthouse. Facing me would be a free win on your card! B)
