This game is full with snipers, I don't know what version of Destiny you are playing but it isn't up to date. 1000-Yards run the crucible and shotguns aren't doing anything to be honest. Yes, people can use an No Land or an Universal, but those are primaries and you have to sacrifice your Doctrine and/or exotic slot to use them. Invective regenerate ammo but it's range is extremely inferior to other shotguns. Icebreaker isn't even year 2 and you lose all ammo on death and have to wait for it to regenerate. If you die by a shotgun now, it isn't the shotgun's fault but the player as a shotgun has to get in close to actually confirm a kill. Being sniped at before you even get to breathe isn't a player's fault though. Being afraid to move even an inch isn't a fun experience. I don't think anyone here enjoys being sniped 3 seconds into the game. And if the game wants to be competitive and not a joke, it has to change the meta at least once every 3 months. The problem with the game is that primaries are jokes and snipers are the "go to" weapon as they have no real cons.

Invective is a pretty decent shotgun, I use it sometimes and some people prefer it before others such as party crasher or CT, mostly because of its high rate of fire and ammo regen. If you are constantly getting outgunned by people with other shotguns you are doing it wrong. Ice breaker is perfectly ok in normal crucible which is what most people play anyway. No land beyond is relatively easy to use very effective once you get use to it. And you do need to sacrifice your doctrine if you want to use them, which brings us to another thing, this game is also full of doctrines or fast assault rifles, should we complain about that too? If you are getting sniped all the time try changing your strategy and approach. There is nothing wrong with sniping. I am constantly shutdown by guys with shotguns, yes you can outgun them too in the same thing as those players with snipers. Universal remote is probably on the top 3-5 shotguns used at the moment. Oh, and here are some stats taken from destiny tracker regarding kills in crucible, btw, snipers are not even on the top 5 but guess what is on the top... guess my destiny is up to date after all, might want to check yours 1 Shotgun 3,013,396,197 (13.85%) 2 HandCannon 2,760,426,289 (12.69%) 3 Super 2,510,013,714 (11.54%) 4 Melee 2,298,306,160 (10.57%) 5 AutoRifle 2,106,749,793 (9.69%) 6 Sniper 1,651,278,885 (7.59%)

Again, don't know what Destiny you are playing, maybe classic 6v6? And the Invective argument, in my opinion, it is just outclassed by all other shotguns besides the 4th Horsemen as they just have better range. You are also telling me that shotguns are getting the most kills, more than a primary, and lets not forget that melee is on this list too which is usually comes right after a shotgun shot that doesn't kill. This just further concrete my reason that we don't need special ammo on spawn. Just to make sure we are on the same page, I am talking about when you didn't spawn with special ammo in 3v3.

I am getting those stats from destinytracker and it is the overall crucible stats. I am not making it up, if you dont like them, dont blame me. Just making a point since you seem to be sure that snipers are getting all the kills in crucible. I have no problem outgunning shotties with my invective. None at all, rarely use it but I find it as effective as many others, range wise the invective with send it has as good range (in fact it has exactly the same) as a Conspiracy Theory D (the one you get from completing all those strikes... nightfall etc. I just like my party crasher better, it can hold more rounds and it has better overall stats. Invective is a two shots gun... which is not to my liking. I have presented you with proof that shooties are more common in the crucible, yet you still deny it and tell me the problem is with me... nuff said. I am out.

I looked up your proof and that proof is throughout Destiny's lifespan, not just monthly or year 2. You won't use an Invective because it is a two shot kill gun? Sounds like it is outclassed by those that does it job better. Your experience in crucible won't change my experience in the crucible. ^__^

This is gonna be a long one No, you read what you wanted to read, as usual. I said I prefer my party crasher because my roll is better suited for my play-style. If I am honest my PC is better than invective from my point of view. But I never said invective was the best shotgun, I said you have no problem going against other players with PC/CT as long as you know that it doesnt have the same impact, you also said, and I quote "Invective regenerate ammo but it's range is extremely inferior to other shotguns" which is not true, it might have maybe 5 points less than my PC and pretty sure is the same as the CT. You mentioned very wisely that you should complain about being outgunned by shotguns as they need to get very close, well, same applies to snipers, you just make sure you dont come out in the open. It is impossible to keep moaners happy so it is not really your fault. Thats what most of this community does, complain about getting killed by a super, a sniper, a shotgun, TLW, Plan C, thorn Vex, Suros, etc... Dont get me wrong, some times nerfs are needed and it is ok to try to have a more balanced experienced but it is just every single time that they nerf or buff something I see posts like this. Next they will again remove sniper ammo, another moaner will complain of how overpowered, I dont know, sidearms are, they will then buff shotguns, then someone will complain on how overpower they are they will nerf them and buff fusions, its the never ending story, just adapt to the game and stop moaning, seriously. Now when you are right you are right but IMO I dont think you are. At least I have no problem with snipers, and I snipe and run around with shotguns, primaries etc as well so dont think I am that sniper camping at the spawn. The main thing is that, no matter if they remove secondary ammo or not, there will be other problems, like I said, have you ever come across a good NLB player? they are pretty lethal and can 1 shot you 3 seconds after starting the game as well. And same with an ice breaker (except IB and trials of course). What do you think people would do if they remove special, just put yourself in their position (those annoying players who camp with their snipers),. I already gave you a few thoughts... Please dont reply, and if you do, dont expect me to reply back, I dont see a valid reason in your argument despite that you are angry because you get overplayed by snipers, which believe it or not it happens, and shotguns, and fusions, and supers, and auto rifles, and scout rifles, etc etc etc. Maybe a punch only game mode will be more suited for you?