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6/20/2014 8:41:49 PM
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Do Good men with guns really stop bad men with guns?

[quote] "The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun".[/quote] [quote]The oft-repeated line has become a rallying cry for proponents of looser firearm regulation as well as being a target of derision for those who believe that "good guys" with guns frequently do more harm than good. The recent shooting spree in Las Vegas by two anti-government zealots, and the fate of Joseph Robert Wilcox, has added fuel to that particular fire. Mr Wilcox drew his licensed handgun in an attempt to apprehend Jerad Miller, who had just murdered two police officers at a pizza restaurant across the street. He was shot and killed by Miller's wife, Amanda Miller, an accomplice who Mr Wilcox had not seen approach him from behind. [/quote] [quote]According to the NRA, he says, people like Mr Wilcox are "about the only thing keeping this country from criminal chaos is those good guys with the guns". He says the truth, however, is that multiple studies have found that those who carry guns - even "good guys" - are more likely to be shot than those who are unarmed. In addition, he says, gun-wielding good guys aren't that effective. He notes that a 2008 Rand Corporation report found "the best officers of the nation's biggest and arguably best-trained police department" - the New York Police Department - hit their intended target during gunfights 18% of the time (increasing to 30% when a target isn't returning fire). "While there is little evidence to suggest that carrying a concealed weapon increases (or decreases) crime, it unquestionably raises the likelihood of guns being brandished in public," writes Michael Cohen of the New York Daily News. [/quote] Thoughts?
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  • [quote]He says the truth, however, is that multiple studies have found that those who carry guns - even "good guys" - are more likely to be shot than those who are unarmed.[/quote]Probably because they have guns, and that makes them a primary target. Truth is, we only have isolated incidents to use as data. You won't hear about someone stopping a shooter on national news (except in rare cases), because no one died. Death = news. The Aurora shooting happened in a theater with a no-gun policy. That theater wasn't the closest to the shooter's home, nor was it the largest theater in the area, but it [i]was[/i] the only one labeled as a "gun-free zone". Yet, we don't hear about that tidbit from mainstream news, we just hear about how guns are bad and that we need more laws.
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  • Here's lonepaul trying to prove that a good man with a gun can't protect their own children from him.
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  • People shouldn't attempt to play the hero. However, if they themselves are being attacked, they should be able to protect themselves.
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  • It's a silly thing to think like that, plain and simple. There's a reality that comes with owning a gun, and that at some point, the weapon will be used for the sole purpose it was created. And in that regard, that opens up possibilities for you that you may one day land in. And in that regard, you may not walk out of things in one piece.
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  • Personally, I don't think it's fair to bring that particular incident in Las Vegas into the argument about whether good guys with guns stop bad guys with guns. Wilcox cannot be blamed for failing to subdue both assailants when he was only aware of one. It is unreasonable to expect someone to counter a threat they are unaware of. That said, yes, sometimes good guys with guns do not successfully stop bad guys with guns. It is inevitable, statistically speaking, because humans are not perfect. However, good guys with guns can make a difference, but that does not always mean saving everyone. Sometimes it means minimizing the damage by buying time. Like the locks on your doors, they can deter all, but the most determined of criminals. Someone truly hellbent on causing damage will plan so that they have as many advantages as possible. As for the accuracy of the NYPD, that is true. Many factors influence where your shots will land; steadiness of your body, the caliber you're firing, the length of the barrel, light conditions, wind, the list goes on. It is astonishing to me that many people think they can just pick up a gun and hit what they aim at. It takes practice, and not just standing at an air conditioned range, firing at a stationary target, with all the time in the world to take your shot. The mandatory safety course (for a license) where I grew up requires participation in International Defensive Pistol Association (IDPA) matches. You work your way through a timed stage, modeled to be everyday locations (stores, restaurants, etc.), shooting from cover, with good and bad guy targets. In order to own a pistol, you need to pass with a certain score, in order to carry a pistol, you need a better score. If you can't handle your gun safely in a dangerous situation, you don't get to carry it in public because you may do more harm than good. Is it perfect? No, but it's better than some other places that just do a background check over the phone and give you a license to carry with no training. My two cents.
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    1 Reply
    • It depends. If you don't have a gun I don't need one to stop you from being a pedo.
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    • Ahh, back to this shit and posting lolBBC articles. Yeah, please leave like you said.
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    • Iv actually missed your American bashing, welcome back.
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      7 Replies
      • You'd have to be an idiot to think otherwise
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      • I don't know but what I do know is [spoiler] good men with guns can stop pedos with sausage[/spoiler]
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      • >complains on how he gets harassed due to his constant baiting >instantly starts baiting
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        1 Reply
        • I thought you were leaving? And see, this is why people harassed you. Don't change the subject!
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          7 Replies
          • I guarantee you that words won't stop bullets.
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          • A good guy can stop a bad guy maybe but prob a lot of collateral damage
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          • 0
            Ktan Dantaktee
            Ktan Dantaktee

            WELCOME TO THE RICE FIELDS - old

            Yes, I believe good men with guns DO stop bad men with guns. By banning guns, you're just stopping the good men from having guns; the bad men will just find a way to buy them regardless of laws.
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          • Dont overthink or bring in agendas. Keep it simple. Here's a scenario: Man walks into a movie theater with semi automatic rifle and starts blasting away at people. How can anyone stop him? Well, the most preferable response would be someone else with a gun that can match him at his own game and neutralize him. If not that, then someone who is capable with throwing knives/ knife and has finesse. That's my personal preference for myself. It's basic logic that gun nuts use for their agenda.
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          • *must control urges*
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          • 0
            It did in Oregon
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