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originally posted in:Secular Sevens
Edited by HurtfulTurkey:
8/14/2013 3:02:45 PM
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Premise 1 is inaccurate; generally, modern Christians believe children that die before a certain, undefined age go to heaven out of the mercy of God. A more mystic belief is that they go to a non-Purgatory, temporary realm that's neither heaven nor hell.
Premise 4 is flawed because loving others more than yourself does not mean sacrificing your own salvation. You'll notice that Jesus never sinned to save anyone. In addition, Premise 3 is incorrect because Christian doctrine is generally of justification by faith, meaning that a mother that kills her children may very well go to heaven. However, following this reasoning indicates the person never really understood their faith.
So the only correct premise is #2, and the logically appropriate action a Christian should take would be to help guide their children spiritually. At face-value this question sounds somewhat reasonable, but it really just doesn't hold up to even the slightest scrutiny. I would argue that most Christians do not, in fact, believe 1-3 are true.
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Edited by die wily: 8/14/2013 9:23:21 PMThanks for this response, probably the best one I've seen so far. [quote]Premise 1 is inaccurate; generally, modern Christians believe children that die before a certain, undefined age go to heaven out of the mercy of God. A more mystic belief is that they go to a non-Purgatory, temporary realm that's neither heaven nor hell.[/quote]I'm not entirely sure how this affects the argument. Allowing children to grow up *still* needlessly puts them at risk for Hell. [quote]Premise 4 is flawed because loving others more than yourself does not mean sacrificing your own salvation[/quote]I'd agree to this. Parents have no moral obligation to do their children the kindness that murdering-them appears to be, especially from a Christian "do not sin" perspective. [quote]In addition, Premise 3 is incorrect because Christian doctrine is generally of justification by faith, meaning that a mother that kills her children may very well go to heaven.[/quote]Wait, so you can kill your children, get them into heaven early-and-for-certain, and then still be able to *potentially* get into heaven too? I'm not seeing a down-side (other than, you know, violating a Commandment, but what negative consequence does that have?). [quote]However, following this reasoning indicates the person never really understood their faith. [/quote]This seems to be the crux of your post, but I don't understand what you mean by it. [quote]So the only correct premise is #2, and the logically appropriate action a Christian should take would be to help guide their children spiritually.[/quote]*If* they are already old enough to sin, I might agree. A broader question appears to me: why don't Christians ever kill people that are praying, to ensure that they go to heaven, a la Hamlet?
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Addressing your question about a murderer going to heaven: it would require legitimate repentance, which couldn't be achieved if the person did not recognize that what they did was wrong. So you would do it, believing that it is a morally justifiable action, and then you'd have to recognize that it was in fact not morally justified. Generally, Christian doctrine doesn't permit flip flopping from saved and unsaved...If sinful behavior continues willingly, then they probably never really made a commitment. It's hard to explain and I'm writing on my phone, so I'll try to make a better reply when I get home.
