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#Septagon

6/3/2013 8:10:14 PM
53

Bnext: The Loss of Community Both Public and Private

When Bnet turned into Bnext, a lot of us were scared. The site is now unrecognizable from what it was previously. It was this change in features we had all grown accustomed to that upset most of us. However over time, many people began to accept this change- as we all knew we would. Yet the things we cried out for were not the things in most trouble. The biggest issues with Bnext were the long term effects- two of which in particular led to the death of the feeling of community. On Bnet, we were divided into forums. Sure we have tags now, but I for one no longer think of them as forums (largely since I search by 'all topics' and nothing else). This separation led to a sense of community with the others that shared your forum. For a large part of my Bnet career, I counted myself a member of the Halo 3 forum, and not to sound cocky but anybody visiting that forum any time before 2010 probably saw me at some point. After that point, though I mixed forums quite frequently, the Halo 3 forum died down and I went to the Community Forum as my main place. Then I counted myself as a member of the Community Forum. A large number of users count themselves as Floodians as they ventured primarily into the Flood forum. Each place had its own atmosphere and set of 'what is and is not acceptable.' Each place had something for someone to feel like they were in a distinct community, though we were all part of the Bnet community. Then there were Private Groups. These groups let us customize our experience akin to how we can customize public forums now. We had the ability to make our own rules and decide who we see and interact with. We could become parts of smaller communities and become much closer to those people. Private Groups sustained many users over the Darkness and became a home to rest in as we waited it out. Some groups suffered from the drought of activity while others became simply secluded, providing their members with a 'close environment.' Both the sense of individual public communities and private communities disappeared with Bnext. When Bnext arrived, I felt like I was in a sea of people. There was no way to filter the carnage, no way to simply talk with the forum community I had grown accustomed to over the years in the Community Forum. With Private Groups, I felt like many or all were dead to me. The darkness hurt many groups, but Bnext struck the final blow. Groups lost tons of features that made them worth going to, and were pushed out of the way. People stopped going to groups and many of them died, as I'm sure most site veterans can attest to. Some are returning, and some hung on by a thread and are still on the edge, but both of those numbers are pitiful compared to the number that fell. I had hoped, over time, both these senses of community would be restored. They have not. I still feel like a blank face in a sea of people. I barely ever see the same names as I did on OldBnet. Private groups still lack features and prominence needed to bring them back. And this kills me when I have invested so much time and effort into some groups. I pray Bungie can do something to bring back this sense of community. ________________________________________________________________________ On its own, that would easily be enough for a thread. But I am not done yet. I feel obligated to try and fix the problem myself, and I make this thread also in the hope many of you will feel the same, having hated the loss you felt when your community was stripped from you. I like Bnext a lot more than I did five months ago (it was January, right?). But I want to feel like I'm part of something again, and I hope you all do too. So what can we do to fix these two losses of community? For Public Community, we need something to make people feel like more than just a face. Months ago we were told veteran site users would be recognized, and many of us took this to mean member titles would return. I feel like that would be a great thing to have back. It would restore a sense of identity to those of us that have outlasted the darkness. We need[i] something[/i] to make people feel like they are involved. Member Titles were for fun, and the elitism was near all satirical in nature, but maybe that is the answer. I feel like dragging it out until Destiny would be harmful to the community. Not only do people here still feel like they are just one of many, but surely new people coming to this site would see such things and thing to themselves that this something they can strive for. The longer we wait, the worse it is, I feel. What else could we do? We could give burritosenior his spinning mustache bomb. Continue, what are our other options? I feel like the ability to customize tag searches would be invaluable. It might sound silly, but I would love the ability to customize what forums I see. I don't mean one tag at a time though, like we have now. For instance, I would like to be able to search for all tags except '#offtopic' and '#destiny' in one search. Then I could search for #Flood to find threads by more veteran site members (since people that have been here a while to form a sense of community undoubtedly use the old forum names as tags- in this case I use #septagon to signify where this thread would have gone before) and #offtopic to look through the entire Flood, all the while searching for gaming, community, support, etc. without having to see the flood of offtopic and Destiny threads. This little bit of extra customization would, I believe, go a long way to making me feel like there's a sense of community again, as I would see a lot more of the same faces when I went into certain groups of tags instead of having to single them out one by one or have the flood of 'all topics.' Private Groups. I believe they really need their member titles back for sure. That was a way to personalize groups and make them feel unique. I don't really feel I need to explain that one. The big thing for me is... Private Groups having public threads, which also ties in to people 'following' groups. I simply disagree with the direction Bungie went with this. OK yes, it is a remarkably cool idea in concept. Private Groups can advertise while also appeal to people that follow groups instead of joining, etc. But the whole 'limit of 10 groups and follow the rest instead of joining' just completely killed things for me. I left groups I wanted to stay in just because I wanted the option of having other groups in an evolving community. And yet I don't feel any more involved in these groups. On the contrary, I feel like a stranger. With groups having the option to make threads public, it's always a debate between... do you want to make people aware of the group, or should there be a reason to join at all? If groups make most threads public, then there's no reason to actually become part of that community. You can just browse the forums like normal and see those threads. Why would you even follow a group at this point when you can see everything they do without the effort? On the other hand, if they make few to no threads public, there's really little way to discover groups now. Furthermore, you don't know if a group is really worth joining since you can only have 10 groups and many people probably don't want to waste a slot on a group that is only a 'maybe' when your 10 slots are full. Essentially, what it comes down to is that following a group is more or less pointless now, and public Private Group threads have helped kill inner-group activity and discouraged membership. This thread consists of thoughts I have had on the matter of the sense of Bnet Community disappearing. If anybody has thoughts or stories of their own, I would be grateful if you would share them. I would adore it if Bungie would somehow restore our senses of unity, as I still feel like dust in the wind. Thank you.

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  • Gather ‘round, lovelies. Let me preface this by saying a few things: First off, generalizations will be made. That’s how this works and I think that many of you are capable of putting two and two together. Regarding the idea of groups and the small communities within, I understand that real people are involved. Relationships are forged and lives are changed. I’ve been going here since I was a child. I credit my getting through some very dark times in my life to this site. I understand how strong these bonds are and I’ve maintained friendships originally forged through groups on this site. Some groups dissolved before the darkness or .next, but those relationships remain. Here’s the thing: many groups are created to be some sort of “refuge from the public forums” during the later years of Bungie.old. People wanted that because the public forums had ridiculous amounts of rules and many people who didn’t heed them anyway. It was quite a bit chaotic. Yes, they had character and they had an identity (see: Flood), but people still wanted that controlled environment. Groups provided that. And sometimes the outlined purpose would be a bit more specific: forge discussion, sci-fi, etc. But the point was to control the discussion area for whatever the group founder wanted. And for Bungie.old, that was fine. But it also pointed out some severe issues with Bungie.old that would not be acceptable for Bungie.next. So now, that controlled environment or “safe haven” is now available in the public forums and groups are redesigned to serve a new purpose, although that detail is still in the making. Granted, it’s difficult to figure out how to utilize groups for their new purpose without having the product they’re designed to accompany (Destiny) available. Remember, this whole place is under construction. Objectively, this explains why many groups are gone. The group system and public forums are no longer compatible with the ideas of bungie.old groups. There are other factors for people leaving, the main one being not wanting to deal with the new site/holding out for improvements (each to his own). But there are some very specific groups that even before the darkness evolved outside the confines of serving the purpose of fixing what people didn’t like about the public forums. So, let’s take slightly different direction from my original reply for this one. Let’s not go with leaving Bungie.net completely, but a group evolving in to a community that is no longer dependent on the design state of Bungie.net to exist. Groups that survived managed to do this. Groups that remained dependent on Bungie.old to exist died. They could not, in theory, serve their purpose any longer. Keep in mind that this encompasses several types of groups that were meant for discussion that was difficult to have on the old public forums, but are now possible. The purpose of many groups became irrelevant with Bungie.next, but the relationships and people remained. And I honestly think that if a different website was enough to drive a group apart in such a dramatic manner, I would question the stability of that little community. Maybe it had its glory days at one point, but, as I’ve stated previously, maybe it wasn’t meant to stick around and remain relevant in the face of a public forum that now has massive amounts of potential for being the haven that members once sought in private groups on the old site. I’m not going to argue that this is the best situation for the Bungie community as a whole. If more groups had survived, it would have meant that maybe they could have grown to accompany the Destiny community wonderfully. And I feel that the groups who did survive have great potential to do so. Granted, the vast majority of groups that have survived aren’t buzzing with the activity they were once used to. This is likely due to the mass confusion and general slower traffic the site is seeing. Additionally, these groups need evaluate where they want to go in the long run, especially in the face of the new faces and community culture that Destiny will bring in. I feel that there are things that desperately need improvement in these new systems, and many groups can feel a bit lost using a system that’s meant for a product that we don’t understand yet. That is going to put us all in a situation where everybody is going to lose. And remember, groups have come and gone long before Bungie.next and it hurts to see these little communities disassemble as a casualty of time and change in Bungie.net format & culture. This situation was on a much greater and drastic scale, and it’s jarring for many of us. Now here’s the meaner part: I work as a director for an offsite organization that relies on the presence of a stable community to keep sponsors around. In order to entice new people and keep current members, my organization needs to offer a unique and relevant incentive for people to join. Originally, the organization was to be an online refuge for players to form bonds in a safe environment safe from rampant sexual harassment online. But as more organizations started to pop up and the online atmosphere began to improve, we realized that we wanted to remain as a relevant community. So we evolved our purpose. We started programs to teach people how to work at industry events like PAX or MLG. We’re still around today. The point is we had to evolve our purpose in the face of a changing platform and culture in order to stick around. I feel that the things that we went through rings true for groups here. Many groups had a great thing going, but were objectively no longer necessary with the advent of a customizable public forum. I understand the OP’s sense of loss and expressed grief. I grew up here and I’ve seen groups of people leave altogether that really stung. As a community, we need to drop our continual refusal to accept this kind of change. Better yet, we need to articulate what we need to improve upon a system that needed to change for this new game. It’s not going back to what it was like on the old site. But if we communicate beyond a dialogue of nostalgia and pleas to revert things back, we can revive the sense of belonging that works with a new platform that was needed. I stand by what I previously said, but perhaps now that I’m not sleep deprived, my point will be clearer.

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