Sorry about raining on your parade... But mine's better. :3 [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rK3KDNkKhFM&list=UUVozOD6mJH1CW_bdZVaoTbA&index=1&feature=plcp[/url] [Edited on 08.20.2012 7:56 PM PDT]

That feel when you're discovering an awesome game.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] InvasionImminent [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] chickenlittle I'm tempted to make a thread comparing aspects of the two games. It would be a long, continually growing list.[/quote] My brain hurts thinking of the ridiculous things I'll have to defend...[/quote]You can admit defeat now instead of defending a lost cause.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] InvasionImminent [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Sliding Ghost Lone Wolf = a dozen dead Spartans with no dead Covies + a thousand Generals despite the situation requiring Zealots (as seen by the Field Marshal and his Zealots being deployed) and Zealots being present in the ending cutscene = nonsense[/quote] Maybe the dropship didn't drop any troops but fought using the auto-turrets? Obviously this isn't implemented in the gameplay of the mission due to gameplay reasons.[/quote]That doesn't account for all those other areas with dead troopers that are occupied by Grunts.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] chickenlittle I'm tempted to make a thread comparing aspects of the two games. It would be a long, continually growing list.[/quote] My brain hurts thinking of the ridiculous things I'll have to defend...

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Sliding Ghost Lone Wolf = a dozen dead Spartans with no dead Covies + a thousand Generals despite the situation requiring Zealots (as seen by the Field Marshal and his Zealots being deployed) and Zealots being present in the ending cutscene = nonsense[/quote] Maybe the dropship didn't drop any troops but fought using the auto-turrets? Obviously this isn't implemented in the gameplay of the mission due to gameplay reasons.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] chickenlittle I'm tempted to make a thread comparing aspects of the two games. It would be a long, continually growing list.[/quote]Sounds heavenly.

I'm tempted to make a thread comparing aspects of the two games. It would be a long, continually growing list.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] chickenlittle Reach was just a big -blam!- mess whichever way you look at it. It was either incompetence or intentional sabotage of the franchise.[/quote]Sabotage. Reach Spec Ops Elites are just renamed Stealth Elites. The reason why [i]true[/i] Spec Ops Elites aren't needed is because every Elite throws grenades. Also because Reach's plot is just -blam!-. They wouldn't fit in without making Noble Team look like incompetents. And that's where Zealots come in, wearing Spec Ops style armor and carrying out their operations. The only Spec ops Elite in Reach that could be considered a true one was the one with the data pad at the beginning of Winter Contingency. [Edited on 07.23.2012 4:46 AM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Dark Hunter 2100 What was incredibly stupid is that Generals weren't generals at all. REAL generals don't come in mass, you wouldn't just order the leader of each platoon to come and a kill a spartan...without your platoon. Zealots are the supposed commandos of the elites, anyway.[/quote]Even if they weren't meant to be like human generals, they're almost always seen commanding infantry. A wave of only Generals in campaign is still ridiculous. I hope H4 restores their rightful place. Generals didn't deserve their spot. Generals never appear in cutscenes (ONI's opening cutscene may have just one) and are never identified as high priority enemies (compared to the Zealots). Generals are just another Ultra Elite. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Dark Hunter 2100 What I like about CE more than Reach is that, in CE the ranks were simpler and properly spread: minor, major, spec ops, zealots. In the game each class had more of a population than the next. More minors than majors, for the most part more majors than spec ops, and more spec ops then zealots. NOT the case in Reach. I feel like I fight 10 officers for every minor I fight, and majors don't even exist. Too few Spec Ops for my taste, and far too many generals.[/quote]Yep. The ranks in CE were done marvelously well. Major: fired in short accurate bursts Spec Ops: fired in longer accurate bursts, threw grenades, never berserked, took cover a lot Zealot: fired in long accurate bursts to the point of overheating, sometimes ignored danger running right through plasma grenades, berserked a lot, were super fast, could leap melee, had insane rof (give them a pistol in Halo PC. They wreck with it) There was a lot of distinction compared to Reach's EEDLDASFDSWDKTMC (every Elite does lethal damage and are super fast damage sponges who don't know the meaning of cover) and H2's Elites. H2's rank variety was good but the implementation was just terrible; the lack of distinction is disappointing. Heretics - only difference (that is not a glitch) from regular Elites is their weapons. They use Carbines, swords, Sentinel Beams. I tried to do something about the Heretics to make them more interesting but it wasn't much: I made them throw grenades, pull out swords when they got close to an enemy or lost their shield, fixed their melee, and gave them jump like Reach Elite Rangers. Still, they were much more fun than the originals. You know how Flood leap like crazy? That's how fun it is. Councilors - only difference from Ultras is that they never appear as enemies. Zealots - only major distinction is that they can't use vehicles and always spawn with a sword. And those are just a few examples. Only about 4 of the Elite ranks are truly unique: -Spec Ops (scripted cloak in certain situations, grenade throwing) -Ultras (sword pulling, very fast shield recharge) -Stealth Elites (always cloaked, super fast shield recharge rate) -Rangers (they fly) [Edited on 07.23.2012 4:40 AM PDT]

Reach was just a big -blam!- mess whichever way you look at it. It was either incompetence or intentional sabotage of the franchise.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Sliding Ghost Yeah I remember that area with the dead marines and Hunter. *still wishing for Lone Wolf to be fixed* Lone Wolf = a dozen dead Spartans with no dead Covies + a thousand Generals despite the situation requiring Zealots (as seen by the Field Marshal and his Zealots being deployed) and Zealots being present in the ending cutscene = nonsense[/quote] Indeed, that was a blunder by Bungie, no dead enemies there. What was incredibly stupid is that Generals weren't generals at all. REAL generals don't come in mass, you wouldn't just order the leader of each platoon to come and a kill a spartan...without your platoon. Zealots are the supposed commandos of the elites, anyway. Most of the campaign and firefight seems to go along with the idea, but Lone Wolf breaks that. Canonically, there should be roughly 1 general for every 5 zealots in the Covenant. Makes NO sense in Lone Wolf What I like about CE more than Reach is that, in CE the ranks were simpler and properly spread: minor, major, spec ops, zealots. In the game each class had more of a population than the next. More minors than majors, for the most part more majors than spec ops, and more spec ops then zealots. NOT the case in Reach. I feel like I fight 10 officers for every minor I fight, and majors don't even exist. Too few Spec Ops for my taste, and far too many generals.

Yeah I remember that area with the dead marines and Hunter. *still wishing for Lone Wolf to be fixed* Lone Wolf = a dozen dead Spartans with no dead Covies + a thousand Generals despite the situation requiring Zealots (as seen by the Field Marshal and his Zealots being deployed) and Zealots being present in the ending cutscene = nonsense

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] chickenlittle [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Sliding Ghost Also, if Reach marines are so great, why are there so many dead troopers all over the place? This has been a problem since H2 but it is the most prevalent in Reach. Dead friendly AI but no dead enemy AI. Not even a single Grunt. Only 3 enemies killed by UNSC before you arrive, in the entire campaign: -1 [b]sword[/b] wielding Ultra Elite on LNoS, allegedly killed by a shotgun wielder. This is most likely an easter egg like the Thirsty Grunt due to it's uniqueness -2 Zealots killed by Emile [/quote]There was some of that in CE too. Most of the Marine weapons caches were just dead Marines, but most often there would be dead Covenant and Flood together. And most of the caches actually incited you to believe they died of overwhelming odds, e.g. the Marines and a dead Hunter in the cavern on AotCR. Though I do remember one area in Halo 2, where there were dead Jackals, Grunts, and Marines hidden away on Outskirts. And they were all laying the same direction....[/quote] Maybe the marines killed the grunts and jackals and advanced forward, only to come back and be killed

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Sliding Ghost Also, if Reach marines are so great, why are there so many dead troopers all over the place? This has been a problem since H2 but it is the most prevalent in Reach. Dead friendly AI but no dead enemy AI. Not even a single Grunt. Only 3 enemies killed by UNSC before you arrive, in the entire campaign: -1 [b]sword[/b] wielding Ultra Elite on LNoS, allegedly killed by a shotgun wielder. This is most likely an easter egg like the Thirsty Grunt due to it's uniqueness -2 Zealots killed by Emile [/quote]There was some of that in CE too. Most of the Marine weapons caches were just dead Marines, but most often there would be dead Covenant and Flood together. And most of the caches actually incited you to believe they died of overwhelming odds, e.g. the Marines and a dead Hunter in the cavern on AotCR. Though I do remember one area in Halo 2, where there were dead Jackals, Grunts, and Marines hidden away on Outskirts. And they were all laying the same direction....

Just saying Geez

Also, if Reach marines are so great, why are there so many dead troopers all over the place? This has been a problem since H2 but it is the most prevalent in Reach. Dead friendly AI but no dead enemy AI. Not even a single Grunt. Only 3 enemies killed by UNSC before you arrive, in the entire campaign: -1 [b]sword[/b] wielding Ultra Elite on LNoS, allegedly killed by a shotgun wielder. This is most likely an easter egg like the Thirsty Grunt due to it's uniqueness -2 Zealots killed by Emile [Edited on 07.22.2012 1:00 AM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Water Beetle Beware though, never let a marine in a ghost, they will betray you recklessly. I once got trapped at a checkpoint by one. When I spawned, I was instantly splattered by a marine, forcing me to restart the mission. [/quote]1. Don't blame the marines for not recognizing allies. Even the enemies do it. This is an old game and comparing it to newer Halo games so deeply is laughable. 2. Vehicle physics may have been inconsistent but they are far better than Reach. Stable hog physics is one redeeming factor. 3. the checkpoint system has always sucked. If CE had 'second to last revert by dying 5 times' like in the newer Halo games, I'm sure you'd find something else to complain about... [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Water Beetle In Halo 2 I have been betrayed by marines many times with warthogs and rocket launchers, [/quote]Marine hog driving in H2 is strictly scripted. Player proximity dictates when they stop and it's not easy for them to stop without colliding with the player... This also exists in Reach. The evidence is pretty damn obvious: [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKwy5rnyLmQ[/url] [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6ZNyKG0lcE[/url] It was accounted for in H3, where collision by your marine driver just depletes your shield. Rarely do you get splattered by them. Nonetheless, this problem has yet to be fixed, and isolating a few cases in CE from the multitude of cases in newer Halo games is just wrong. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Water Beetle and in the Storm, I have been killed by hornets, rockets and missile pods.[/quote]That wasn't a well executed Scarab battle. Since it's a Scarab battle, it's an isolated event. Can't be compared to the above. Vehicular battle =/ Scarab battle Bring up a bad moment from Tsavo Highway, The Ark, or The Covenant that doesn't involve Scarabs. You can't. H3 driving physics were the most consistent of all the Halo games (though the hog wasn't good at splatter, flipped easily though not as much as Reach's hog...). [Edited on 07.21.2012 11:18 PM PDT]

I've found that those who play CE after the other Halos find it quite disappointing. I was be of those, but I still think its a good game. Beware though, never let a marine in a ghost, they will betray you recklessly. I once got trapped at a checkpoint by one. When I spawned, I was instantly splattered by a marine, forcing me to restart the mission. Appalling marine AI was never really fixed until Reach. I know Ghost has a lot of issues with marines in Reach, but personally, I've never been betrayed by one, and that's good enough for me. In Halo 2 I have been betrayed by marines many times with warthogs and rocket launchers, and in the Storm, I have been killed by hornets, rockets and missile pods. Good luck!

Never played CE huh? Then you will taste pure Halo. The most immersive Halo campaign experience (i.e. try meleeing infection forms. You can actually hit them. Try to assassinate an Elite after he tries to melee you. Their melee radius is big so you can't just sidestep them). AI are way better than in any other Halo game. Enemies don't need crutches and allies aren't completely worthless; often, it's worth saving them and they'll last longer than in any other Halo game if you help. Enemies are designed to fight both you and your allies I.e. Jackals do a rolling dodge that gives marines opportunity to hit them CE marines ain't no pushovers. They're not just distractions or moving ammo (like in Reach). AI are very believable. They have variety of responses. They aren't generic like in other Halo games where it's almost always berserking, almost always panicking, almost always kamikaze, almost always charging. In those Halo games, the AI's waiting animations are far more interesting than the AI itself. In CE, all animations are interesting and unique (i.e. when you melee, you will always do the same melee animation. In other Halo games, when you melee, it's random). The difficulty is well balanced. There is more emphasis on enemy numbers than there is on odds. That is the first step to success and I hope H4 is following this route because I am tired of bs. Comrade, when you begin your journey, you will enter a world of transcendence, without illusions, and may discover unprecedented secrets; it's still happening today. [Edited on 07.21.2012 7:50 AM PDT]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] onthawan I've never played Halo: CE before and in turn, I have no idea of how the Halo storyline goes![/quote] Jaw dropped. I hope you're enjoying it. It's probably the best Halo imo.