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3/18/2011 1:30:35 AM
4954
The Arab Spring (Tunisia, Libya, Egypt,Yemen,Syria)UPDATE 433
This thread was started after the [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council]UNSC[/url] approved the no-flyzone over Libya, and mostly follows the events surrounding The Arab Spring that began in Tunisia, on the fateful day a man was denied his fruit cart, and spread across the Arab world in a push for democratic reform.
[url=http://www.youtube.com/user/aljazeeraenglish#p/u/1/ULw5lUG5wl0] AlJazeera LIVE[/url]
[url=http://blogs.aljazeera.net/liveblog/libya]Current LIVE Blog On Libya Courtesy of AlJazeera[/url]
[url=http://blogs.aljazeera.net/liveblog/Yemen]Current LIVE Blog on Yemen Courtesy of AlJazeera[/url]
[url=http://blogs.aljazeera.net/liveblog/Syria]Current LIVE Blog on Syria Courtesy of AlJazeera[/url]
[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world/africa/]BBC Africa[/url]
[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world/middle_east/]BBC Middle East[/url]
[url=http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/]CBC World News[/url]
[quote][/quote]
As people seem to still be posting here, I will add this updates again as i see them rather than creating a new thread, if you guys keep posting i'll keep updating.
[u]LIBYA[/u]
Gaddafi is dead. He was captured after a NATO plane hit his convoy escaping Sirte after the rebels took it earlier today, heavily wounded, he was taken to a hospital in Misurata where he succumbed to his wounds. NATO has confirmed that they hit the convoy, but has not directly seen the body yet.
it's worth noting that some other sources say he died under different circumstances, killed by NTC forces in Sirte when found, shot in the head, or shot in both legs and dieing of blood loss. All that is confirmed is he is dead and taken to a location in Misurata
17:01 10/21
[u]LIBYA[/u]
The NTC is allowing for the UN to send a 3rd party investigative group to look into the circumstances of Gaddafi's death, after questions were raised by Russia suggesting Gaddafi was executed rather than killed in a crossfire during his trip to hospital in Misurata
the NTC maintains he died in crossfire when a firefight broke out around the ambulance he was being carried in.
09:09 10/24
[u]TUNISIA[/u]
Due to a massive voter turn out (more than 90% of the country) election results will be announced later today or early tomorrow, due to the extra time needed to count the votes. The Election committee did not expect such enthusiastic turnout and were caught unprepared.
The views of the currently leading al Nahda party can be found [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renaissance_Party#Political_positions]here[/url]. They are pro-western, and follow a Malaysian/Turkish model for allowing Islam to exist but refusing to allow extremism in rule.
[u]LIBYA[/u]
The NTC has called for an investigation into how Gaddafi died, after allegations going both ways have emerged.
The NTC also Announced Libya's formal Liberation yesterday, and said elections will happen in the next 6 to 8 months
Gaddafi's second son Saadi, fled to Niger and has been arrested by authorities there. They will hand him over to the NTC.
[u]EGYPT[/u]
Parliamentary elections are to be held in a matter of weeks, and Presidential Elections to be held in early 2013. There is growing concern in the populous that the SCAF will only allow people to run who had connections to the Mubarak regime, resulting in no change. People are stirring and suggestions of armed revolution in the coming months are floating.
[u]YEMEN[/u]
The Yemeni government has accepted and agreed to a UNSC resolution that called for Saleh to step down in exchange for immunity, and that condemned the Government's crack down.
The government said they would work with the UN on this matter.
[u]Syria[/u]
The US has withdrawn it's ambassador for security reasons and closed it's embassy in Syria, It is one of the last to do so from western nations.
Thanks for paying attention to these major world events, a country's journey to freedom requires the support of the entire world, and even just paying attention helps.
[quote][/quote]
[Edited on 10.24.2011 8:09 AM PDT]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Ultermarto [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ExquisiteDragon [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Ultermarto [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] lonepaul2441 Is it sad that im not surprised by those American officials actions? The US has always been trying to keep somebody they like power even at the cost of lives and they are no different to Russia or China in that respect. And they are doing it under the nose of their Allies to. (Yes im aware it was a small group of people in America help Gaddafi).[/quote] mhm. With no offence to the states, America's government seems to be showing more and more corruption as the world unfolds itself.[/quote]Republicans....I'm not joking. Back on topic or me, the U.S. needs to be more careful when supporting any more nations. [/quote] I think before we draw any conclusions about this we need to know why the individuals tried to support Gaddafi. Furthermore I remind you that there is no law against supporting someone, even him.[/quote]Self preservation. we supported the Taliban to halt the spread of Communism...who's to say we're not doing it again. Also, there may be no law against it but you can bet your ass that there are consequences. The Feds can't fall back on the excuse like "oh, we didn't know he was a -blam!- maniac". If someone like me can second guess who is a sociopath than I'm damn sure the Feds can profile someone like Gadaffi. [Edited on 09.01.2011 6:10 AM PDT]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ExquisiteDragon [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Ultermarto [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] lonepaul2441 Is it sad that im not surprised by those American officials actions? The US has always been trying to keep somebody they like power even at the cost of lives and they are no different to Russia or China in that respect. And they are doing it under the nose of their Allies to. (Yes im aware it was a small group of people in America help Gaddafi).[/quote] mhm. With no offence to the states, America's government seems to be showing more and more corruption as the world unfolds itself.[/quote]Republicans....I'm not joking. Back on topic or me, the U.S. needs to be more careful when supporting any more nations. [/quote] I think before we draw any conclusions about this we need to know why the individuals tried to support Gaddafi. Furthermore I remind you that there is no law against supporting someone, even him.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Ultermarto [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] lonepaul2441 Is it sad that im not surprised by those American officials actions? The US has always been trying to keep somebody they like power even at the cost of lives and they are no different to Russia or China in that respect. And they are doing it under the nose of their Allies to. (Yes im aware it was a small group of people in America help Gaddafi).[/quote] mhm. With no offence to the states, America's government seems to be showing more and more corruption as the world unfolds itself.[/quote]Republicans....I'm not joking. Back on topic or me, the U.S. needs to be more careful when supporting any more nations.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Ultermarto [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] lonepaul2441 Is it sad that im not surprised by those American officials actions? The US has always been trying to keep somebody they like power even at the cost of lives and they are no different to Russia or China in that respect. And they are doing it under the nose of their Allies to. (Yes im aware it was a small group of people in America help Gaddafi).[/quote] mhm. With no offence to the states, America's government seems to be showing more and more corruption as the world unfolds itself.[/quote] My guess is they've been like that for a while but we as the public are only starting to realise due to wikileaks and easier forms of information that are harder to tamper with
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] lonepaul2441 Is it sad that im not surprised by those American officials actions? The US has always been trying to keep somebody they like power even at the cost of lives and they are no different to Russia or China in that respect. And they are doing it under the nose of their Allies to. (Yes im aware it was a small group of people in America help Gaddafi).[/quote] mhm. With no offence to the states, America's government seems to be showing more and more corruption as the world unfolds itself.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Phoenix1330 [u]LIBYA[/u] It appears that some high level American officials had directly contributed to trying to keep the Gaddafi Regime in power, according to documents found in the head of intelligence's office. The documents show that David Welch, the ex-Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs, and Congressman Dennis Kucinich, were still in contact with the Gaddafi regime and were advising them on how to win the propaganda war and how to protect Saif al-Islam(Gaddfi's son and war criminal) They met as recently as August 2nd with the Gaddafi head of Intelligence who is also a wanted war criminal. They also were prepared to take international legal action against NATO support for the NTC, and the rebellion. [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bgscOtHDrI&feature=player_embedded] Video report on the issue[/url] [/quote] Oh ffs. Why did they support the Gaddafi reigeme?
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ONPD [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ExquisiteDragon There's a rumor going around that Rebels have cornered Gaddafi in a small village. Though his eldest son refutes this. [/quote] Source? I call BS[/quote]MSNBC this morning on TV. I'm searching for a related article but I also call BS. That guy is long gone. [url=http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/home2/52495929-183/gadhafi-rebels-rebel-bani.html.csp]Found it.[/url] [Edited on 09.01.2011 4:06 AM PDT]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ExquisiteDragon There's a rumor going around that Rebels have cornered Gaddafi in a small village. Though his eldest son refutes this. [/quote] Source? I call BS
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There's a rumor going around that Rebels have cornered Gaddafi in a small village. Though his eldest son refutes this.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Xd00999 Why would Welch and Kucinich want to help Gaddafi? They must be smart enough to know that supporting Gaddafi's sinking ship just means they will get dragged down as well. Trying to attack NATO and the NTC in court would be a very bad mistake, it would just make them look bad.[/quote]maybe they had some sort of personal investment at stake /guessing
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Why would Welch and Kucinich want to help Gaddafi? They must be smart enough to know that supporting Gaddafi's sinking ship just means they will get dragged down as well. Trying to attack NATO and the NTC in court would be a very bad mistake, it would just make them look bad.
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Is it sad that im not surprised by those American officials actions? The US has always been trying to keep somebody they like power even at the cost of lives and they are no different to Russia or China in that respect. And they are doing it under the nose of their Allies to. (Yes im aware it was a small group of people in America help Gaddafi).
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] TwiggyShip Of course, the Western world doesn't actually care enough to go in and do what we have. We just care about the fine oil reserves Gaddafi is (or was) sitting on, and are using the rebels as a free army that we don't take any responsibility for. [/quote]To the contrary, the result of this war is going to be higher wages for Libyan Nationals who are oil workers, a BAD thing for western oil interests, and if it was about oil, they wouldn't of supported a war that would have cut oil production for so long, again, doing so is harmful to western oil interests. the people concerned about oil were people like I just detailed who were trying to support Gaddafi, as under his rule the west already had highly favourable oil contracts with Libya, now, it's more likely that due to better rights, wages, and long term off lining of oil production, the west is actually losing those favourable conditions... The only way that they could possibly create a more favourable situation for western nations out of this would be to install a puppet government, yet, the Libyan opposition, to avoid EXACTLY that, just rejected the UN's proposal to send 200 military observers and 190 police workers to help with elections. So tell me how the west could install a puppet government without having the people involved to do just that? This isn't about oil, it's about freedoms, and saving lives. This isn't Iraq.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] TwiggyShip Of course, the Western world doesn't actually care enough to go in and do what we have. We just care about the fine oil reserves Gaddafi is (or was) sitting on, and are using the rebels as a free army that we don't take any responsibility for. [/quote]You are jumping to conclusions while all the facts point in the opposite direction.
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Of course, the Western world doesn't actually care enough to go in and do what we have. We just care about the fine oil reserves Gaddafi is (or was) sitting on, and are using the rebels as a free army that we don't take any responsibility for.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Phoenix1330 [u]LIBYA[/u] It appears that some high level American officials had directly contributed to trying to keep the Gaddafi Regime in power, according to documents found in the head of intelligence's office. The documents show that David Welch, the ex-Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs, and Congressman Dennis Kucinich, were still in contact with the Gaddafi regime and were advising them on how to win the propaganda war and how to protect Saif al-Islam(Gaddfi's son and war criminal) They met as recently as August 2nd with the Gaddafi head of Intelligence who is also a wanted war criminal. They also were prepared to take international legal action against NATO support for the NTC, and the rebellion. [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bgscOtHDrI&feature=player_embedded] Video report on the issue[/url][/quote] Don't want to sound like a conspiracy theorist too much, but maybe, instead of just 'helping' the regime, it could be an act to sustain the conflict at present. I don't know, any ideas. It will also be very interesting to see how this turns out in the future if they really do have 20'000 troops out in sirte. EDIT: Thanks for the updates, far more informing than the TV news. [Edited on 08.31.2011 2:21 PM PDT]
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Saadi, Gaddafi's son has been guaranteed security by the NTC, if he surrenders, as he has asked to do. He apparently has authorization from his father to negotiate on Gaddafi's behalf. His brother, Saif al-Islam, however vows to fight on in Sirte, claiming to have 20,000 troops at his disposal there.
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[url=http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/features/2011/08/2011831151258728747.html] This page [/url]has scans of the documents in question on it. perhaps if anyone here can read, i believe, Arabic, to translate the document fully, that would be appreciated.
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[u]LIBYA[/u] It appears that some high level American officials had directly contributed to trying to keep the Gaddafi Regime in power, according to documents found in the head of intelligence's office. The documents show that David Welch, the ex-Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs, and Congressman Dennis Kucinich, were still in contact with the Gaddafi regime and were advising them on how to win the propaganda war and how to protect Saif al-Islam(Gaddfi's son and war criminal) They met as recently as August 2nd with the Gaddafi head of Intelligence who is also a wanted war criminal. They also were prepared to take international legal action against NATO support for the NTC, and the rebellion. [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bgscOtHDrI&feature=player_embedded] Video report on the issue[/url]
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[url=http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/babylonbeyond/2011/08/syria.html] SYRIA: Some Syrians despair, consider armed confrontation [/url] Amnesty International also thinks things are still getting worst in Syria the Libyan Rebels have rejected the UN proposal to deploy peacekeepers. this is right now unconfirmed but i'm confident in the NTC's ability to maintain the peace.
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[url]http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0811/62305.html[/url] US ambassador to Syria was attacked. [Edited on 08.30.2011 7:30 AM PDT]
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[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-14709570]Julius Malema supporters clash with South Africa police[/url] [quote]South African police have fired stun grenades at supporters of controversial ANC Youth League leader Julius Malema ahead of his disciplinary hearing. Mr Malema, 30, is accused of "sowing divisions" in the party and bringing it into disrepute by calling for Botswana's government to be overthrown. Once a close ally of President Jacob Zuma, the populist Mr Malema has become a fierce critic. His supporters threw missiles at police who were blocking them in Johannesburg. The police have erected a steel gate and barbed wire to close the main street leading to Luthuli House, the African National Congress headquarters where the hearing is being held. Hundreds of Mr Malema's supporters are outside, chanting and setting rubbish on fire. Mr Malema, who is charged along with five other top youth league officials, could be expelled from the ANC at the closed-door hearing. He was put on probation by the disciplinary committee last year after being found guilty of criticising Mr Zuma.[/quote]
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[url=http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2011/08/2011829142115110961.html]more deaths in Syria, some army defections[/url]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ANinjaGuardian Well, it looks like it's almost over.[/quote]For Libya anyhow.
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Well, it looks like it's almost over.
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[u]LIBYA[/u] Gaddafi's wife, Two of his sons(the once captured Mohammad Gaddafi)his daughters and grand children have fled to Algeria, the Algerian government has confirmed it as well. The NTC has claimed that Algeria harbouring Gaddafi's family is being taken as an act of aggression and that they will push for extradition, or even war in the future, if they are not handed over. ANSA, an Italian news agency that had correctly reported the above information before confirmation citing an 'authoritative source' says that Gaddafi and two of his sons are in Bani Walid, just south of Tripoli. they also Claim that Khamis is dead. According to Reuters Khamis Gaddafi has been killed in South Libya in a clash near the boarder. This is not the first time his death has been reported. [Edited on 08.29.2011 11:57 AM PDT]
