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11/18/2010 2:46:05 PM
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The Fred 104 vs. John 117 vs. Kurt 051 debate is futile
Reading the various posts about SPARTANS, I've picked up that most people think John 117 was the best spartan, simply because he was on the various Halo's and the de facto leader.
The notion that one SPARTAN-II is inherently superior, because of where they were during the Halo series is quite frankly stupid.
In my experience, all experienced members of elite units like the SPARTANS, are all capable, adaptable and deadly soldiers.
And as such, I've got no doubt that ANY of the remaining SPARTAN-II's (087,058,104,051) could have and would have got the job done, if they had been in the same place and position as the Chief. How it would've gotten done, however would have varied from SPARTAN to SPARTAN.
My opinion
Now digging in, forming defensive line (there will be flamers) - Let me hear your thoughts on this - and how they would have done it.
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Hyper lethal and maxxed out Luck stat. The Mysterious Stranger perk is that useful!
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Any SPARTAN could have done what Chief did, as long it was the main character of a video-game series.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ferrrari [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] privet caboose [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] manwith Chief's missions weren't hard. He was just lucky enough he didn't have to fight on Reach. Cortana and eventually Elites did mostly his job.[/quote] You constantly put the Spartan II's down, you seem to think the III's are superior or just as good or whatever. But you honestly can not say that the chief's missions "weren't that hard," because they were. And the chief completed those missions on his own. [/quote] Well on paper spartan 3s gamma class were better then spartan 2s. Btw chief had a easier mission (still mother -blam!- hard tho) comapred to noble teams mission. well halo 1 was.[/quote] Considering that Alpha Halo was occupied with a VERY small Covenant fleet that couldn't be orbital bombarded, so it was very hard for them to track and kill John while the Flood was released causing three way war. Not to mention the help of Cortana that could advice John every moment, except for library, (but hey, a lone marine survived most of it) and even teleport him at certain times. But as for Gamma, you're right, they are better on paper.
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Please read the original post. This is not degrading the spartans. This is not anti-The chief. We are putting the SPARTAN's on an objective level for comparison. This is not whom is "best", whatever the hell that means. This is not saying what the Chief did was easy. The point of the post was (I know people don't read anymore - but bear with me) "The other SPARTAN II's likely could have done what the Chief did in H1,2 and 3 - They are SPARTAN's, not florists - adaptable, deadly and capable of getting the job done. Given the same equipment and position as the Chief, I would like to hear, Your thoughts on how they could have gotten the job done" mmmkay!? See what I'm getting at? [Edited on 11.22.2010 12:09 PM PST]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] privet caboose [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] manwith Chief's missions weren't hard. He was just lucky enough he didn't have to fight on Reach. Cortana and eventually Elites did mostly his job.[/quote] You constantly put the Spartan II's down, you seem to think the III's are superior or just as good or whatever. But you honestly can not say that the chief's missions "weren't that hard," because they were. And the chief completed those missions on his own. [/quote] Well on paper spartan 3s gamma class were better then spartan 2s. Btw chief had a easier mission (still mother -blam!- hard tho) comapred to noble teams mission. well halo 1 was.
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Lol, Chief solos it on high charity and other spartans are better? gtfo. chief is the best, even if he isn't on paper. no other spartan had the impact he did on the human covanant war. He is a spartans spartan.
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There is no such thing as luck. John was the best Spartan Overall, he is a great leader, he is very creative and a brilliant tactian.
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I'm more than sure Fred and Noble Six would have done a better job with Mark VI and Cortana in the same situation as John ever was.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] manwith Chief's missions weren't hard. He was just lucky enough he didn't have to fight on Reach. Cortana and eventually Elites did mostly his job.[/quote] ...Chiefs missions weren't hard? I'm sorry, where were you when he was on his OWN fighting through the second half of Halo CE. Where he had to fight through Forerunner complex's full of flood. When he had to assault a Covenant ship by himself(Keyes) and then fight back through the Covenant controlled Pillar of Autumn. What about when the chief assaulted Regret pretty much on his own? Was that easy? How about fighting through High Charity, SOLO. The Covenant home "world" and he was alone through most of it, even when the flood landed and turned the place into a three way war. And then Chief had an EASY mission when he took on the Citadel where Truth had all the remaining Covenant and even against all those troops Chief still came on top. Or how about When Chief went through infected High Charity solo? Was that easy? Or when he went to Halo with the Arbiter and Johnson? That sure as hell wasn't easy. You constantly put the Spartan II's down, you seem to think the III's are superior or just as good or whatever. But you honestly can not say that the chief's missions "weren't that hard," because they were. And the chief completed those missions on his own.
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Yes, he died on Onyx. But during the events of H1,2,3 he was very much alive. Just someplace else. The scenario I put forward was a hypothetical - a what if Kurt was on Halo. Doubt the Chief is dead and I would love to see what happens after Onyx [Edited on 11.22.2010 3:12 AM PST]
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Reekhon Kurt is a remaining spartan? Correct me if i'm wrong, but didn't he die in GoO?[/quote]Chief's probably dead as well, and Fred is technically out of action.
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Kurt is a remaining spartan? Correct me if i'm wrong, but didn't he die in GoO?
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Chief's missions weren't hard. He was just lucky enough he didn't have to fight on Reach. Cortana and eventually Elites did mostly his job.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Tian X104 I hear the argument of luck, however "Luck" is a very finite commodity, eventually it does run out.[/quote] Only runs out when the writers decide it runs out.
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I hear the argument of luck, however "Luck" is a very finite commodity, eventually it does run out. And sadly during the course of the games, books and comics, the Chief's luck begins to resemble a character shield (pun not intended). More than his luck - the integration of Cortana into his armor and their partnership seems to be his primary advantage. Also, his luck would not explain his blue team's regular losses against Kurt's green team during training. If he was that lucky, Kurt's 6th sense wouldn't factor. If you want to extend the argument - Kurt on Halo, would have, given his displayed skill set, would have most likely have coordinated a better defence using the marines (doesn't make for such an exiting game though), instead of lone wolfing it all the way. He was also a LCDR by this time and could pulled rank on Major Silva - given that SPARTAN's had higher operational priority - it wouldn't have been willingly, but his rank would have made go down smoother. Also the malice between Major Silva (leading the ODST's on halo) and Kurt would have been less (he wasn't the spartan who killed Silva's helljumpers) - and so Kurt likely would have been able gain a greater advantage from these elite troops. (Lets not even get into the point that he would have stopped Silva from trying to take an infected Covie ship back home) Keyes and the majority of the crew might still have been alive. Do you see what I'm getting at?
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Buzz the Fuzz [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mutoid Log Luck. No Spartan is going to get through the trilogy without it.[/quote] Pretty much the reason why John got the job done, he was the only spartan with enough luck to pull it off.[/quote]Interestingly, this. Chief's luck is described as 'probability bending' by Cortana. The things 117 has bested would have possible killed other SPARTANS not lucky enough to dodge. Apart from 087, who was faster than all others. 104 was supposedly superior to 117 in physical capability, being 'second at everything' when he could have come first but 'didn't like the attention'. 051 was a very different SPARTAN. To be honest, he would probably have been a far more talkative SPARTAN, and would have made Halo a more squad-based shooter, taking time to protect and supervise his marine underlings. Would have been odd, a near-undefeatable squad leader leading a squad of comparatively weak and poorly-trained soldiers. Still, worked for the Elites and Grunts.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mutoid Log Luck. No Spartan is going to get through the trilogy without it.[/quote] Pretty much the reason why John got the job done, he was the only spartan with enough luck to pull it off.
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[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mutoid Log Luck. No Spartan is going to get through the trilogy without it.[/quote] QFT.
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Luck. No Spartan is going to get through the trilogy without it.
