I believe it was Luke Smith who said back in 2020 when Sword got their Charge Rate rework who said "Do you really just want to spam Heavy Attacks?" but having lived with the March 2020 rework I would ask "Do you really just want to spam Light Attacks?"
Swords have 6 glaring issues in todays sandbox. Some of these issues are due to the 2020 rework, some are due to nerfs, and a few have always been an issue.
Heavy Attacks:
Heavy Attacks make up for 3 of these 6 issues.
1.) Locked to ground assault
For starters heavy attacks on all swords except for Aggressive Frame Swords cannot be executed in air and any attempt will only result in a higher ammo cost slash with lower damage and no lunge. This makes sword weak against Bosses who frequently stomp and bosses who are even slightly lifted over the player. This effectively locks swords to not just ground combat, but even terrain ground combat if you intend to use a heavy attack combo. Things such as stairs or even just rocks can leave you slightly lifted off the ground which will counter your heavy attacks.
2.) Sword offense abilities must compete with their defense abilities
"Sword Energy" acts as the sole source for sword ability usage which means you actively have to choose between if you mean to use swords defensively or offensively instead of being able to use these abilities as needed the way we had been able to before. If I just used a heavy attack I'm now completely open to any incoming source of damage, pre-2020 I could just block after a heavy attack.
3.) Many sword Heavy Attacks do not work with perks.
Heavy Attacks don't activate Whirlwind Blade or Relentless Strikes even though most swords on average offer 5 hits on heavy attacks. In the case of Caster Frames their heavy attacks don't even get buffed by damage perks either. As it stands Whirlwind and Relentless on most swords remains to be the most popular trait combo, so why use an attack the works counter to these perks?
Blocking:
4.) Now that Blocking is beholden to the Sword Energy mechanic instead of ammo it's use as a defensive ability is negligible unless you're a Stronghold Titan. Sword blocking pre-2020 was only limited by the ammo at your disposal and were as much shields as they were swords.
Sword Energy/Charge Rate
5.) The entire reason this system was employed was to add variation and have players engage with combos instead of maining just 1 aspect of the Swords abilities, but when all sword abilities that require Sword Energy take the entire charge you don't really get the chance to combo. We effectively just spam Light Attacks until the need for a Heavy Attack or Block arises.
Class Archetypes:
6.) Some class archetypes Swords are just better than others, the Aggressive Frame archetypes. I see no reason one class should have a unique sword. In fact I'd say no weapons should ever be class specific.
Changes I'd like to see:
1.) Allow Aerial Heavy attacks
2.) Heavy Attacks should only consume 33% of your Sword Energy
3.) Allow Aerial Light Attack Chains
4.) All Heavy Attacks should all properly function with all perks
5.) Blocking should be allowed without Sword Energy at the cost of lowered Damage Resistance and halting Sword Energy Charge Rate. (Strongholds should maintain maximum DR)
6.) remove the class specific restrictions
With these changes in play there will be variations in sword combos and likely many new sword strats and even desirable perk roll combos in the future
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1 ReplyWhen they changed the sword mechanics it killed Black Talon for me. The whole reason the catalyst existed was to heavy attack right after blocking. But now that blocking consumes sword energy you can't get a fully powered double heavy attack off without the proc falling off and have to do two minor heavy attacks since the energy was consumed by blocking. That and Cold Steel does not work at all with the new stasis caster frame's heavy attack...like...why even have it on the sword if I can't freeze something from afar when I use the heavy attack? It's useless unless I use a light attack.
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2 RepliesBlack Talon would like a word.
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1 ReplySwords are the best weapons in the game, I hope we get legendary special ammo swords some day Glaives are what are boring , I would celebrate if Bungie removed them from existence
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15 RepliesEdited by jhermannITJ: 8/12/2024 11:32:34 PM1.) Allow Aerial Heavy attacks They do... it's skill gap, and yes, I mean caster heavy in the air, Vortex in the air, etc. 2.) Heavy Attacks should only consume 33% of your Sword Energy With the current energy regen rates? 3.) Allow Aerial Light Attack Chains 1 legendary sword can do this... it's the Hunter class variants. 4.) All Heavy Attacks should all properly function with all perks. They do. "Heavy Attacks don't activate Whirlwind Blade or Relentless Strikes". These are light attack perks. 5.) Blocking should be allowed without Sword Energy at the cost of lowered Damage Resistance and halting Sword Energy Charge Rate. (Strongholds should maintain maximum DR) Making Swordmaster's even more of a requirement? This is totally about the Ergo grind, 100%. 6.) remove the class specific restrictions No. The only thing swords NEED is some HDT (Hit detection tuning). Btw, I've been on swords for weeks now... Testing... building, optimizing. I ground out Solstice over 3 nights entirely with swords.... Anywo, I'm getting really good with swords... but there are things that are annoying and dangerous in more difficult content. No dmg, delayed dmg... That sucks & is dangerous in higher level content. If I'm hitting the enemy... and there's no dmg, delayed dmg... messes with attack cadences, I'm not planning on guarding... especially single target, and that's when I get in trouble most of time. I can cope, I just dip and reset... but it's scary. Swords should have the DoE modifier as an intrinsic... meaning while surrounded you have extra DR, guarding or not... I don't know what that metric is... but I'm thinking 10% DR just by holding a sword amongst aggro. Ghost shots... I'm attacking through enemies far too often. To the game's credit, it will often redirect me back on target... if you're trained on that target... but attacking through enemies feels bad. Physics issues... both annoyances and exploits in favor of the player. Last night I probably got shot straight up into the air 15 times... 20 meters? That's fine in Altars... and fun 😋, but you really don't want that happening. Whiffing... if I have sword energy let me do the combo. Most applicable to the wave frame "Zoom Zoom"... Body blocking enemies against architecture... or the ground (can be instantly nuked). I don't know if I would change this... but I do see issues w static bosses or things you could get in corner by kiting or pushing... which is easy. Yeah, maybe that's too strong. Nothing you mention makes Swords more interesting, you just want easy DPS. I am for a more advanced input system... we can talk about swords IF you want. But this post was about not wanting to grind. They're not perfect, but I've been focused on them for 2 weeks... definitely not boring. Tbh, I'm not fully convinced they're consistent enough to truly be GM viable.