As a consumer its my job to question aspects that I might not be at first comfortable with. Based on what limited videos I have seen and what I have heard.. its not exacly impressive. Yeah its Destiny but built on the old Halo formula.. not exactly exciting. Now couple that with 3 years of frustration and the negativity can be justified. Now my opinion will be based on the beta, but Bungie better wow my socks off. Cause the last thing I wanted was another Halo type shooter or CoD, Battlefield clone.

[quote]The new weapon system is different. I get that makes people apprehensive, but it was literally my favorite thing I experienced with D2.[/quote] The new weapon system limits player choice and makes PvE even more of a slog than it already is. [quote]The updated subclasses take the ones we know and love and makes them fresh and exciting again, particularly with the new defensive/support abilities.[/quote] The "updated" subclasses are just watered down versions of the originals, just like the "new" subclasses are little more than combinations of different aspects of the originals. [quote]The Cabal are not the Cabal we've fought the past 3 years. Anyone expecting the same phalanx walls is in for a shock.[/quote] The new Cabal are just re-skinned versions of the originals with a handful of new abilities, and will only appeal to people who thought the Taken were a unique idea. [quote]The Exotics from what I saw feel Exotic again.[/quote] The exotics shown are weak, with poor base stats and incredibly situational exotic perks. [quote]The boss fights are dynamic and not D1 bullet sponges.[/quote] The strike boss was a generic bullet sponge. [quote]right now if you haven't played it, you don't know.[/quote] This is nonsense. I don't need to test the new weapon system to know that having to pick between a sniper rifle and a rocket launcher instead of being able to have both will limit my versatility. I don't need to play the game to see that the original subclasses are watered down or that Dawnblade is just a mashup of Sunsinger and Sunbreaker, the videos I've watched speak for themselves. In fact, I don't need to play to understand [b]anything[/b]. Everything I've written above has already been shown, so why you're trying to convince people not to be critical is beyond me.

Bungie's track record says enough. Any company can over glorify their game before it's released and make it look all pretty. ( No man ) is a prime example.. [b]Actions speak louder than words and everybody's knows Bungie's actions.[/b] I say they need to put the gamers money where there mouth seems to run and stop toying with them and get rid of this control issue they have. Let gamers play how they want to play. After 3 years of everyone saying you don't know yet on every single DLC. "Wait until it's released" it's enough to know everyone has been down this road before of "Bungie says this is what the game is like" a couple times already. So in the sense of wait and see. Yeah, let everyone wait and see the ( truth ) [b]but it doesn't mean gamers don't have the right to be skeptical and express their concerns.[/b]

This may surprise you, but many of the people expressing negative opinions about what they’ve seen of D2 so far aren’t trying to “ruin the game”, they’re offering their opinions in the hope of preventing Bungie from repeating the mistakes of the past. Despite people’s love for this game and the potential it holds, there is a massive disconnect between Bungie and a large portion of the community. Imo there are two major causes of this: A lack of meaningful communication with the community compounded by arrogance, dismissiveness, disinformation and outright lies, and; piss-poor implementation of new ideas, fixes, activities, etc. As the people responsible for D2 are the same people responsible for this disconnect people are justified in being sceptical about what they’re being told they’ll get vs. what they’ll actually end up with. Since they first announced they were working on D2, Bungie has wasted a massive opportunity to reconnect with the community, e.g. TWaB could have been a vehicle for responding to game related topics that were trending instead of the usual banal drivel they’ve been foisting on us for the past three years, or they could have used their Twitch channel for regular dev streams allowing us to enter into an open and honest debate with them (preferably without charging people for the dubious “privilege” of participation). Instead they just carried on regardless passing off tawdry cash-grabs as “new content” and giving the impression that the only opinions that matters are those of nerf-herders and a select few streamers, that PvE is secondary to PvP and that Trials trumps all resulting in the further alienation an already disaffected player base. For many people, a change in Bungie’s attitude both towards the community and how they manage the game is just as important as the gameplay itself given past experiences, and if Bungie are serious about bringing as many D1 players as possible with them to D2 and beyond (and thus maximising sales at launch) then they are rapidly running out of time to build some bridges and convince the sceptics amongst us that things have changed. This from TWaB 04/06/2017 [quote]Would You Like To Know More? [b]Ever since the reveal, we’ve catalogued every question you’ve asked about Destiny 2. We’re listening to all of you, and we’re so very grateful that you’re curious[/b]. You’ll find some of your answers here. And we won’t just tell. We’ll show. The gameplay premiere will be a memorable moment – the first time you see Guardians immersed in Destiny 2 action. Our focus right now is on making sure that livestream will be awesome, so we’ll hold fresh remarks about Destiny 2 until then. [b]We still want to know what you’re thinking about. Keep expressing those curiosities, by all means. All we ask is that you don’t take it personally if we wait for the right moment to satisfy them. [/b][/quote] When I first read this I didn’t believe a word of it, so I was pleasantly surprised when this week’s TWaB entered into the debate about p2p vs. dedicated servers. The article was a well-written and informative attempt to cut through the jargon and address people’s concerns and even went so far as to admit they couldn’t guarantee the lag would be completely eliminated – this is in stark contrast to their usual “we can do no wrong” attitude and I believe Matt Segur should be applauded for that article regardless of where people stand on the subject of servers. This is the type of engagement with the community which has been sorely lacking for the past three years and it is my sincere hope that they continue to address the many concerns people have in a similarly thoughtful manner. [quote]I've tried to explain in countless posts that D2 is not D1. Yes, it's still very much Destiny, but it's also very much a new game and for everyone that keep judging it and shitting on it based off presumptions from D1 experiences with no actual idea what it is they're bitching about is not only pointless, it's detrimental to the new game. [/quote] Santayana: Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it. Given three years of consistently shitty decision-making by Bungie, people have every right to make assumptions about what they know so-far of D2 based on their experience of D1, and for anyone to expect otherwise is, frankly, laughable. It’s impossible not to draw parallels between the overall D1 experience and what’s being proposed for D2. Yes, D2 is a completely new game. Bungie marketed TTK as a completely new game, used that claim to justify leaving yr1 behind then spent the next 18mnths nerfing the shit out of every aspect of the game. Now, here we are at the end of D1 having just learned that everything we’ve achieved is being left behind to make way for a “completely new game”. Déjà vu anyone? Maybe Luke Smith’s snide little “mourning Fatebringer” stunt was a hint that VoG’ll be making yet another come-back at the ass-end of D2. We’re all aware that the new weapon system is different. We’re also alert to the rumours that PvE and PvP will be balanced separately in D2. However, given that initial impressions strongly suggest that the new weapons system is designed to cater to PvP balance at the expense of PvE versatility people are justified in wondering if the negative impact of PvP on PvE will continue. We won’t really know for sure until after the first balance patches have dropped. Supporters of the new system are saying it will make teams think carefully about their loadouts. Sounds great in theory, but could very easily backfire and spread the “must have ___ equipped” cancer from raid lfg to all other end-game content. Yes, the new subclasses look like a lot of fun, as did some of the weapons. But watching the stream my thoughts weren’t; “Can’t wait to try that out!” They were; “That’s getting nerfed, that’s getting nerfed, that’s [u]definitely[/u] getting nerfed…” Of course, nothing Bungie’s ever done could possibly have inspired those thoughts. It’s my understanding that only one strike was available at the D2 reveal. During the TTK reveal they showed the Shield Brothers strike with extensive commentary on how they’d evolved the game to include more dynamic bosses. Funny how every other strike since TTK is your bog-standard Bungo bullet sponge. History repeating itself, perhaps? Will the new exotics still feel exotic once the crucibabies start dying to them? Hidden areas to discover with a mini-boss fight and loot chest – an addition that definitely piques my interest: Are the rewards actually going to be worth the effort or will it turn out to be another “loot filled fortress” debacle? And how are they going to solve the storage problems which plagued D1? There’s little point in playing a loot-based game if there’s no-where to store the damn loot. Are Bungie actually going to allow us to play how we want to play in D2 or are they going to continue with their attempts to micro-manage every aspect of gameplay? Is future DLC going to contain actual new content or is it going to be more of the re-skinned, regurgitated maps/weapons/armour that we’ve all become so used to? I could go on, but I wasn’t planning on writing a -blam!-ing essay! On the whole, I have a lot of respect for the time and effort you put into representing the community, but every-so-often you make a post which portrays you as a petulant self-important little tit (no offense intended). Maybe you have a 12yr old sibling who likes to borrow your account, but whatever the reason, you do not speak for the entire community and those who disagree with your point of view have just as much right to post both their opinions AND their suggestions/requests as you do. Given that Bungie are not only encouraging debate on D2 but also show signs of a new-found willingness to engage with the community and address their concerns, what makes you think you have any right to dictate to others how and when they should express their views?

I'm cautiously optimistic about the game. I want it to be great, I want it to succeed, but we're gonna have to help. Bungie is going to be looking toward us to help mold the game when it drops. Our opinions have the potential to sway this game, so providing criticism that is clear and constructive will be key. Once the beta drops, and we get out hands on the game proper, we will get our first chance to give Bungie an idea of how we want the game we're going to get to play, and this is going to have to extend further than the usual "(insert thing) is broken" How is it broken? How do we fix it? I believe we can do it.

I dont know if you were around prior to destiny's original launch back in 2014 but there was similar hype. the game looked nice, the exotics looked fancy, there were a bunch of enemies on screen the boss fights looked dynamic and whatnot. and what did get? three years of microtransactions, cut content, reskinned weapons and horrible connections and an overall poor pvp experience. now I have enjoyed the game and would love more than anything for destiny 2 to be game of the year. after all the shit that's happened I'm not gonna be lenient

Goes both ways. 99% of people haven't played the game and they are praising it like its the best game that ever came out.

its time for destiny to make the b.net forums active players only. i was very sceptical about d2. watching the stream made me feel like they were extremely resentful of the things they got wrong in d1. if we want bungie to take b.net seriously i think we need a quality of life change ourselves. Edit: so i want to make clear that even i have chastised this game, the forums now just need to get back to balanced feedback. instead of nit picking things because we can.

I have one thing to say. They better revamp the character creation. The current one is terrible

Is this your response to everyone that disagrees with you, because the lack of having an open mind doesn't work in this world. Love this conversation you had with someone on your post. [quote]Bullshit response is Bullshit. Re-skin argument is bullshit. Play Halo. What are the covenant in Halo CE, 2, 3, Reach, 4... Oh wait, they're the -blam!-ing same.[/quote] Destiny PvE enemies evolve over time within the year of a couple DLC when the base game is released. You interact with them in more then half this game and each character plays it's role in this game throughout the game. Halo- not a PvE game, it doesn't evolve within the year of any DLC released period. It's set content that the only time it evolves is in the missions and that's only when a new Halo is released a year later. I can't see the logic on anyone trying to use Halo as an example for "reskind" enemies. It's just a PvP game like COD, TF, BF etc... It's the norm for any PvP only with the exception of firefight... Even then firefight doesn't evolve. [quote]New system limiting play. Bullshit.[/quote] This might be true but again you don't know that for a fact. [quote]There are more weapon classes and possible loadout combinations in D2 than D1. All they did was put all the OHK weapons together which honestly they should have been from the start. Again, you haven't actually run with the new system so how do you know how it feels or plays? You don't.[/quote] That remains to be seen. No one has seen anything yet, but from some of the replies on here it seems you have. You are one out of millions that don't know and everyone is soppose to take "your word" for it? Sorry, a no name spouting out hearsay doesn't work for me. Even then streamers are a joke when it comes to this game. [quote]Watered down subclasses. Bullshit.[/quote] Again hearsay... Looking over this game knowing that most things have been watered down repeatedly that this company hasn't changed since Destiny has been released. It shows throughout this entire game for the last 2+ years with the adjustments. I say most have a valid point on predicting what the outcome may be like and it is their right. Companies don't just break from habbit over night, they have created a pattern for themselves that is their own fault. [quote]The new builds are much more dynamic than the old. The Gunslinger felt fresh and fun as hell for a class I wrote off a year ago.[/quote] Once again, hearsay. You seem to think "your" opinion speaks for everyone. I've been reading over this entire post you created and noticed how, [b]you have ignored 95% of the positive feedback to you.[/b] Even if you do make a reply to the positive feedback it's a one liner. Hmm... JIMO, I think you live for confrontation just by looking over this post alone. Your anger in expressing yourself when gamers disagreeing with "your" views says enough. You spent more energy trying to prove your point only to replies that don't agree with "your" opinion. Do I dare look over the other post you been flooding this forum with this last couple days trying to force "your"opinion on everyone. I think I'll spare myself the trouble and leave it alone. From what I understand where I live, there's this thing called freedom of speech. [b]Learn it, live it and let others be who they are.[/b] In the long run, this post is nothing but "your" opinion and nothing more. You don't know how everyone else is going to view this game and you do not have the right to say otherwise... [quote]If you hate the game, don't -blam!-ing buy it or play it. If you're concerned, be concerned, but don't post bullshit you don't actually know and purport it to be fact. Play the -blam!-ing game, then bitch to your heart's content.[/quote] The same applies to you. This is how you talk to gamers that don't see " your views"? [b]Edit: Oh by the way, you must of read this thread. Great job on editing most of your replies on here of you talking down on gamers that disagree with you. Guess you couldn't edit this reply huh! reported and muted.[/b] Edit: The original reply below. https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/227373455/0/0/1

from what i saw, I wouldn't buy this game. i wouldn't read reviews about it. I'd maybe look at in when it was pre-owened once the price plumeted

U know what's depressing? A loved one dying, favorite team losing, getting evicted. People talking shit on a game is not depressing lol

Lol how about a PSA forbidding players from saying Destiny 2 is good following the reveal as well?

100% disagree that I must wait to play the beta before I can have negative opinions on what I saw in the gameplay reveal. The reveal should have given players massive, raging boners to play D2. It didn't do that for me and It seems the reveal also fell flat for some unknown quantity of players. There is a very large history here to pull from if a player wanted to be a skeptic. To say we should all keep quiet until we play the beta ignores the last three years in a very egregious way. Bungie has shit on their goodwill with many players. I can still enjoy Destiny and not trust Bungie as far as I can throw them. These two things are not mutually exclusive. I don't know what Bungie put in the Kool-aid, but it must have been strong shit.

[quote]I hate everything about Destiny 2 and you have to hate it as much as I do or else I will make you feel like an absolute piece of shit for having any opinion other than mine[/quote] -Half of the posters on B.Net