JavaScript is required to use Bungie.net

#feedback

9/2/2015 12:02:41 PM
96

The ultimate flaw in the future vision of Destiny

By now, we have all read the news from Bungie about TTK - what it will do, what it won't. We've all read the feedback and concerns of many on here about what it means to us as Year 1 players, many of whom have invested hundreds if not thousands of hours into this game. I've tried to distil the whole debate into a few key points - to try and summarise (at least in my own mind) what I think this means for us and ultimately for this whole community going forwards. 1. Destiny was promoted as a 10 year experience, but with TTK, it seems that this was a bit misleading. 10 x 1 year games is more accurate. I don't think that would have had the same resonance with us and I certainly wouldn't have been to drawn to the game, if I had known then what I know now 2. Bungie are under pressure (from Activision) to keep revenue up. In my naive mind, based on my experience in business, I know it's a lot easier and more cost effective to keep current loyal customers happy and to keep adding new ones where possible. However, TTK seems to do the opposite - do as much to appeal to new customers as possible, with the risk of alienating all the loyal, passionate fans who are the life blood of this game 3. This is an online, multiplayer focused game (all activities can be played with other people). Some activities are impossible without other people - e.g. raids, Trials of Osiris etc. Yet Bungie make it very difficult sometimes to help us actually play games (e.g. no matchmaking) so we have to rely on third parties to help facilitate this, e.g. LFG sites. 4. The community is dwindling, making it increasingly hard to play the game 5. The domino effect is that, once a player finds it too hard to play the game, they will quit, with a knock on multiplier effect down the line 6. If new players start on TTK, year one players are going to start being elitist about carrying them. It will no longer be 'must have Gjallahorn' on LFG sites, but 'must have 500+ hours experience'. This might be harsh, but personally I don't want to have to sit and explain to new players the mechanics of the old raids, or how switching perk x to y in a certain situation will help them etc 7. No ascenscion of old legendaries essentially makes most of the year one Destiny redundant (Vault of Glass, Crota's End, Prison of Elders). So if this trend continues into year 3 and beyond, by year 10 the game won't actually be any bigger than it is now in terms of end game activities as each year the old stuff will become obsolete. All of this doesn't take into Bungie's newfound solution to ALL game mechanic issues - nerf and retrospectively make more changes, which then have other knock on effects they've not considered until it's too late. It is worth noting that adding matchmaking and allowing ascension of year 1 legendaries would solve several of the issue above - but as it's logical and straightforward, it probably won't happen. We'll just get another shader or sparrow with the ability to drive through zones without any buffering...
English
#feedback

Posting in language:

 

Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • They said it's an adventure that will unfold over the next 10 years. I don't see how people still don't know this. But I'll say it now. There's going to be 4 Destiny games. Each game will contain 4 Expansions and 1 big expansion. So after TTK we have 2 expansions left. Then Destiny 2 will launch.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

  • [quote]1. Destiny was promoted as a 10 year experience, but with TTK, it seems that this was a bit misleading. 10 x 1 year games is more accurate.[/quote]Making Year 1 content obsolete is brutal. I can understand this for the second retail release, but not a DLC.[quote]2. Bungie are under pressure (from Activision) to keep revenue up.[/quote]You know they are. Activision pays the bills, not us consumers.[quote]Bungie make it very difficult sometimes to help us actually play games (e.g. no matchmaking) [/quote]The complaints about lack of matchmaking will only end when Bingie adds matchmaking for all activities.[quote]4. The community is dwindling, making it increasingly hard to play the game[/quote]I observe fewer players this week, because now we all know our exports are pointless. When you start up a strike or PoE 28, and can't match with 2 other players, then you know the population is untenable. [quote]7. No ascenscion of old legendaries essentially makes most of the year one Destiny redundant [/quote]Year 1 became redundant as soon as Bungie made clear that Year 1 gear would not ascend, breaking the meta-game, and putting an expiration date on player progression. [quote]by year 10 the game won't actually be any bigger than it is now in terms of end game activities as each year the old stuff will become obsolete.[/quote]This ties into OP's first point. The grand experience was sold on the idea that you could to take your Guardian through a 10 year adventure, but if you replace all the guns and gear every year, is it really the same Guardian? Could you start Mass Effect: Andromeda and get the same feeling you'd get from Destiny 2? [quote]It is worth noting that adding matchmaking and allowing ascension of year 1 legendaries would solve several of the issue above[/quote]100% agree.

    Posting in language:

     

    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

    17 Replies
    • Totally 100% Agree. And I mean, I can overlook and forgive just so much. For me? Its the nonsense with not allowing Year 1 Legendary or Exotic stuff to continue forward. I WANT to be able to bring my old gear with me into Year 10. Its personal preference, its a decision I made and that should be afforded to everyone who has spent the time and effort to acquire said items. Otherwise, like you said, what's the point? We'll consistently have the same amount of content at the end because everything from the previous year will have been made invalidated. [b]#infusionforall[/b]

      Posting in language:

       

      Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

      20 Replies
      • Activi$ion is our enemy. Just used this game as a beta for BO3 beta.

        Posting in language:

         

        Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

      • 1
        You have listed what you see as problems can you list solutions?

        Posting in language:

         

        Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

        1 Reply
        • I will usually help others out, I got to the point of 1000+ hours I have everything and zero need to do stuff, so I'll help others. But if your dying 30 times during a night fall I will usually just leave cause that's hopeless right there

          Posting in language:

           

          Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

          3 Replies
          • What do you think about this reward: https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/151324759

            Posting in language:

             

            Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

            1 Reply
            • Year 1 players are leaving because Bungie have effectively nullified their time and effort, creating the domino effect you mentioned. If this is an indication for Destiny's future, then new players will go through the same (if not similar) experience. Multiply that a couple or so times and not only will people stray from Destiny, but Bungie in general. And with the amount of money people are expected to pay up for temporary gear relevance, versus the actual quality of the given content, I guarantee people will jump ship almost as quickly as they board. As for me, my stance is that of many others, but I'd also like to add this: Bungie's priorities come to full light when they're trying to sell us content before they even fix their game. For instance, if I'm mainly a PVP player, why should I spend $40 more when the games I play are lag-ridden? Way I see it, Bungievision have already made how many millions of dollars off of this game, and constant lag (especially in ToO and IB) are what we get?

              Posting in language:

               

              Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

              6 Replies
              • Bump

                Posting in language:

                 

                Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                1 Reply
                • I hear people say the PVE gun nerfs were necessary because weapons like Fatebringer, Blackhammer, Icebreaker and Gjallahorn were too OP.....wtf That's what made the game fun, finding and using awesome weapons....now I should play for another 9 years with $hit guns, no thanks

                  Posting in language:

                   

                  Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                  1 Reply
                  • Edited by All Skulls On: 9/3/2015 5:32:11 AM
                    I just do not understand the "year one'rs" quest to carry guns on into the future indefinitely, all the while having them remain top tier weapons. I mean what is it really? You kinda have to ask yourself what is it that bothers you so much about not having the same guns be the cream of the crop NINE YEARS from now. Is it that you tried really hard to get to the top, having fun playing Destiny, and now you won't be at the top anymore unless you have fun playing Destiny again? If it is then that's very selfish. Is it that you imagined using the same guns for an ENTIRE DECADE simply because the game was to span an entire decade? If yes then again it's filed under self-interest. Of course there would be progression in that 10 year period, why would you remain top dog for a decade just because you ran a few raids in the game's initial months? Is it because in every other game out there it's extremely common for the starter weapons and equipment to go with you right to the end of the game and handily destroy the final boss, thus making any and all other items in the game redundant? If it is then you haven't been playing games on this planet. Loot games 101: Find an item --> use that item --> find new item stronger than old item --> use new item --> repeat add infinitum Now you could cry that Secret Hand Shake or any release weapons are "better" than HOW weapons, but eventually they will all be forced into redundancy --forced into "new > old"-- by leaving them behind statistically while the new stuff gets stronger and stronger. I don't even know why I would need to explain that... So people, ask yourself what is it really? You don't like progression? You don't like playing the game? You don't like feeling like a hamster on a wheel as you chase the newest, coolest gear? Well tough lol That's how these games work. It's not COD where you just unlock everything then decide not to prestige and there you go, you're forever on top of COD. Totally different structure here, not uncommon, not unfair, totally normal and acceptable. Crying that it should be otherwise is what's unreasonable, not leaving year one weapons in the dust is what would be absurd.

                    Posting in language:

                     

                    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                    10 Replies
                    • Spam Crota the day it comes out just to give em the bird. Then stop playing lol

                      Posting in language:

                       

                      Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                    • Agreed. Maybe they should instead let you ascend ONE weapon (primary, secondary and heavy) of your choice (not per character, just one that can be used for all your characters) Also, do the same with armor (per character). This way it would be a win-win for everyone. When year 3 comes around, you have your choice to keep bringing your ascended weapon with you or you can choose a year 2 weapon instead (but the journey for that previous weapon would end there).

                      Posting in language:

                       

                      Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                      2 Replies
                      • Edited by HatchetOnMyHip: 9/4/2015 11:16:49 AM
                        I have greatly enjoyed this game through the thick and thin... But have yet to preorder...I just want the gear I earn a level up not to be messed with afte the fact

                        Posting in language:

                         

                        Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                        1 Reply
                        • Edited by Lost Sols: 9/4/2015 11:08:11 AM
                          Great post. All very good points actually, thank you for pointing me to it. I particularly like the way you framed #1. If it's a series of 10 one year games, then the cost/experience ratio is nowhere close to working.

                          Posting in language:

                           

                          Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                          1 Reply
                          • Bumping this harder than I would Ms Johansson.

                            Posting in language:

                             

                            Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                            3 Replies
                            • BUMP.

                              Posting in language:

                               

                              Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                              2 Replies
                              • I like how you used 7 bullet points. And I agree with all 7.

                                Posting in language:

                                 

                                Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                                1 Reply
                                • Greed is the ultimate flaw in Destiny

                                  Posting in language:

                                   

                                  Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                                  1 Reply
                                  • I think the big problem is that there doesn't appear to be any big picture understanding of where the franchise is going. They're just shuffling us from one DLC to the next. Maybe that's all the further they are looking. If I had to guess, I'd say there's some serious issues in the upper management at Bungie.

                                    Posting in language:

                                     

                                    Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                                    4 Replies
                                    • Edited by Scorpius XX1: 9/3/2015 1:00:19 AM
                                      You have a lot of time on your hands don't you? You know what, I hope all these whining year one a-holes do leave. The sooner the better. I have never seen so many entitled, self centered, self important, narrow minded so called gamers like I have seen here. You all try to come off so insightful, and so provocative. Endless conspiracy theories and useless introspection, designed for nothing more then getting the drones to applaud and agree with every grandiose statement. The approval of every simple and likeminded individual on here, and none of them. Why don't you take this insight, these failures you have stumbled upon, and go make your own game? You have all the answers, it should be a cakewalk for players like you to make the perfect game yeah? At the end of the day no one is going to care about any of this crap you posted. It's a game, when you break it down to it's most simplest form it's no different then checkers. A few hours a day or whatever for entertainment with your friends. This doom and gloom negativity is getting old on the forums. I'm sick of it. Have you ever stopped to ask yourself what it is you truly hope to accomplish here? You guys always say Bungie doesn't listen to what we want, so why? To get into the minds of a couple of small minded drones and convince them not to play or buy? And if they do so, this serves you personally how? Why are you here? To expose a secret? We all know it's a new game, this isn't some sort of revelation. It's supposed to be, do you honestly believe a title can survive a ten year run if it acts and behaves like it's first and only interation? You guys overthink everything about this game, and turn it into something completely ridiculous, to the point where no one on here can say one , damn good thing about it, without being ostracized and labeled a Bungie sheep, or better yet, an addict. Maybe it's time you year one haters go home and rethink your lives. Perhaps start asking yourselves the tough questions you seem to want to have answered by everyone else, the first one being, '' What in the world am I going to accomplish by any of this?', when I log into this site and begin to ready my post, what exactly is my desired outcome? To make the game better? But I have been trying to get them to make the game my way for a year, and yet they haven't done it, but maybe, just maybe if I form the words this way, it might actually reach them and turn everything around!!'' No it won't. You are hitching a ride, nothing more. Like reading a book, you may want the story to go a certain way, but the outcome is out of your hands, and it should be. Your only decision is whether or not to put the book down and not continue. This is their game, their vision, it doesn't belong to you the way you think it does. Take the ride or don't, but like everything else in life it's just a ride. And I personally can't wait for all of you to get off the bus.

                                      Posting in language:

                                       

                                      Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                                      11 Replies
                                      • Bump. What's the point of going on a 10 year journey if every year most of my effort in the previous year is rendered moot?

                                        Posting in language:

                                         

                                        Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                                        2 Replies
                                        • Bump

                                          Posting in language:

                                           

                                          Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                                          1 Reply
                                          • Edited by Arclight545: 9/4/2015 6:01:08 AM
                                            Atomic Bump!! Knockout punch! This is the mindset of the company that allegedly built Halo.

                                            Posting in language:

                                             

                                            Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                                            3 Replies
                                            • Epic post man! Year 1 legendary ascension is a huge must in my opinion, but I wouldn't mind working hard to ascend the old. Yeah, I have 1,500+ hours since day 1. Almost every day I play!

                                              Posting in language:

                                               

                                              Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                                              4 Replies
                                              • I hear people say the PVE gun nerfs were necessary because weapons like Fatebringer, Blackhammer, Icebreaker and Gjallahorn were too OP.....wtf That's what made the game fun, finding and using awesome weapons....now I should play for another 9 years with $hit guns, no thanks

                                                Posting in language:

                                                 

                                                Play nice. Take a minute to review our Code of Conduct before submitting your post. Cancel Edit Create Fireteam Post

                                              You are not allowed to view this content.
                                              ;
                                              preload icon
                                              preload icon
                                              preload icon