Crota's End has a number of design flaws that aren't related so much to the cheese maneuvers.
The Bridge, as designed to be played, is the funnest part of the Raid. I do feel your pain on that matter, but the rest of the Raid?
The Abyss is a dark, visually boring joke that certainly has its tension, but the Weight of Darkness and the Lamps could be totally excised from the experience of the Abyss and it would be ten times better as a swarm brawl than trying to outrun the hoard in the dark. How do we actually play, though? Go from lamp to lamp, fighting as little as we can get away with, until we get to the end and hop on a rock, then wait for an Ogre to show up to eat our waiting rockets and Ice Breaker shots. Run across a bridge into light that somehow leads to the next area.
Then, the bridge, which is seriously great and the only part of the Raid that's worth a damn.
Fighting Ir Yut is easily the weakest part of the whole Raid, especially on Hard where everything is a Major and eats bullets like Skittles. What do we do? We avoid as many of them as possible; we gamble on running past them because fighting them takes too much time. They're not a fair fight. Every time I play, this part with Ir Yut turns into Draw Out the Wizards, Kill the Wizards, Go In and Take Out the Shrieker and Hope the OP Knights Don't One-Hit-Kill You, then whoever is left alive goes on a Kamikaze bumrush into the intestines of the beast, striking for Ir Yut as she begins her stupid Death Song that puts a time limit on the entire affair. Hopefully two things happen: 1) Ir Yut dies, and 2) at least ONE person survives to very slowly take out the surviving OP mobs. It's totally -blam!-ing boring and tedious and I feel terrible for whoever has to solo down the hoard of Majors after Ir Yut is smeared into paste with rockets and Supers.
Then, the fight with Crota himself? This is easily the worst boss fight in gaming history. Let's just go ahead and say this starts off typically with people "glitching" up complimentary ammunition that the game provides you because it doesn't want to send you into battle empty-handed. If you grouped up with LFG guys, you have a great chance of hearing someone complain about "glitching" up some Heavy Ammo and calling it stupid or whatever, like dropping 950 glimmer per Heavy Ammo Synth is the smart way to go. After the opening rush and careful Orb harvesting, it's out to the "real" fight. Here we have the Boomers from Normal Mode now promoted in rank to Majors, so taking them out is no longer an option. What do we do? Avoid them [i]entirely[/i] like the rest of the Raid has been teaching us to do. There's no Chalice to recover health this time, just because, but if you've played Hard Mode you know how much the Chalice doesn't matter when you're literally avoiding every bit of conflict you can - at this point you're seriously only going to shoot at Swordbearers, Thralls when you miss shots at the Swordbearers, Ogres, and Crota's stupid shield. In Hard Mode, you're going to wait for your Swordsman to avoid as much conflict as possible by going invisible, wait for his signal, then blast down Crota's stupid shield with rockets so he can become invulnerable to every goddamned weapon except for one of the swords typically carried by his own troops, carried by your invisible buddy. Thwack, thwack, thwam - Crota gets up, your buddy drops the sword, melees Crota to go invisible, picks up the sword, and the rest of the fireteam blasts Crota's stupid shield again with rockets so the Invisible Swordsman can hack him a few more times, then run away. Rinse, repeat, go into one of the Ogre rooms to get the drop on an add, take out his twin, then back to the regular rocket-and-sword action for a bit until Crota flips out and starts throwing Oversouls at your party over and -blam!-ing over again to just obliterate you, just because.
Then you get a No Land Beyond and then go to orbit.
-blam!- Crota's End.
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Spot on! I do feel with ir yut bungie made it near impossible to take out all the adds before the liturgy starts. The timer basically makes it so you have to avoid everything and bumrush in....
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Got it in one! I always pray that the 1st words out of someone's mouth as soon as we hit the bridge are "Are we doing this legit?". Hardly ever happens. Finally got my 3rd attempt/completion yesterday doing the bridge legit. I was totally stoked gave me the feeling that I earned those shards.
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Youre right. The raid is a joke and the bridge most fun. But must people dont even know how the totems work lol.
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You forgot the bit where for some reason the sword vanishes or the bit where crota insta shields and doesn't kneel, or the bit where he hits you when your invis, or the American sniper boomers hit you when in the air, there are more, then ppl wonder why other use the heavy ammo trick!
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Thanks, finally someone who summarized Crota's End and its design flaws in an entertaining way :-) Bungie just did a lazy job with this raid by simply throwing those op mobs at players. And that's the reason why most people want to get it done in the least amount of time. I personally like doing normal the legit way but hard mode is just a pain in the ass. It's just laughable when I see some real good teams on YouTube and even they do it the way like the more casual players do it by getting over two people and the rest of the team just dies at the bridge. I don't mind it when people want to do VoG oracles or Templar from top or whatever way because still this raid is far more entertaining and full of atmosphere and when it comes to the boss fight everybody has to deal with every possible thing, not just pressing the trigger twice to shoot a rocket.
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Maybe if you played the encounter differently you would enjoy crota more. My first 3 crota hard kills were using the left side strat which meant we had to shoot everything and I was running sword as a titan. It was amazing. No hiding on a ledge or distracting boomers with a shield.
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I hardly read these long posts but yours was written very well. My hats of to you sir, couldn't have said it any better.
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I couldn't have said this better myself. Bump for more ppl to read this. Sumed Crota up perfectly.
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This was the most satisfying thing to read. The end accents the point perfectly.
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And I'm sure bungie is surprised at the common tactic. At a guess they were expecting us to get crota on the sides at least once. And I reckon the boomers and and wizard weren't exactly meant to be avoided. More killed at the right time to allow the sword bearer freedom. But you are right for the most part. VoG is in my opinion a better raid, but crotas end is a lot more fun without cheese.
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that just sumed up most of everyone's crota career
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Dude you should write a book