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Edited by Lunyarch:
3/18/2018 5:32:35 PM
27
The community is worthy of blame for the state of Destiny. (Revised)
Before I start, I would like to state that I too am displeased with the state of the game, and I refuse to fully blame the community for mistakes that were [b][i]completely[/i][/b] Bungie's. Now on to the main topic: a community so cancerous, indecisive, and gullible that it is semi-responsible for the state of the game.
I have never seen a community more hateful towards each other and the developer. I understand that there will always be strife, but never have I seen people insult each other in such a hateful manner over a slight difference of opinion. How are we to hold Bungie responsible for grievances against us if we are at war with ourselves? We (Not in a hive mind sense, since it apparently seems so) must work with each other to hold Bungie accountable.
To help with this, stop being so indecisive. I've seen how indescisve how this community is, and I know that it is normal to want things in a better state. But when we state that a nerf/buff [spoiler]Shotguns/Sidearms (D1), Heavy Ammo and Weapons (D1&2), Special Weapons (D1&2), PvE/PvP meta's (D1&2), and so on.[/spoiler] and then immediately want the old system back. Granted, Bungie has either done too little or too much, and I will not deny it. But the amount of times the community has done this is outrageous. Bungie can't work with an indescisve community, and will take advantage of it.
Sadly, this community still has not learned from its gullibility since the first game. We all knew that D2 was not going to be terribly bigger than D1, but come on, believing that D2 would be the size of D1 plus Dark Below, House of Wolves, and Taken King is ridiculous. We know that developers and their parent companies don't do that anymore. Should D2 have been that big? Hell yes, but we knew it wasn't coming. This is the end of my community criticism.
Onto the part that everyone's been waiting for; Criticism of Bungie. Bungie mods, if you read this, pay attention. Bungie is trying to be more transparent, which is good. Cudos on that, but I think at this point you need to start doing community play test, where you set up a week designed to play test updates and see feedback. Please, pay more attention to feedback. I've seen tons of brilliant ideas from the community, and I feel that some would be absolutely amazing for the game. I think, for a situation like this, it would be best if you drew three community ideas that were most popular, poll them, and implement them into the game every 1-3 months. Try to be more active in the community (Ex. Polls, Q&A's, Events.) Do a stream to explain how we've got here. Explain your mistakes, and the community might slightly come back. Finally, please fix your game. As someone who's put 31 days into D1, I am tired and aggrivated with D2. I won't leave yet, but I know others are more willing than I.
To the community, I know this has seemed more directed towards you, but I want everyone to enjoy the game, and I don't want all this strife in the community. For once, just slow the hate, and try to have Bungie cooperate with us. It's easier to work with someone when you're not trying to chop their head off.
Bungie, work with the community, for your sake and for mine. If you want to keep your community, and your cash, cooperate, be more transparent, and make yourself semi-trustworthy.
I am willing to answer questions, hatred, and criticism. However, please have proof to support your claims.
-POLTiger
English
#destiny2
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4 RepliesSo the community is responsible for bunglevision putting out an empty of content game. Your are seriously delusional if you think that the community feedback transformed D1 experience into whatever they call D2. No I’m afraid that was all bunglevision.
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I know what you are trying to get at. But it seems you are having a go at players for being gullible, then asking them to give bungie another chance.
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1 ReplyHow about we all agree that everybody is wrong. The community is wrong Bungie is wrong Destiny 2 is wrong
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This is a interesting clip by Darkside Royalty Lore worth viewing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSLevQCq1mw
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2 RepliesEdited by Force58: 3/18/2018 2:34:32 PMYou're a bit delusional if you think the community had anything to do with D2 releasing in the state that it did. That was all on Bungie. The community isn't much different than any other popular game out there. I'm on all the forums for multiple games and a certain segment will be toxic, its a given. With Destiny its a passion. People, including me, love the gameplay and just crave for more. Unfortunately, the way Bungie doles out new content the end result is always boredom. Boredom leads to restlessness and the ultimate end result is complaining on the forums. You'll also notice it isn't just the player base. Almost every major game reviewer has the same opinion on D2. Bungie dumbed down the game for no good reason, the player base DID NOT ask for this. We have a very vanilla story, enemy AI, weapons, armor and skills. It was as if ALL Bungie's imagination went out the window during the development of D2. To release a sequel and not have ANY new enemy AI was unforgivable. The player base had NO part in that. Even somebody with half a brain could figure out you give the players at least the same game modes that D1 had with the launch of D2. Bungie chose NOT to do that. Bungie needs to learn restraint and understand that they can't please everybody. They need to stop listening primarily to the streamers and quit with the knee-jerk reactions that lead to nonsensical decisions, patches/DLC's. Everybody knows from growing up that if somebody pulls one over on you over and over and over again you lose trust in them. You grow distant and resentful. We all know what I'm talking about and I won't repeat it. That's what we have on these forums right now. The transparency you see right now means nothing when they didn't come to the table right after D2 was launched and didn't address the shit-storm that followed until almost a month and a half later. What needs to happen now is for Bungie to have a live steam where they explain how in the world we got to where we are now. Who's decisions were they? Why did they make the decisions to go down the path to get to D2? Where is the accountability? My faith and trust in Bungie will improve if they do this one simple thing. None of what D2 is had anything to do with the player base, none of it. So don't call the player base out on how we're reacting to it now. Edit: And before you claim I didn't read your intro, I did, my comments are based on the reasons the community is pissed and wary of Bungie's intentions going forward. Again, WE had nothing to do with how D2 was released and we have every right to express our displeasure with Bungie on this and other forums.
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7 RepliesWow...I’ve never read a more naive, if not delusional, post in recent memory. First, the state of Destiny is completely on Bungie. The fans never asked Bungie to cut up their game into different pieces to be sold later. The community never asked Bungie to completely toss out its original story, which made the original writer left and delayed the game a year, which, IMO was the first domino to fall in this complete collapse. The community didn’t ask for [i]another[/i] reboot because that worked [i]so well[/i] the 1st time. They didn’t ask for a sequel that removed so many things even D1 Vanilla had! They didn’t want most of the loot tied into Eververse (which I wager was Bungie’s true endgame). Personally, aside from a few toxic trolls, Destiny had the [b]best[/b] community in gaming. I’ve made more friends in this game than any other online game I’ve played [i]combined[/i]. Raising a million dollars for St. Jude showed how good and united towards a goal the Destiny community can be, and Bungie shat all over that. They only have themselves to blame for their current situation, which was long time coming.
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6 RepliesBungie shit on the community and most left. Bungie continues to shit on the community... More are leaving. They don't need to worry about DLC or D3... Neither will save this franchise. Bungie thinks they are beyond reproach. That line of thinking has cost them their reputation and; more importantly, their fan base.
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2 RepliesThis post kind of sounds like it has been written by bungie. what? blame the community & not the company for the haft ass product so is that your answer? . If they had not screwed over everyone with destiny 2 they would not be in this position now. If someone like bungie is going to shit in the bed then they can sleep in it💩
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Blame trump
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2 RepliesEdited by love god: 3/18/2018 4:16:18 PMDid not read it just stopped by to tell you that they cut up thegame like d1. And lyed out throttling.
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1 ReplyBlizzard, Riot, EA..... just naming a few
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2 RepliesSo we asked for abilities to be nerfed into the ground? Second of all what is this we crap? Yeah [i]some[/i] nerfs and buffs had a majority behind it but I don’t see any of that that for a whole slew of changes they made. Yeah we have a split community. Pvp and pve. What is the game and it’s content focused on? Pve by a wide margin. Who told Bungie to cater to pvp in 1 (were the majority of nerfs/buffs divides stemmed from) and then design 2 entirely around it? Yeah [i]some[/i] of the community got wishy washy. The majority of us never told them to listen to them, we told them not to. Can’t fault us for that.
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6 Replies[quote]Now on to the main topic: a community so cancerous, indecisive, and gullible that it ruined the game. [/quote] Are you not part of the community, and therefore partly to blame? Every problem with D1 and D2 can be put down to money. Players feeling the game's not worth it, Bungie feeling they have done enough to earn it, or game changes in the pursuit to get more of it. I'd be happy to spend more for a quality product, would bungie be prepared to earn less for a substandard one?
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1 Replyso you are telling the community wanted 4vs4, fixed rolls and perks, no dedicated servers and 30 fps, in between all the other flaws?
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6 RepliesThe community is toxic, but the blame lies only with Bungie. Completely starting your game over 16 months before it comes out? Firing your talent? Totally the communities fault. Lying to the community and being caught multiple times? Clearly on us! Bungie is nothing compared to what they were and they probably never will be again.
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3 RepliesOh, come on, Luke Smith. You can stop with the pseudonym accounts when trying to dodge responsibility for wrecking your game and blaming the community. You sly dog, you.
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2 Replies[quote]please have proof to support your claims.[/quote] That's rich considering that I just read this in your post: [quote]Look throughout the history of the game, and you'll see what I mean.[/quote] I doubt you're willing to accept "look up my proof for me" as a source, are you?
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4 RepliesFirst, good job on being a hypocrite, telling people to stop insulting others then immediately calling the whole community a bunch of indecisive toddlers. Your entire argument is ruined right here, but I am gonna keep going. Second, this community isn't "indecisive" if you looked at all the nerf topics/videos those videos got tons of down votes, negative comments about the nerfs themselves, and even the creators of said topics were insulted and lambasted. There have been plenty of topics that people have agreed on and voted positively on and if you knew anything about the "history of the forum" you would have known that. Finally, while they have been somewhat more transparent in some areas, they are still being vague and on top of that they are ignoring the core issues, working on the tiny, insignificant band-aid fixes. That's what the community is toxic and sometimes outright hateful to Bungie and those that defend them so vehemently. The few times they have given us something they have done so in a backhanded manner, a good example being the recent removal of the nightfall timer. Now admittedly, we did ask for that, but they also removed the other modifiers as well...which no one asked for. Just as no one complained or asked for a nerf for the Truth in Destiny 1 whatsoever, yet they still nerfed it and no one asked whatsoever for LMG's to be removed either, but they were taken out in the sequel.
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1 ReplyThe community didn't kill the game. Poor design decisions such as stripping down skill trees, taking the fun out of finding loot, reducing PvE to mostly pecking at everything with two primary weapons, and balancing the entire game around a mediocre PvP mode is what drags down Destiny 2. The complaints and frustrations of the community are not a disease. They are a symptom. Players wanted Bungie to take the best parts of the Destiny experience after having thee years to learn from developing D1 so that we could have a proper, satisfying sequel. And yet here we are. It's perfectly reasonable for paying customers to be frustrated and concerned with the state of the game.
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1 ReplyYou know back in destiny 1 the community was like a family. So many good people and all of them left because destiny 2 is shit and they got lied on etc I don't need to explain it to you. You saw it. I hope you'll get lied to from someone you really like and then please don't get angry on the person, ok?
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1 ReplyI agree, even with all the issues I still enjoy playing. Yes we all want better/more and I feel that Bungie has actually noticed this. Unfortunately progress can only move as fast as it can. I will continue to enjoy the game and forums, toxicity and all. Thanx for the words Stay Gold Guardian
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1 Reply[quote]The community that kills its own game.[/quote] It wasn't the community that killed the game, it was the creator that killed it's creation. That should be a sin of itself.
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Totally agree. Hopefully the “toxic” community members will eventually just leave the forums altogether and let the people who want to keep playing and improving the game play and improve in peace
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I think you need to keep in mind that the community's lowest common denominator is a 13 year old who has reached the farm. Bungie on the other hand is a fairly large and very successful software developer. Halo is a cornerstone in the video gaming industry. Bungie is the face of that creation/legacy. It is Bungie's responsibility to know where they want to be a decade after Destiny's birth. We do NOT have any insight, at all, as to where Comet2, D3, Comet3, D4, and Comet4 will wind up. Bungie does, or should have this long term plan. Not us. So, when a forumite criticizes and makes a recommended change, it's up to Bungie to determine if its beneficial to them, long term. If Bungie implements something that turns out poorly, that's on them, not the community. As far as the community being Toxic, I'll agree with you. But once again, lowest common denominator in this forum is the emotional maturity of a 13 yr old. When Bungie TWaBs a comment like "sandbox loves you" or tweets "off to play Monster Hunter" etc..., over and over, then Bungie is dropping to the lvl of the 13 yr olds here. I can't defend Bungie wrt this bc they are not 13 yr olds. They are professionals, under the umbrella of a AAA publisher. One of, if not the largest and most profitable publishing companies in existence. This isn't Grandma's Boy, or shouldn't be (imho). They are now in a business contract with a large publicly traded company. They don't have the right to miss deadlines bc "developing new content is hard".
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8 RepliesYour whole premise is poor, this isn't the Borg collective or a hive mind, why would you expect anything other than contradictory opinions? Some players love it , some don't, but all with have opinions on what works or doesn't. You'll never see a universal consensus. That being said I do entirely blame Bungie, 1 agreeing a contract they had no hope of delivering on, over ambitious and greedy and no doubt the result of suits with no clue. 2. God aweful infrastructure, they seem badly organised with too many people in postions they're woefully inadequate for 3 The game has been streamlined to ease workload, casual gamer appeal is incidental. The list goes on, this is a systemic failure on multiple levels years in the making and has no quick fix, I'm not sure it can be salvaged at this stage but we'll see.
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3 RepliesYou are wrong at so many levels that it would be too exhaustive to debate them with you. Enough to say that Bungie is getting what they deserve considering they deliberately made D2 against all the feedback that dedicated players gave them during three full years. Nobody, not even the most casual gamer from D1, asked for a game like D2. Nobody! And if Destiny franchise dies with D2 that dead is 100% on Bungie's hands.
