reworded edition: I will only be adding 32's with max weapons that make sense(must have an icebreaker, gjallahorn, or black hammer in your rotation.) also minimum of 10 raid completions and a 7 KD in the raid (I feel that this is the minimum for an average raider, just my opinion though). I feel that a majority of 31's could have done more to reach 32 therefore should wait until they hit 32 to take on the hardmode as most would just be getting carried. There are obviously exceptions. Thats how I am running my group. UPDATE: Crota down, sorry for all you poor souls that havent done it yet EDIT: only excuses are if you havent received an armor drop. Or if you dont have enough shards AFTER reaching eris rank 4 and swapping out energies for them both HIGHLY unlikely if youve done the raid every week. Even with that you can STILL do Iron Banner to get there EDIT: I could have all 3 of my chars at 32 if I leveled excess raid gear, I choose not to bc why would I? lol it would be wasting my time.... so the "OP HAS THREE HUNTERS" argument is invalid. I have NEVER cheesed the raid. I make my own raid groups and grab the sword every time EDIT: damage output by 31's is much less then 32's.... 32's are like 29's in vog hard mode bc HM crota is lv 33...honestly what other reason is needed? EDIT: I am saying if you have not done everything you possibly could have to hit 32 and max out your weaps then you are not dedicated enough imo to be able to do the hard mode and probably would leave early or not know what to do. You can be 31 with no raid gear. There are obviously exceptions. The skill part is simply some people arent skilled enough to finish the raid or need to be carried to do so. Inexperience is normally a factor (raid kd under 7) (everyone wipes due to teamates/other reasons not an excuse, 7 is minimum for average raider imo) EDIT: I am NOT saying that you cant beat it with 31's I choose not too LAST EDIT: When it comes down to it, no matter what anyone says there will be tons of 32 only groups and 31's will have a tough time finding enough 32's to help them in the raid. 31's will need 32's, 32's will NOT need 31's. Look at what happened to 29's in VOG. You needed at least 2-3 30's to do it with an avg group and history will repeat itself and it will be worse bc the raid is Lv 33 this time (I was one of those 29's and chose to make 2 more hunters bc of it) So to all of you who are having a tough time reaching 32 on all three DIFFERENT classes...goodluck you will need it. I have backed up every one of my reasons and explained what I meant in the post as well as outlined possible exceptions. If you dont have a 7 raid kd you are most likely not skilled enough to have a smooth run, If you arent 32 with max weaps theres most likely something you could have done to be there which applies to dedication. Im sure many of you not making the cut will sputter nonsense at me. Sometimes the truth hurts. Have a good day, Im done.