You are confused and you have oversimplified PvP’s problems. SBMM in Destiny has not been implemented as a ranked lobby that matches fair fights. In this game SBMM uses its algorithm to manufacture outcomes. It mathematically manufactures stomps and occasional close matches. The players are basically treated to the illusion that their gameplay and choices matter. The truth is that you’ve won or lost the match while you’re still animated in orbit. The choice is not Bungie’s manipulative mutation of SBMM vs CBMM. Bungie could make a genuine effort at ranking its players. Tiering players so that certain “ranks” will only match with other comparable “ranks”. Top third vs top third. Middle third vs middle third. Bottom third vs bottom third. But Bungie won’t because.... your fellow gamers host the match using outdated, unreliable, and inherently unsecure peer-to-peer networking. Bungie, by design, has built in network latency manipulation, and on PC - malware, aimbots, and mods. Even when people are not cheating - the quality of life problems due to distant connections hosted by players without standard broadband connections screw up efforts to play well. I don’t see how you build a meaningful ranked lobby unless Bungie actually makes an effort at quality control and hosts the game itself. Finally the player community played a part by making the CBMM matches intolerable to new players trying to learn back in D2Y1. The tryhards never left - but many hundreds of thousands of others have since D2Y1 thinning the player pool so that only wolves roam the forest now. It’s hilarious that streamers like Mtashed and Ascendant Nomad are worried that the same “skill creep” phenomenon that made crucible intolerable before SBMM is suddenly ruining Trials. A healthier crucible needs to draw players in with rewards so that there’s ALOT (and I mean MILLIONS) more players of all types to make regional random CBMM work across game modes. It also needs fewer game modes to create bigger lobbies among what’s left. It’s not SBMM or nothing.

Looks like someone wants some farming. Hey the playlist is right there it is classic mix. Is that what you want all of crucible to be? If so then go for it set everything to the same settings as classic mix. See how long it is before the entire crucible becomes classic mix in terms of player pool. That is really the end of the discussion.

That's not the answer. They need to address why ppl are not playing. Normal Crucible and Iron Banner I seldom have an issue. I haven't played Comp in 2 seasons now so I can't say on that. Trials has always been a shitshow. Removing SBMM from IB and Control/COMP is a bad idea. Even more ppl will stop playing. They did that once already and that in fact did occur. Listen I get you want to have fun. I get you want to just kick back.. but from the sound of it .. you are in that 2% man. So you should be matchmaking with those other players. Lets be honest 2%.. 10% .. that's not allot of players. To ensure a healthy PvP environment you dont balance a game for 2% or even 10% ... That's bad business and anyone will tell you that. Stop being so good? Use blue gear.. lose a few. lol You'll get matches with a bigger audience.

I hope you realize that your post is pro SBMM and not against. When you say that the casual playlist is there for everyone to have fun, you pretty much admit that SBMM is the only way to go. Because it's not fun stomp the opposing team, nor is it fun to be stomped by them. That's just boring.

You just wanna farm noobs at their expense.

[quote]This issue has been on the back burner for a while since Trials came back to a disastrous launch (great job, Bungo!) but let’s not let Bungie off the hook for this. SBMM in its current form is not sustainable in Destiny 2. It’s so aggressive that I consistently get put into 4v4 matches when it’s supposed to be 6v6. Multiple Unbrokens in every lobby (something like 2% of the community is Unbroken, for context), terrible connections... Just an overall terrible experience for a casual playlist. And that’s the key word here... These are CASUAL playlists, Bungie. Nobody enjoys sweating their ass off every single game in a playlist that offers no rank or similarly skill-based reward. These playlists are there for people to play just for fun. I can’t tell you the last time I hopped into 6v6 (solo or with friends) and just played for hours. I’ve probably played less than 20 matches this season because after 2-3 games I’m just infuriated by how unenjoyable it is and quit. And now that Trials has also become a bad experience, and the PvE content this season (or lack there of) is god-awful, I’ve literally been playing the first day or two after reset to get my pinnacle gear and I go play other games until next week. Bungie... Good players are just as important as casual players. We are the ones that play your game daily, buy every expansion, promote the game, and provide feedback to help you refine the player experience (although unfortunately it usually falls on deaf ears). Ruining our experience for the sake of casual players who will only play a few matches a week AT THE MOST does not promote a healthy player base! Casuals do not sustain any part of the game, PvE or PvP, long-term. This is why the PvP player base ALWAYS spikes after a major content release and eventually drops, before stabilizing at around 600k (before the game was F2P this baseline was 300k). This has not changed after SBMM was added. That should tell you all you need to know, Bungie. And yes, a lack of casual players is really hurting Trials currently. But that’s because of a myriad of other issues that result in casual players not being able to obtain any of the rewards. Casuals play PvP for the rewards, and there’s nothing wrong with that. But CBMM has never been the issue. Also... You’re free to have an opinion, but I won’t waste my time responding to anyone that repeats the typical “You just wanna farm noobs at their expense” argument normally expressed by those who claim to be quite passionate about PvP in this game, yet aren’t willing to make any sort of effort to improve. Cheers![/quote] Here’s the issue I’ve seen regarding the farming noobs thing. I’ve personally seen people and teams on stream ignore objectives in QP and Classic just to keep the game from reaching mercy just to farm stats. I’ve seen them actually end up in casual lobbies still rocking the hardcore meta while everyone else is using variety of stuff. Whether this is you isn’t the issue. The issue is it happens more often than you think.

Sbmm is here to stay regardless of whether p2p or dedicated servers are being used. Seems like the below average players are the ones who spend the most $$$ on microtransactions because there is no other logical reason business wise to reward bad players for being bad.

SBMM actually saved PvP from dying. Way more PvP players than before SBMM was brought back.

[quote]Casuals do not sustain any part of the game, PvE or PvP, long-term.[/quote][quote]And yes, a lack of casual players is really hurting Trials currently.[/quote] I don't usually comment twice on one post, but this was too good to pass up lol

I'm gonna make it three: [quote]Bungie... Good players are just as important as casual players.[/quote]Implying that casual players aren't good lol

Most decent players I know have quit Destiny 2 because of SBMM. I don’t know one single top 100% player, let alone play with them. Getting stomped one match(sometimes several games in a row, and enough to comprise an entire night of gaming) and destroying the next, provides no sense of control or getting better. For me and my average friends, what’s the point of playing if MM is constantly dictating the outcome of my matches? I finally had enough and left Destiny for good. I refuse to play any game with SBMM.

SBMM is a shambles and needs to be completely removed. I'm sorry but I don't like being the only relevant player on my team while the other team has a stack of two mid tiers and a god tier. Sometimes you're the hammer othertimes you're the nail. Better that than this SBMM that's a shambles.

Can't count how many times i start a match 4vs4 ,5vs5 ,5vs4 etc. Que times are ridiculous. PVP has become a shitshow. But at least 0.5 KD Bob who plays 4 matches a week has fun

There is only one casual playlist, it has CBMM and it’s the sweatiest one you can find.

I get wanting CBMM, but at the same time it’s not fun having low tier players getting stomped constantly. That happened a LOT before. And 2% have unbroken? I doubt that. I see and saw it like, a lot. Like so so much. Yet harbinger, something I haven’t seen even close to as much, has like 7% ownership in the community I think.