Im pretty sure the majority of people dont deserve them.. since I am sure they got them through account recoveries. lol

Says the person who uses Luna. OK

Sigh. Its not the weapons that are the problem, its how poorly balanced PVP in general is. PVP feels messy and unorganized and for a lot of people it feels unfair. An Lunas/NF stand out by circumstance because of it. Lunas and NF are actually healthy for Destiny because they keep people playing the game. The issue with pvp is the shrinking player base. You have to have people playing the game to even play crucible, and if only the hardcore players are playing guess who your matching. Bungie has to find a middle ground for their hardcore players and new players/casuals. Your seeing mostly Luna and NF in pvp because its mostly only PVP players playing PVP. Especially when between DLCs you have less casual pve players playing crucible. Yes we got powerful PVP weapons, but we also got new supers, op exotics, and unbalanced classes. If you picture the crucible right now without Lunas/NF you think it would be anymore casual friendly? Not at all. Those good players are still going to be good players even without the Lunas/NF. Bungie is awful at balance, they have NEVER gotten it right. We always have had a "meta" or something the masses find to be op that everyone uses and runs to the forums to cry NERF over. They have struggled at finding a middle ground in D2, where vanilla D2 was to casual, Forsaken was to hardcore. It doesn't help that we only have 2 crucible options quickplay/competitive. If your a new player neither of these playlists are going to feel right. Trials and elimination was a great way to take the hardcore players out of your standard playlist, but that's gone. This week is flooded with crying over Lunas/NF because pve players want a new exotic but hate playing crucible with the hardcore pvp players. Lunas/NF are from last season, they've been around longer then the most recent mass spam for nerf. My biggest issue with the crucible right now is the connections.

So to preface my comment, ive solod lunas twice. My account, and then a buddies. I used West of sunfal 7 on my buddies and nature of the beast on mine along the way and ran in to tons of lunas and NFs, but still managed. Luna is strong. Very strong (i imagine NF is even stronger but i dont have it, and probably wont get it until next season if ever). But it isnt head and shoulders above the other meta options in QP. Ace is just as good for QP stomping (even on console) Bygones can be just as good (albeit at a very different range) TLW is the ultimate counter to lunas, not because it kills faster but because it is best used while strafing like a mad man, so 3 tapping a good TLW user just doesnt happen... Heck, one of my personal favorite loadouts to deal with lunas / drb is ACE + y1 shock and awe. 30m+ and ACE can consistently smack luna once you have memento mori.... and up to 20m shock and awe smacks luna pretty hard too..... ALL of that being said, i would 100% be okay with magnificent howl only increasing precision damage. 3 taps would be less common by a bit, and you couldnt 1 head 1 body people if you have it activated off a different target. Not that that nerf is needed for QP, but in comp where engagement ranges are much more forced, luna and NF are harder to outplay, and the aforementioned nerf would bring some more variety to comp

Also hot take Luna is stupid ez to get.

Handcannons need to be permanently deleted. I couldn't care less and I had enough of Luna's Howl, Not Forgotten, Last Word... it's ridiculous it's like they forgot about other weapon types. Get the weapon designer and fire him

I'd just ban them from Quickplay. Keep them in Comp or in PVE. There's no reason to bring a competitive gun into Quickplay when average players just go in to have fun and/or finish a quest. The sweats get to keep their gun AND the average players get to enjoy Quickplay again. Win win.

[quote]I am happy with crucible exclusive pinnacle weapons. In fact, i wish there were more good pvp weapons that i could get without playing pve. However, in my opinion, Luna’s Howl and Not Forgotten do not belong in this game. At least on console, these two weapons are without a doubt the best pvp primaries in the game. some pulses are good, along with things like trust and ace still being great weapons, but lunas and not forgotten are just better. Sure enough they only come from pvp. This directly results in PvE players being very discouraged from playing crucible since they don’t really have anything to compete with, except i guess blast furnace, bygones, and trust. I know people worked hard for these weapons, especially those who got not forgotten, so i hate to devalue their grind. I don’t even have a problem with them myself, i’ve managed to compete using other weapons without much trouble except against really good players. I’m only saying that these guns are unhealthy for the game as a whole, and while they give pvp players something to grind for and stomp crucible with they also discourage tons of people from playing. I mean, just look on the forum from that past week. No one wants to do the last word quest because they dread going against not forgotten and lunas, even though the quest only takes a few games even for an average player. Just the thought of going against those weapons makes people not want to play, and in my opinion that is not good. I don’t know what the solution is since their would be an uproar if these weapons were nerfed and certainly if they were out right removed, so maybe this is just feedback for the future of the game. Don’t make primary weapons that are so strong that they dominate their slot and make people hate the crucible. Edit: for those saying i need to adapt and i need to git gud and what not, read the fourth paragraph. This post is not about me. NF and lunas don’t bother me, im pretty decent and can beat people who use them. The post is about the average player who just wants to hop on and play a couple games for fun but can’t stop getting a train ran through them in the form of a 3 shot at 180rpm every time they engage in a primary gunfight. Those average players make up a huge portion of the pvp playerbase and they are getting more and more discouraged as this meta continues. Also, I solo queued the lunas howl quest months ago and never use it, so saying i’m salty about not having it just isn’t really true.[/quote] Might not be what you want to here but this isnt a game for casuals. And what I mean by that is if you are limited on time may not be the game mode to chase after or go for the luna a couple games a day is about all you need to unlock. The LH or NF doesn't make you good yeah it's a great gun but you can out do it. If your bad at pvp work on your weakness and improve. I'm bad at pvp I know my habits and slowly improving.

You know it's funny. The only complaints for the current state of pvp are mostly pve players or those who dont primarily play pvp and pretend to prioritize pvp. Of course I'm going to defend lunas howl. just like how everyone tried to defend sleeper. I took time out of my day to play the toxic cesspool called comp in order to get that weapon. I may not use the gun a lot but I certainly wouldnt like it to be a mediocre pinnacle reward such as the Loaded Question.

This is exactly what True Vanguard said in a recent video. I have Luna's, but honestly I kind of agree. Ultimately Destiny needs to find ways to get more people into PvP, and I'm not sure Luna's and NF are actually helping the game towards that goal, and in fact may be hurting it.

I own both Mag. Howl guns and I agree. I'd like to see them nerfed personally to where Magnificent Howl only buffs your next critical hit to get rid of some cheese the perk has such as two tapping or two crits and a body.

Lol get a job

You are basically asking Bungie to tune their PvP to favor players who don’t like PvP. Which I find silly. I’m the founder of Abyss Asylum, a large alliance of clans. I have seen pvp clans form and die many times. In d1 we had an amazing pvp clan. We would regularly beat the top streamers. D2Y1 was a low point. It did exactly what you are asking for. It had never done more to narrow the skill gap and coddle to the non-pvp players. The result? All the decent to good pvp players left. The franchise almost died. Fast forward to now, we again have a flourishing pvp clan. Voluntarily scheduling PvP school and sponsoring tournaments. It’s a trade off. The lesson Bungie learned is that you need to balance pvp for people who like pvp. Doing otherwise is an oxymoron. They tried it, and it did not work. I’m hopeful they never go there again. I don’t speak from the cuff. I speak from the experience of watching hundreds of players come and go, and thousands of conversations with those players about the state of the game. All these people on here complaining DON’T LIKE PvP! Let’s not tune the game for them. If you like pvp, even if you are not immediately good at it, the game provides great challenges and rewards. I speak that part for myself, because I’m not that good at pvp, but love playing it now.

I would say Luna Howl and NF are the worst thing to come to Destiny. I have tried experimenting with other weapons but nothing besides last word can beat LH other than bad aim. Maybe a solution could be less shots or slightly more recoil.

Then some other weapons (ace and TLW for PC players) would become hands down the best options. NF and Lunas kill quickly but are not exclusively the best guns for pvp (I don't think Lunas is even a top 10 primary anymore). TLW and ace are equally as competitive as NF right now so you'd need to remove those as well I guess (if we went with your illogical solution).