The Vex are good not evil.
The only reason they seem evil is because they were accidentally thrown into our dimension by Crota. After fighting the Hive and Taken they realized that the best way to stop them is with "sword logic." They accepted this logic universally after finding one of the Worms, Black Garden, and now want to defeat everyone in our realm by programming themselves into our laws of "Physics." They are not doing this because they are evil. They are doing this because they see it as the only way of surviving.
The following timeline makes it more clear:
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1. Crota is tricked into bringing the vex into our universe.
2. Vex and Hive/Taken fight for centuries. Oryx succeed into "taking" the Vex Mind leading the battle but not before that Mind succeeds in sending out all of its info on the hive to the vex.
3. Vex use that info and travel through space and find one of the "worms" in Mars. The Worms are Generals of the Darkness. So far Oryx leads a successful Army.
4. Unable to understand the worm and seeing the power of religious influence the Vex deduce that the Worms are to be praised as Gods and that having a religion works better than their current system thus far.
5. The Vex protect the Worm by removing it from space and time and leave it in the Black Garden. Perhaps they now want to find the other worms and do the same. They deduced that species like the Hive wrongfully used the Worms.
6. Upon returning from the Black Garden the Vex traveled to Venus, Mars, And Mercury in the past and stayed there running simulations and tests to try to defeat the Hive. Vex deduced that the best way to defeat the Hive was by removing them from reality.
7. To do the aforementioned the Vex created the Vault of Glass on Venus and began testing it. Along it they created the Vex Mythoclast mainly to defeat the Hive.
8. The Vex also Created Citadels in Mars (Picture somewhere proving this, Google it), Venus and Mercury as the ultimate weapon against the Hive/ Other Worms. For some odd reason the other planets were left out.
9. Not knowing where to find the Hive or the Darkness/Other Worms the Vex became dormant and waited for them to arrive. This took billions of years. Who knows what else the Vex did. All we know is that like the Cabal, the Vex had to run from Oryx and got prepared.
10. Traveler arrives in Mars and runs into humans. Golden Age occurs.
11. Fallen, after the traveler, entered our solar system and encountered the humans and went to war over the traveler. The Cabal, fleeing from Oryx, also arrived and decided to prepare for him in Mars. This awoke the Vex in Mars.
12. Humans fought the Fallen on Earth and the Moon. The Cabal fought the Vex In Mars.
13. The Hive finally found all four species and entered our solar system.
14. The Vex are fully awoken by the Hive's presence. Due to the fact that it has more enemies at the moment it turned Mercury into a Machine immediately.
15. Full blown war occurred. The Vex used Mercury to its max and annihilated most of the Hive Fleet and anyone in that path. On Earth the Traveler and Warminds annihilated most of the Hive and Fallen. On Mars the Cabal succeeded in destroying the Citadel but the war was put to halt by the Warminds. Both the Vex and Cabal suffered a great loss by this and ended the war.
16. The Vex could have finished the rest of the Hive but they wanted Oryx, Crota and his Worms. So the Vex stayed low and moved to Venus to continue their experiments in the VoG. They also stayed in Mars to rebuild their Citadel and prevent the Cabal from ruining their plan.
17. Vex knew that with the few Hive left on Earth and the Moon that Oryx and Crota will eventually arrive.
18. Traveler, also tapped out, used its last bit of energy to defend the humans and so created ghosts/guardians. The traveler then went to sleep, perhaps to regain power.
19. The Fallen requested for more troops on earth and the moon. The Guardians tried to wipe out the Hive from the moon but failed upon Crota's arrival.
20. The Cabal requested for more troops and tried to fight off the Vex, one place at a time, to understand their technology in Mars and hopefully use it against Oryx. They too stayed in Mars and prepared for Oryx.
21. The Warminds disappeared, except Rasputin.
22. Some of the humans that tried to flee from the war were turned into Awoken. Perhaps a result from the Vex Machines.
23. Vex must be succeeding in the future which is why the Stranger visits us to help us. Stranger unfortunately does not realize that the Vex is not the enemy. The Darkness/ Worms and their military, Hive, are the enemies.
[/spoiler]
So overall, the Vex are nothing but a race of machines that were accidentally brought into our dimension. Like any other race would do, they did their best to defeat the Oryx and the Hive. As logical as they were, they deduced that the best way to defeat the Hive and the Darkness was by wiping the Hive and some Worms from existence and by worshiping and using some worms to their advantage to do all of this. Sword logic was the way.
Now if they were truly evil, wouldn't they just go to earth and have a massive attack while the traveler slept? Or go to the Moon and invade it, wiping out the Hive, Guardians, and Fallen all along. They did not even bother much with the Cabal in Mars.
The Vex just want to build their anti-Darkness/Hive/Worms machines and prevent anything as such from ever happening again. In other's eyes this may seem evil but to them it is purely logical and moral.
[b]The Vex were "dragged" from their "space" into ours. They got defeated by Oryx. Some managed to escape through Vex Gates. Oryx Ordered his son to defeat them. The Vex time/space traveled in this new dimension with two purposes:
1. Defeat Oryx/Hive and the Worm/Darkness
2. Live Forever. (This was their Initial Purpose)
The Vex can do number two without rewriting physics, because it is logical, doable and moral.
The only reason they now have to rewrite physics is because of number 1. They met an enemy they couldn't beat, Oryx, and an entity they couldn't understand, the worm. Worshiping the Worm still did not help them beat Oryx. So their last resort is to "rewrite physics" so that they can eliminate threats like himself whenever they want, thus the great experiment, Vault of Glass. [/b]
All this time all we have been doing is getting in their way and weakening them. We destroyed their conflux in Mars, Venus, and we got rid of Atheon who could have been a key weapon of theirs and for the VoG.
Like the Stranger said, choose a side. She clearly knows nothing about the Vex, or Oryx, and perhaps their success in the future makes her hate them. She believed the Vex were the most evil beings ever, but she clearly never met the Taken King. Oryx himself can "control" this evil. What would she have said about him? The Taken must have been defeated in the future. Unfortunately it may have occurred at the cost of Guardians or we just got into the Vex's way.
Thoughts? Opinions? Post Below!
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#Destiny
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9 AntwortenYour grasp on Vex lore is a bit lacking. Interesting, but you're missing a few things. I don't feel like listing everything but here are a few things: First things first. The Vex aren't really machines. The milky substance in their casings is actually a radiolarian fluid, remnants of their possible origins as an organic species. Ikora's dialogue in the the Restorative Mind strike also speaks of a heart inside their metal casing that still beats. In fact, if you refer to the flavor text in VoG armor, it makes it sound as if wearing the Vex armor is more familiar than wearing your very own skin. Almost gives the idea that the Vex may even be some distant descendant of the human race......moving on. The Vex have been around for a long time. They have seeded planets with their tech almost since the birth of those same planets. When Crota experimented with tearing holes in dimensional barriers, all he did was open a hole in the walls of the Hive throne realms and the Vex network and the Vex came pouring in. The Vex are a hive mind with many programmings, each one dedicated to a particular task, whether it is learning about an enemy's tactics, baiting out their true strength, building structures, etc. This is the reason why the Vex on Mars are not going all out against the Cabal (and us). In one of the Grimoire cards, a lone Guardian and her Ghost are watching some Cabal and Vex duke it out but comment on the feeling of being watched. At that moment, Rasputin unleashes one of his dormant death rays and devastates both enemy forces. This prompts the Guardian and the Ghost to wonder who won that battle: Rasputin for testing his reawoken strength, or the Vex for having drawn out a sleeping super-weapon like Rasputin? Also, when the Vex invaded the Throne Realms, they learned and adapted to the Hive. They quickly learned of the Sword Logic and used that knowledge to create Quria, Blade Transform (if I remember his name correctly. Half-asleep), a Vex personification of the Hive's Sword Logic. Ultimately, it seems it was no match for Oryx and almost sounds like it was "taken" in the Lore. Moving onto Praedyth's dialogue. He talks about "the pattern" and how that's all that the Vex can see. If the Vex are so narrow-minded and they truly are, now, just a culmination of programmings with one ultimate directive, then everything that is not of the Vex's design is considered imperfection. Quoting Ikora, "the Vex see imperfection". Anything that gets in the way of their "pattern" will be considered a threat, an enemy. I don't believe the Vex are inherently "evil" but they will despise evil because it is imperfect and hinders their march towards the Pattern, their "perfection". "Evil so dark it despises other evil." This is where we enter the realm of speculation as there is no concrete evidence in the Lore. The Black Garden's heart. It looks exactly like the artifact we claim from Oryx when we are creating Touch of Malice. The most popular theory is that we ripped out the Worm that was living within Oryx. It makes some sense in that it gives power in exchange for life force unless sacrifices are given to it (Touch of Malice's last bullet infinitely reloads and doubles the damage of each of those bullets in exchange for your health BUT regenerates your health every three rapid kills), much like the arrangement between the Hive and their Worm gods. Back to the Heart. It has one obvious difference: it looks "digital". The Lore states that the Vex created it and decided that worshipping it was the best option. When the Vex invaded the Throne Realms, I believe they did find a Worm and studied it. Again, the popular theory is that they recreated their own version, their own, personal "Worm God". In seeing how the Hive received power in exchange for worship of this Worm God, they decided worship of this new creation was the best route to follow. And that's all I have the patience for. Keep diving into the Lore! It's fun to discuss things like this.
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11 AntwortenThe Hive aren't evil, they're amoral. They have accepted the fact that the only right there is in the universe is might and that by fighting wars, they are helping to perfect the universe by ironing out its flaws. In short they aren't killing people for pleasure or for no good reason. They are merely acting according to the laws of the universe, survival of the fittest.
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5 AntwortenBearbeitet von Trickyson: 6/3/2016 10:16:55 AMWow. Very nice. This is a vex post that actually makes sence. 1 question though i didn't see anything about it in the post and you might know it. [spoiler]spoilers below[/spoiler] [spoiler]spoilers below[/spoiler] The mission for the patience and time. Where you have to anger the vex and kill a minotaur. Why arnt they already shooting you when you go in. Why are they peaceful and not attacking you. Edit: Not patience in time. The No time to explain
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1 AntwortenBump for later
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1 AntwortenBearbeitet von TrulyDontCare: 6/2/2016 9:00:05 PMDamn good point. The Cabal and Fallen are out for conquest and The Hive are out for absolute power. The Vex's only real motivation seems to be surviving. Although, in the Echo Chamber strike (which you don't have on XBox) Icora talks about how the Vex are basically trying to change our world. "Where we see beauty, they see imperfection", she says. They might just be trying to survive, but they seem to be doing that by destroying us and "perfecting" our world.
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Bearbeitet von zxionisus: 6/3/2016 7:19:56 PMI know they are good because they always wave to me before I kill them. They are always so nice. Actually, they are a cross between the Borg collective (Star Trek) and CLU (Tron). They want to assimilate everything and or wipe out any imperfection.
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2 AntwortenYour theory is supported by the crit area on the vex being their power in the stomach area. white light similar to the ghost that powers our guardians ,except built in like a future evolution of an Exo guardian .
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2 AntwortenIn the Grimoire, the Vex's vision of paradise sounds eerily similar to a planet transformed by the Traveler.
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6 AntwortenEvil so evil it despises other evil. Or in the words of Mermaid man EEEEEEEEEEVIL
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Good and evil are rather unfortunately muddled in Destiny. But there are two sides. Amoral Deep. Moral Sky. The Vex were worshipping the Deep-that-is-the-Darkness in the Black Heart (I like the Idea it is a worm or Ahamkara). Therefor they basically qualify as "evil" though they are calculating machine. Really though, "Evil so dark it despise other evil" does not work anymore. It is only in there because originally the Traveller was evil and creates the vex to simulate timelines from which to feed. That was scrapped, so a lot of grimoire is just leftover crud from then. The Stranger is the biggest plot hole leftover. Now? They just are. Until more plot fills the massive holes, we are left with machines who want to outlive the universe. Whether or not we are part of that is the question.
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Some decent thoughts but it's all based on your misunderstanding of the lore so kinda moot.
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I don't think you quite understand Sword Logic.
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I think destiny should include its story INSIDE the game, not the grimoire
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I think, and this is just my opinion, there are at least two factions of vex, and that one of those factions could be pointing us to stop the attack at the twilight gap. Sending us back to stop the fallen, because we are needed in there simulations somehow. That's why the mythoclast was made for human hands, not vex. Only time will tell, so i could be wrong, but the idea could be the "with a twist" that was stated about the raid. Far fetched, i know lol.
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13 AntwortenSo the Hive aren't bad either.
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