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5/1/2016 2:41:08 PM
243
Hand Cannon Phantom Bullets
Hey community, just wanted to get your opinion on this as well. I am a hand cannon user and have loved them from the beginning but nothing drives me more nuts than hand cannon phantom bullets.
If you use a hand cannon then you know what I mean. You land that perfect first shot and then either your second, third or fourth shot just plan misses even though your gun is aimed straight at his head or chest.
I feel like hand cannons are close but I really feel like this need to be addressed. I forget Bungie's exact wording but it's something to the extent of taking your time with each shot. I'm sorry but that's not possible when you have people running around with guns like DoP that can mow you down almost immediately. With a hand cannon I don't have time to steady each shot to ensure it hits in these instances.
I don't mind losing a gun fight but it drives me nuts when I lose a fight that I clearly would have won had that last bullet registered.
What do you guys think?
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1 AntwortenCongratulations. I believe your thread (among all the reasonable complaints of the community) really helped fix some handcannon problems. Now maybe the low range handcannons will finally hit stuff and we can focus on other perks rather than range. My only complaint is they need to put the hipfire perk back in for them because I'm so used to hipfiring the sidearm and other weapons, and it just seems like the hipfire perk really helps handcannons for that close range usability.
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2 AntwortenThis also brings up the uselessness of hand cannon archetypes that either have low impact, high ROF or high impact, low ROF. The Kumakatok HC4 is a legendary hand cannon I love to use for how fast it fires, but it's less effective if you compare it to mid impact and ROF hand cannons because no matter how much speed the hand cannon has, you still have to pace your shots to hit anything (unless you're using The Last Word). And high impact hand cannons, like my other favorite, Judith-D, aren't that great either because they require the same amount of bullets to kill a guardian as a mid impact and ROF hand cannons need. You could say a low armored guardian gets 2 head shots to kill, but that's basically a small majority of players which could be easily taken out with a mid impact that has crowd control. Mid impact hand cannons not only have the advantages I pointed out, but they also have a perfect mix of good stability with good range. The Uffern HC4 has higher stability and range than the Kumakatok HC4, which means that the Kumakatok will kick more and miss more with no advantages over it's competition. This makes the mid ROF hand cannons the most viable choice in PVP and that makes other legendary hand cannon types pointless. My best advice for a change would be to give high impact hand cannons a 2 head shot kill (unsure if a 3 body shot kill would be fair though), with a low stability or slightly slower firing. And the High ROF hand cannons should get a faster fire rate and/or higher stability so they can at least stand out a bit more the same way the High ROF auto rifles do (minus the extreme range they get of course) and maybe a little more ammo for the high ROF handcannons. I just want high impact hand cannons to feel like an actual HAND CANNON and also to have high rate of fire hand cannons feel quick enough to take on anyone in CQC.
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19 AntwortenBearbeitet von TrulyDontCare: 5/7/2016 2:09:40 PMEdit: holy shit. I'm erasing this because I'm sick of getting responses. I really don't care. If you don't agree with an opinion of mine, especially about something as trivial as a video game weapons, that's fine. You don't need get emotional about it.
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I dont like
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7 AntwortenI only use hand cannons. I try scouts from time to time just to remember how it was fun when all your shots went where they were supposed to. Phantom bullets are a massive problem with hand cannons. They are less of a problem with long range hand cannons but still a problem. And they don't happen only at long range, they happen plenty of times at close range. And that's the problem. Hand cannons have become a close to medium range weapon in year 2. But pulse rifles are a lot better at medium range. Hell, even autorifles are better at medium range. And in close range with phantom bullets it's almost impossible to win against an autorifle and totally impossible agains a good DOP user, it will melt you in two bullets, you will never fire the third. Pacing shots is impossible in close range, you will die. Even the first curse, with its perk active will shoot phantom bullets and that happening in a slow rate of fire hand cannon is just bs. And yes, I can have great games with hand cannons but the feeling of leaving the fate of your matches to luck just sucks. Do it, Bungie. Remove bloom, buff hc accuracy!
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Bearbeitet von argh i r pirate: 5/7/2016 10:38:39 AMKind of ish. Max range and it's much less of a problem. Edit - imo hand cannons are the best weapons pvp atm.
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5 AntwortenBump this post!
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1 AntwortenHand cannon bloom is unneeded, unwanted, unwarranted. If the sight is on target and I pull the trigger, it should hit....period. Range on a HC makes the cone smaller, stability reduces the time it takes for the cone to get smaller when on target as far as I have tested. With HC the way they are, they are not viable in PVP and have limited utility in PVE. First curse works only because it's exotic perks. Aside from that, the phantom bullets are killers.
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1 AntwortenUnfortunately this is the end result of nerfing an entire weapon class, when only a few exotic HCs were the problem.....
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Since range is tied to accuracy, handcannons should get a 10-15 point blanket range buff. This would solve phantom bullets and make handcannons a viable choice in pve.
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More range = less phantom bullets
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3 AntwortenThe current state of Handcannons.
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2 AntwortenTLW hip fire is the worst with this literally the way the gun is supposed to be used. I have had almost full mags be phantoms with hip fire.
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2 AntwortenWell I was wrong in my case. I play with TLW and thought I was having phantom bullet issues. Turns out it wasn't phantom bullets or bloom. It was hit detection. After recording a few clips and getting an app that allowed me to slow down game play. I seen what was happening. My first four shots were hitting, but I was able to fire a second shot before the first one hit and so on. So I was firing five and six shots to get a kill and it seemed like phantom bullets. Really the last two shots were not needed. So to fix this they would have to make the hit detection quicker. Thus improving TTK. I don't see them fixing this because it takes just under a second to get a body shot kill with TLW as is. I am going to keep recording questionable situations, but examine them a little better before jumping to conclusions. I don't play much with other HC so I wish you guys luck. I do suggest recording your shots that should have hit and using an app to slow it down. That way you might see what's happening. If it really is happening post the clip and maybe Bungie will review it.
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They want them to be played with at a pace that does not exist
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20 AntwortenBearbeitet von mac: 5/3/2016 12:01:46 AMhttp://xboxclips.com/macnetism/327701c2-af3f-4bda-aec8-6aad0589e14f This clip perfectly demonstrates the huge amount of bullshittery bungie has done to handcannons. I'm still an avid handcannon user and i will never let them go but stuff like this is unacceptable. It's just frustrating to loose gunfights when you should have won them especially in gamemodes like trials where every death is hugely punished. The 2.0 nerf to handcannons was just too much, legendarys were perfectly balanced just the exotics needed to be tweaked yet bungie still nerfs the whole entire weapon class into the ground. After 8 months of waiting for my favorite weapon class to be fixed i'm at a point of losing hope, it's just frustrating.
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Bearbeitet von Danosaurus: 5/4/2016 1:27:34 AMI want this thread to gain traction, hopefully bungie will take notice and take another look at hand cannons
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4 AntwortenBearbeitet von Lord Fried: 5/3/2016 8:53:30 PMMaybe I'm just terrible with Hawkmoon in PvP, maybe I'm not, but I've missed shots that seemed to be right on target.
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2 AntwortenThe fools won't just increase the range across the board. I think accuracy is included in range stat. I [i]think[/i]. Regardless, phantom bullets are annoying.
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They're annoying as hell....makes high rate of fire low impact hand canons useless.
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5 AntwortenRead the patch notes when they got nerfed. Sounds like they are working as intended.
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Bungies choice was to buff the hawkmoon individually instead of the entire class. Sometimes i wonder about about those guys
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6 AntwortenIt's cause people and I'm guessing this means you too try to spam bullets, but hand cannons have alot of recoil so you need to try to correct for it. You can't just blam the hand cannon and say it has phantom bullets, don't be a panic shooter and control your shots scub. ;)
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Bearbeitet von KellTheNoble: 5/4/2016 12:43:01 AMThis post also shows the imbalance of auto Rifles to Hand Cannons https://www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Post/202744408?page=0&sort=0&showBanned=0&path=1
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2 AntwortenTrue. You are supposed to pace your shots, irrespective of the weapons rate of fire. So i ask myself, what is the point of having a rate of fire on a weapon is we are penalised when we shoot it at the say rate of fire? I cant understand the logic behind this.
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15 AntwortenBearbeitet von NobodyJustBrad: 5/3/2016 3:05:22 PMTry pacing your shots instead of spamming them. Tip from Bungie themselves. When most hand cannons can 3 shot headshot, yes, you absolutely do have time to pace your shots. Make them count and you'll win. Rush or miss and you're dead.
