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3/17/2016 7:13:05 AM
238
Vault of Glass > King's Fall, and for ONE reason only
This is why:
Vault of Glass is never too punishing, nor is it too easy. If one person dies (assuming you have a full fireteam), the rest can continue just fine, with little to no difficulties. If the guy with the relic dies, just pass it on to the other guy. If you wipe, it doesn't really take very long to get back to where you were.
King's Fall? You're shit out of luck if even ONE guy dies. This is especially apparent in Totems, Deathsingers and Oryx. Bonus "I'm screwed" points if the person that dies was the relic runner. And if it's hard mode? Too bad, if one guy dies (or heaven forbid he disconnects because Bungo's servers consist of two potatoes and a tulip), you're doing it all over again.
Take Golgoroth Challenge for example. It doesn't matter how far you get into the challenge, if so much as ONE guy dies, you have to do it ALL OVER AGAIN. It's not that I suck at it, it's just so tedious to do it again. Oh, and don't get me started on the random disconnects. It's bad enough that the servers consist of two budding potatoes and a dead tulip, but if one guy disconnects? Restart. They don't even have the courtesy to give you back your ammo, or at least spawn you back alive. You start from nothing when you reconnect.
It is for this ONE reason why VoG will always be better than KF. The fact that VoG is willing to forgive beginners' mistakes (and the servers' screw-ups) and still be a fair challenge. KF is like, "Hell no, bitch, you screw up or if the servers die on you, I don't care, you do it again."
And I think that this is why the people who host LFGs for KF are less forgiving than the raid itself.
On one LFG raid, they asked if I had a 300 Black Spindle. At the time, I only had a 299 Black Spindle. So what did they do? They kicked me. Come on, it's close enough.
That's all I have to say.
English
#Destiny
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Bungie wanted getting killed in kings fall deadly for the whole fire team so it can have more teamwork value
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I was really hoping the reason would be Xylar.
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Bearbeitet von Selario: 3/18/2016 7:06:39 PMYou can five man all of the things you've listed, (aside from Golgoroth challenge) I've actually done it before. It takes a lot of communication, especially on totems, though.
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KF is fairly forgiving but less straight forward. I don't think it's fair to compare golgoroth [b]challenge mode[/b] to regular VoG though. But I could be off point because I only skimmed the Op.
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Bearbeitet von Deadmennwalking: 3/18/2016 4:19:52 AMI really enjoy both VOG and KF. KF is certainly far less forgiving and there is less places to "hide" a weak player. For example: VOG - so long as you had 2 experienced players then you can carry the team. Crota - lets face it, this is a 1 person raid and others can come along for the loot. KF - The only part where you really want all 6 players to stay alive is totems. The rest can be done with 4 or 5 players. I couldn't count how many times we have killed oryx with 5 players. Sometimes even 4 players if we are on the last round. I actually enjoy players having to be responsible for their actions and for it to have a direct effect on the rest of the team. Can you explain why you use a KF challenge mode to explain why it is worse than VOG? Surely as VOG has no challenge mode then you should be comparing KF with no challenge. I also seem to remember VOG and Crota lfg posts used to ask for the mighty Gjallarhorn.
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29 AntwortenBearbeitet von PurpleFuzz: 3/17/2016 9:26:27 PMIt's pretty clear you never ran hard VoG under leveled. Or as hunter. I'm just saying. They are quite literally throwing loot and rewards at you these days. Constantly. If you think hard Confluxes were forgiving back in the day, it just means you weren't here back in the day. :-) Edit: No fault of course for not being here back in the day. But don't mistake running a 150 light raid as a 300 for VoG being easy. It wasn't easy.
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Lmao if somebody dies durning confluxes the rest can not continue just fine. I've done it many times with 3 or 4 on hard mode but it isent just fine it's just like when somebody dies durning warpriest or oryx it's a lot harder and not just fine you run the risk of wiping and spend more time on the cp. the rest of vog tho can be just fine tho if somebody dies I like kings fall more because of this reason
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6 AntwortenYou could say that the Vault of Glass is... timeless
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For me it was better because not every encounter was a boss. The mechanics for kings fall are cool but 90% of them are just steps that result in everyone standing around shooting a bullet sponge.
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They could alleviate the grind in all of the hard raids by allowing revives like on normal. They don't do because you wouldn't spend as much time in the game.
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I liked it because it had a feeling of mystery
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VoG is really nostalgic
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4 AntwortenYou can 5 man kings fall. Its just relly hard
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I have made the same conclusion on my own, I agree
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1 AntwortenTry hard vog hard while level 26-27 with only year one blues and maybe a legendary somewhere on day one of release and tell me it's forgiving
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I remember running VoG back when i was new to it and was finding the right raid friends, it was a good struggle, then I do it year 2 with my foil during Atheon and have a giggle. Next while on this past break I helped a group of kids who didn't have TTK so I helped them all the way through and explaining everything and watching their struggle. But it was nice to help someone, yet again this is only because of how VoG is as you said very forgiving, I can't expect anyone whose overleveled to help new guys through Kings Fall
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Imo, i like kings fall for one main reason that everyone kinda has to have a part. Dont get me wrong i loved vog and crota but most of them its was only 2-3 people that had to have a part and rest got carried. The amount of time that i went into both raids, they wasnt many people who would like to run any relics. For example: right ill go into mars and get relic and whos got venus ? And all you can hear is silents or right ive got the bubble ready do we have swordbearer and just quiet again, right guess ill pop my bubble and run sword. So imo kings fall is good cause like i said everyone has to do something insted of just sitting on a ledge and shooting.
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Bearbeitet von VestigalOrgan: 3/18/2016 2:49:41 PMA team of 6 should be able to do the golg challenge in 2 passes. My team has done literally every part of that raid a man down and still managed to beat challenges and the raid.
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I've 5 manned or better every part of every raid in it's prime season. It does require more coordination between the team for TTK, I think that was the point.
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1 AntwortenTo me, VoG will always be superior. Don't get me wrong, I like King's Fall, but what I really liked about VoG was the companionship, flexibility, and mystery it presented. King's Fall is a single mission: go in, kill the king. The environment is hostile. The enemies scream at you. And you're always too busy either explaining, assigning, or performing tasks that there's really no time to roam around and just have fun. Plus, there's less cracks and crevices to explore. Yes, it is a great raid, but VoG was just so much simpler yet had so much more. Here was this chamber that no one had ever explored and lived to tell about. It's filled with sci-fi yet strangely magical creatures, like the harpies. There were back alleys and routes to find. Heck, there were different ways to do the jumping puzzle (superman all the way!) And if stuff went south, or someone was trying out a new role, it wouldn't matter so much if they slipped up. Usually it was the source of many laughs. The glitches sucked... but hey, where time is in flux...
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4 AntwortenCrotas End > VoG > KF. The reason being the rewards for doing the raid. Sure the VoG gave us some iconic weapons we all love, but there is no denying how amazing the Crotas end weapons are. The Oversoul edict and the Sword Breaker are two very underrated beasts. KF ranks the lowest because I honestly can only think of one of the weapons thats actually usefull, and is actually really any good. That weapon would be the LMG. Also the lack of any elemental primaries just makes them bland. Most if not all the weapons are nothing more than food to raise up weapons that are actually good. [spoiler]The armor looks cool though[/spoiler]
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1 AntwortenI had somebody disconnect once as Oryx was coming up in the middle for the final part, the only time it was never a problem. It was hilarious, but we all felt bad for him.
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10 AntwortenComplaining because it's too hard? Sucks to be you
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Year 1 loot drops felt better, cause of the elemental damage, first fatebringer drop( goodbye TDYK) was a big a moment as the gjallihorn. VoC eluded me for a long time. And that bloody exotic chest, the Number of times a lfger would drop the gjalli and the regulars were like "here we go again".
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Totems can be done with four people and no cheese
