I'm sorry, but their response in yesterday's TWAB was about as tone deaf as one can be around what is shaping up to be a game-breaking problem.
Masterwork cores are not a problem because they are poorly named. In a loot-based game, VERTICAL PROGRESSION should never be a "meaningful choice" (Which seems to be your organization phrase for "limit player options and pressure them to engage the game in the ways we prefer"......ala Faction Rally's "meaningful choice")
Masterworks cores are a problem because there is a game-breaking mismatch between the end-game function of horizontal progression that they were originally designed for, and the BASIC mid-game function of VERTICAL progression that they are now being asked to serve.
Vertical progression (the basic accumulation of player power, and ability to resist damage) should NEVER be a "meaningful" (painful) choice in a loot-based game. It should always be a simple INVESTEMENT grind. You accumulate power in proportion to the time you have invested in the game. Which is why the vast majority of games handle this like Diablo 3 does. You play the game. You acquire Experience Points. You invest those in unlocking powers from a character skill tree. For most games, you accumulate 90% of your power this way, and gear is just the horizontal progession icing on the vertical progression "cake".
IOW, you can take a Level 70 Wizard in Diablo 3....equip him in the worst gear in the game....and that character will STILl be STUPIDLY powerful.
But Bungie decided to forgo this. They decided to off-load what are traditionally character skills and make them "perks" on gear. I GET why they did this. This is a paradigm that is more familiar and comfortable to shooter gamers. However the SECOND you guys made this design choice, GEAR progression became a part of the game's VERTICAL progression....and players lost a significant degree of control over their vertical progression.
Which means that your Investment Team LOST a great deal of their flexibility in terms of designing workable system.
By effectively rationing the means by which to progress gear, they are creating a SEVERE bottleneck to what is the game's BASIC function.....beat enemies....get powerful gear....beat more powerful enemies....get more powerful gear.
Especially since this game does NOT drop a representative sample of the loot-table. I'm nearly a month into this game, and the only reason why the number of sidearms and grenade launchers that I've been getting is still something of a funny joke is because I'm a veteran player who was sitting on close to 200 MW cores (in the form of stockpiled weapons) at the start of the expansion.
If I were a new player, or a player coming back from a break....I'd be FURIOUS right now. Because the "meaningful choice" your Investment Team would be imposing on me is either play with weapons that are 10-20 power levels BELOW my optimum because I can't acquire the resources (cores) to infuse them.....
....or try to play end-game level content with two sidearms and a grenade launcher.
Anyone who thinks that this is a reasonable quandary to put your average player in need to have their desk cleaned out, and escorted off the premises.
Masterwork cores don't need to be renamed. They need to be REMOVED from the economy of infusion. Because---at their current availability----they do not drop with ANYWHERE near the frequency the need to in order for this game to have a HEALTHY system of progression.
If your Investment Team intends to dig in their heels on this one they need to EXPONENTIALLY increase their availability. IOW, THERE NEEDS TO BE A SOURCE OF THESE CORES THAT IS FREELY FARMABLE. Just like weapon parts, legendary shards, and planetary materials.
A source where the player is free to acquire as many as they want per week, in proportion to the time they invest in acquiring them. No RNG. No weekly "caps".
If they don't do this, they will break the game....and you are going to find your player numbers start to drop off as people leave the honeymoom period...and start losing their patience with this game's dysfunction around progression as it stands right now.
[spoiler]Moderator edit: This thread has been moved to #Feedback forum so that other Destiny players can weigh in. [url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/139533839/0/0] See Cozmo's thread here[/url] for more information about the #Feedback tag and its uses.
Feel free to private message the moderator who moved your post, link to topic for further clarification about why this topic was moved.[/spoiler]
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#feedback
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So now we have Enhancement Cores... 🙄
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Bumpity bump
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117 RepliesWe appreciate the additional feedback. I will pass your thought along to the team and let you know when we have more details about upcoming changes to Masterwork Cores.
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3 RepliesPeople keep saying that infusion is a "meaningful choice" now. What is the meaning behind the choice? I'm not sure anyone actually knows the answer to that one, because I sure as hell don't. Infusion has no bearing on a player's ability to progress in the game; it is simply replacing one item's number with another's, destroying the second item in the process. Requiring masterwork cores for infusion is a hostile addition that doesn't make the game better.
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Face it, y'all pulled a rookie move and blew yer wad too soon.
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8 RepliesAs Derrick Jensen said, all writers are propagandists, and that includes Bungie. When they say "meaningful choice," they're conflating meaning with having fewer options. It's clever wordplay designed to obfuscate the fact that they're intentionally limiting player options, and thus player creativity. The new infusion system is meant to act as a throttle, but really, it functions more like a tourniquet. Well done, man.
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4 RepliesI applaud you good sir. As someone who is coming back after a 3 month break after doing everything in warmind over and over, I had 25 masterwork cores at the start of this expansion. I'm now struggling to get into end game raid content and wish ender dungeon due to the fact I cant infuse gear to meet power level requirements. I'm furious at this decision to make masterwork cores with like what you said were for end game progression, not everyday progression known as infusion. Hopefully this is heavily read upon by devs.
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1 ReplyEdited by U7731848: 10/1/2018 2:07:47 AM*applause* This is correct thinking and shows a stark contrast to these fools. If one removes or makes unfeasible my progression in my toons; My reason for playing diminishes each and every day. I started Forsaken with hundreds of cores saved up. I now have... 0. Unable to progress. Thus, shortly, I will have no reason to play anymore. The correct resolution is to remove them from infusion. Glimmer and planetary supplies are enough. Cozmo...This change needs to happen now.. right now. Not a month or 6 months from now. Right now, or watch the player base slowly diminish each and every day due to this lack of forethought and proper QA testing of your product. This should have been caught.
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2 RepliesI play a lot so at first I wasn't too bothered by the MW cores or the plants and magical elements required for infusion but after a few weeks in I can say that as a mostly PvP player it is somewhat annoying to get done playing a crap ton of matches only to have to run around and pick plants or pay Spider hundreds of shards for one more MW core. It made lagging out when I was just about to beat the first underworld quest at only 522 Power that much more infuriating. I understand that the investment team wants everyone to have to select which weapons are most important to them and for everyone to not have the same exact weapons and masterworks 2 months into Forsaken but I'm sure I'm not the only one who blew a ton of cores just trying to figure out the infusion system after launch. Please just do what the OP says and come up with a way that infusion materials better reflect the amount of time a player puts into the game. I think what the community was asking for was that things like legendary shards be made useful not just completely depleted down to zero.
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1 ReplyThanks for the post as I’m still not Destiny2, the game seems to get worse and not better, it doesn’t reward for the grind nor does it cater to the wider audience in bringing new players and older veterans together and there always seems to be a divide between the two, the worst console game I’ve ever seen in my forty years in gaming, mainly due to the social function in game or lack thereof and also as you state, the progression system as with the social function are all about slowing the player down to revisit the next day and not rewarding for the time spent in the game!
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chill they said there would be more ways to obtain them. it's kind of a strawman to say their solution is to only rename the damn things.
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2 RepliesWell said. Cores need to be completely removed. This is by far the worst infusion system from the entire franchise.
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Thank you for writing this. Bungie is suffering from chronic up-butt syndrome again. It's obviously affecting their hearing and eyesight. At least when it comes to feedback.
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7 RepliesI'm pretty close to quitting and I rarely complain about anything, but the 1-2 light level up a week (if I'm lucky) after hours and hours of game play is getting tiresome. Honeymoon is over, divorce papers are now filed.
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Well said
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6 RepliesI have spent more time doing mindless crap in an effort to get to the appropriate power levels so I can take on the "new content" Thing is I am not even close at this point. I have two exotic quests I cant even start cause they are 580 and over. Being 567 and stuggling to hit even that has sucked my enjoyment. I used to run 3.. now its only one character. Don't even get me started on clan bounties.. New exoitcs?? Other than quest related I haven't seen a single one. Cant tell you the last time I even saw an exotic drop. Even the new weapons are meh.. I would still be using my prior season gear and weapons if I could. The new stuff is just not good. Even with random rolls. Just not impressed with the loot.
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Edited by Whopping Dingers: 10/1/2018 9:09:20 AMVery well put Kellygreen2 I've gone from about 100 to 47 cores and buy 5 from spider everyday just to top it up. Thank goodness I have 6000+ legendary marks. I feel sorry for all the new guardians coming into it.
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3 RepliesIf the gear was as diverse as that of Diablo. I would spend hours just to create an unstoppable character. I've built my character to be immune to the effects of the Red Soul Shard and one hit most bosses in top tier great rifts. Just wish I could do that in destiny. Would be a lot of fun mowing down enemies. Testing out combinations with gear perks. Build a character worth killing gods.
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God, I wish Bungie actually understood how bad this is. Stop the other crap they have going on and ADDRESS THIS NOW. Destiny 1 Day 1 player once again ready to walk away from their half-baked answers, broken promises and progression throttling.
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This. This this this this this! These EXACT Words! It is the truth, and apparently some people just can't take it or take it seriously. This post I 100% agree with, and yet we all know bungie is just giving half-*ss excuses. "We'll fix this", "We are listening." I'm getting really tired of it. And I'm legit about to leave this entire game behind. And I have been loyal since the VERY beginning of this B's madness. Vanilla, Curse of Osiris, Warmind, now FORSAKEN HAS THESE PROBLEMS! I was so hyped. Then, I simply saw the Mw cores in infusion. And I was back to where I was feeling about this game. I legit feel like a toy who can't even work properly whenever I run out of stuff just for infusion. And if they screw up, one more time, I'm out, gone, and I have been waiting, waiting, and waiting for them to fix this. I have been waiting for spectral blades to be fixed, I have been waiting for my power to improve. NOTHING HAS CHANGED ABOUT HOW THEY SCREW UP. Sure it's hard to work out the kinks in the game, and even create one, BUT THEY HAVE BEEN DOING THIS FOR A YEAR ALREADY! And I'm tired of it. That's all I have to say. I agree with 100% though Kelly, keep it up! ✌️👍
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[quote]If your Investment Team intends to dig in their heels on this one they need to EXPONENTIALLY increase their availability. IOW, THERE NEEDS TO BE A SOURCE OF THESE CORES THAT IS FREELY FARMABLE. Just like weapon parts, legendary shards, and planetary materials.[/quote] Seems someone glossed over the part of the TWAB where they said they were doing just that. In any case, I'm all for MW Cores being a part of the infusion costs. I don't think having a full set of gear that you want should be a trivial thing to accomplish, rather a mid-long term investment you chase over the course of the season. I do think, however, it should be a little less grindy than it is now, which adding in more reliable/farmable sources should help to alleviate.
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I can remember having to use double snipers for a long time because I wasn’t getting any other gear and they were my highest power weapons. I’m not a great sniper and I didn’t have the mats to infuse them into a weapon I’m good with. The game was not fun. There are some really great changes with Forsaken, but the catering towards extreme hardcore players and streamers is blatantly obvious. If they don’t fix the infusion system quickly (easier sources for cores or removal entirely) they’re gonna see that drop in players again. Monster Hunter misses me badly...
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Upvoted and supported.