When D1 became stale to me, I tried Warframe, and, it was fun. I know it's improved, but, not enough to bring me back. Then, I went to The Division and that was fun for a while, too. However, there were MLG shotgun sniping bullet sponges that made Fatbaby look like an anemic Dreg! Not to mention when you unload 10 rounds of point blank shotgun hate into them, they just keep coming. And they never reload! I quit after that nonsense. And, the Dark Zone. Oh the Dark Zone. It got to the point I was working on the lore. Then, came the crafting nerfs. And that did it for me. Between my RNG and nerfs, that game now makes a great coaster. Mind you, I'm not DDF. However, I love D1 and D2. From the music, to the sounds, to just sparking my imagination. For example, how is it Nessus has life even though the Vex remade it yet Mercury is devoid of it? And, for argument's sake, dismiss astrophysics. That has always intrigued me. Were CoO and Warmind short? Yeah. But it didn't stop me from playing. Does my RNG blow? Like a leaf lower after Mardis Gras. But I keep playing. And, I satirize my RNG now. See my rant about a certain exotic sparrow that drops more than the famed Edge Transit. Or getting class items when I need weapons. That sort of thing. Yet, I still play. Why? Because I enjoy it...

Bungie refuses to understand that the chase has to be difficult enough to be interesting.....but accessible enough that you don't strain player patience....and they quit in frustration. Also they refuse to understand that RNG loot is both acceptable and desirable. But RNG progression is not....and neither are RNG accomplishments. Also low drop rates for items is okay for activities that can be aggressively farmed. But to saddle something with a really low drop rate AND you time-gate it by either limiting the number of times people can run it (raid) or by cycling the activity out of the game (Meatball, Shattered Throne)... ...you run the risk of violating my the first rule....and having people quit in frustration. Its important because people who quit in frustration generally don't come back to the game....and the sure as hell don't recommend the game to others.

I call it chasing increasingly diminishing returns. The state of the reward system right now can be summed up as: work harder, longer, and apart from a few notable exceptions earn back the same weapons/gear we handed to you in D1 already. I think what’s happened (as evident from the massive reduction in responses on these forums) & elsewhere is players have finally wised up - and are gradually hopping off the hamster wheel for pastures new. I just saw the twitter responses to the defacto tweets from Cosmo promoting Crimson Dullards - with a large number of responses along the lines of “*yawn* great jump on and grind out pvp to get a chocolate ghost shell we earned once already in D1”. See you all in D3!

Imagine having only two opportunities a week to get kicked in the nuts. Thats what the Jotunn grind is like. I'm at the point where I now only log on to get kicked in the nuts, after that i log off and play another game untill the weekly reset rolls around to get my nuts kicked again. RNG is one thing when you can just continuously farm for that one thing you're looking for whenever you want at your own leisure, but then you put that content behind a Phone game tier time gate? Time gating has no place in a game like this, let alone a $90+ AAA game. Very disrespectful of the time I invest in this game, and there are other games that will respect the time i put into them.

I know you heard this before, but Bungie being free now might result in some solid changes (especially given the competition they now face). Take a break and check back, Guardian.

Yeah I agree that rng is the main drive of this game and you shouldn't be whining but it's a bit too absurd if you don't get an exotic after running the raid 40x. Raids are pves most challenging missions and you should definitely be rewarded for them. What's the point of doing anything in the game if you aren't rewarded? Drop rates should be higher, or maybe implement a way to boost the drop rate or my favourite idea; making the raid exotics into quest lines that don't use rng.

I heard somewhere, Reddit maybe, that leaving D2 alone for awhile increases exotic drops. So I didn’t touch D2 for about a week or two, played something else. Logged on after awhile and got three forsaken exotics in one day one of which was shards. Either that’s the mechanic for exotic drops or I just happened to get ridiculous rng after reading that post. If you’re annoyed with D2, maybe step away like I did for awhile, worked for me 👍 Granted it’s not and ideal mechanic, not touching the game to get more loot than actually playing it shows some flaws in rng I know. Just my 2¢

Thanks.... I'll pass that on to the team

I lost count of how many times I soloed tree of possibilities, and didn't get DFA Luckily I got dredgen after 12 meatball kills in gambit but that was already a long time so yeah it sucks

It's [b]R[/b]eally [b]N[/b]o [b]G[/b]ood...

“I’m a beta D1player” You knew what you were in for then.

Sorry for wall of text. There are various kinds of "random". Jagged Alliance 2 was known for showing you middle finger and not giving you armament you were looking for and knew your enemies using it, but there was a chance to knock down an opponents and literally grab a weapons from their hands. At times it was the only chance to get something reliably. Here? Hmph. I understand, it is somewhat too difficult to assess something when it's truly random, but in my case Destiny 2 misbehaves a lot in this department. Don't know how many Strange Terrain NF - no Osprey. And reading someone running 60 without still getting one kills any desire to play it again. Especially given that everyone I played that mission with got at least one. And you guess right, it's the only thing that bars me from Wayfarer title. Though I'm not sure what it'll give. Over 220 matches in Gambit, 2 rank resets, still only 4 Hazard of the Cast (3 of them suck). I could have at least 5 Breaknecks just for participation (btw, such "participation rewards" for frequenters should be mandatory - free shards and masterwork cores couldn't be pass by). But I got a lot of Trusts and Bad Omens. Not to mention armour, that took more than entire page in vault. Yes, only Gambit armour. Of two recent rewards from Drifter - two nearly identical Pillagers (and it's not the first time - more than once I got nearly identical armour). Ship? Well, finally got it recently, and when I got it it was no joy, not even relief, but complete indifference and apathy. Since I mentioned cores - not a single finest matterweave for weeks and I dismantle a lot of stuff. My last exotic drops (not purchases from Xur, praise he may be) - that sparrow, Other-schmather, something with skull, I don't care. 3 in row. Srsly? What should I do with them, put them in one slot and run Sviridov's Troika? Duplicates of ships/ghost shells, including exotic ones. And you can't normally dismantle them - return of materials is just too low, if any (may be a bug, not sure). Game been bombing me with Go Figures. Gun I don't use. I don't like burst rifles in this game. All powerful frames I got I do in Bergusia since it was opened for everyone. No Jotunn. Recently got Le Monarque, true, but my clanmate got two in quick succession. He always lucky, got all pinnacle/raid/rare stuff at rates none of us can do, which frustrates rest of us a lot. I practically live on Mars for weeks (minus regular Gambit and Forges), doing all kinds of stuff, only few days ago got EP sparrow and it took me waaaay too long to get Bray Scout Rifle. I think I was at Node 38 when I finally got one. Tried that "living" in DC, got full armour set, true, but had very few other items that suppose to drop from non-raid activity. Thankfully Her Royal Majesty gave me third seed of light, so I'd say "this is fine". Banshee, despite I dropped him several thousands gun parts, still holds some guns, which, according to Collection tabs, should drop from his rewards. Ada keeps selling me quick slings and dragonfly specs. Sadly I can't use them as tiles in my bathroom, they'd fit nicely in checkerboard pattern. Zavala gives me only sniper rifles, shotguns, and grenade launchers. Forge rare bounty? Had one. Long ago. Hence can't progress Izanagi. Over 70 matches in Crucible+Competition, no Chaperone quest. Obviously I can go on and on for each and every other activity, I'm pretty sure all of us has our own list of pet peeves. Unlike Jagged Alliance 2, where you could use "underpowered" weapon just fine and do not feel weak because of that, in Destiny 2 any form of "competitive" (i.e. PvP) element will put you in undesirable position. Yes, I use Blast Furnace in Gambit, but mostly because only with its range you have some chances to fight off the invader, given how inconsistent heavy (and special) drops are. With any autorifles (which I like) my "arms" literally too short to deal any semblance of damage against any burst rifle. And speaking of Blast Furnace - I got one with Air Assault and Slideshot. Who decided to put Air Assault on Burst rifle? Powerful frame, mind you. :) This Bungie's approach to lock things behind excessively exhaustive, unpredictable grind which is less entertaining than watching moss grow (and I do grow moss) or paint dries (I'm construction worker, so I do this frequently as well) is not just frustrating, it may be infuriating. Mainly because it is so inconsistent - I got tons of Go Figures I don't need, some people pray they'll get one some day. My clanmate was struggling to get IKELOS SMG, I got two in row already after I got my first. My another clanmate got all pinnacle stuff for all his characters, while game keeps giving me that bloody sparrow. Given how Escalation Protocol armour is "protected" by drops, I see zero reason why not implement reasonable protection for other drops. Especially for older items that no longer relevant. I mean, who is going to be hurt if more people will find Bray Tech guns? Or those DC cosmetics people seem to be complaining about. Since I got all 40 Sleeper nodes you can't accuse me in being lazy or impatient, and I don't demand to give away everything. But existing time brackets are way too wide and unpredictable. Someone voiced concern, that gamers will leave game if there is nothing to grind for. Well, I got Breakneck and then, 5K kills with it later, Hazard of the Cast and haven't left. I think I got at least 200 hours more. I'd enjoy forges even more, should related activity be less annoying (fewer runs to Ada, more modulus reports). I always assessed games by their gameplay loops. If it is interesting, then it is not that much relevant how many things there are to complete. Take Assetto Corsa - you unlock everything with your credit card, got all tracks and cars opened and you can play with any combination of them. My most favourite part that sold me this game (and force feedback steering wheel)? Back in Early Access days, it had one rather slow car and quite ordinary, if not boring track. But it was still very interesting to drive, more interesting that do unlocks in many other supposedly "funnier" games. ArmA series. Again, everything is unlocked at purchase, pick whatever you want (or mission designer allows) and go use it. Windward. Don't know what is else hidden there, but as of now I unlocked all I could and enjoying process ever since. Grim Dawn, your "hack and slash" (or in my case - "pew and kaboom" as I play for Demolitionist) Destiny brother. Game gave me class-set I looked for and I haven't changed it despite I upped the difficulty twice (i.e. completed game three times), did all available quests, and still goof around despite total lack of anything new there for me. All this because those games core gameplay loops are interesting, engaging, entertaining, and fun to play. Destiny 2 has almost everything needed for be in same line, but it suffers from same problem Diablo 3 had for me (and Grim Dawn doesn't) - it has too much grind to move forward in some aspects, too much to turn fun into chore. Kellygreen2 already thoroughly wrote down Cores issues, this thread, like many other, highlights a problem with general loot drop rates that turn down either "reward" or "competition" (skewed weapon meta) aspects. When supposedly "entertaining" activity instead of uplift and joy at the end makes you quote Droopy's "you know what? I'm happy" I'd say it is most obvious sign something is very wrong.

I'm trying for Wayfarer and I have one gun I need from Anna. It's been shitty brutal. I'm even buying seraphite from Spider. Even worse than that is the Braytech Osprey. I may have to tap out over that one. I miss the chests from D1 for strike specific loot.

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