People thought blade dance was op but at least they got headshot one shot by snipers and one shot by golden gun. They also had to get close so could be mowed down by team shotting or countered with shot gun melee. HoS has none of those disadvantages. We sort have had options vs blade dance but our options are diminished against HoS Blade dance counter = snipe headshot Gunslinger counter = snipe headshot Self res counter = snipe headshot Stormcaller counter = look on their general direction, they will die Hammer of sol counter = night stalker suppression and suppression nades?!? Gunslinger kills everything one shot but hammer of sol. Hammer of sol essentially has the range of gunslinger with a few times the armor of blade dancer and a few times the power of blade dancer (blade dancer won't one shot another blade dancer or hammer of sol, hammer of sol apparently one shots blade dancer). I think that head shots don't one shot HoS with a high impact sniper is probably a glitch. And taking more than one gunslinger bullet? But yeah something about HoS still isn't quite balanced if all the rest is true.lol. Running may save yourself but the range though lol. I also mean more counter as in stop in their tracks and save the other blueberries. I hear fist of panic and suppression abilities are all that truly work against a skilled HoS player in that regard. But even if fist works...getting close to the hammer yikes. Some have managed to bladedance hammer too but it's not a one hit and there is time for sol to get of hammer so looks like those players were not good and were flanked or team shot. It's not as bad as some make out I agree but is it really quite balanced enough? Probably not. If fist works then I guess nova bomb would too. Seems a bit unbalanced in itself forcing people to use subclasses that can take HoS though. PvP may start to revolve around taking out HoS...indicating lack of balance. If HoS really does have that slight edge to it...and it seems to. Just like when we all had to use thorn or counter with red death or beat thorns TTK with last word. Pvp sorta revolved around thorn at that point. Edit1: Vast majority are not skilled. In any subclass or with any gun. Less so the new stuff. I'm focussing mainly on skilled guys because why worry about the not skilled? If a skilled player is near impossible to stop - and avoid a kill streak/team wipe by another skilled player/skilled team purely based on their super then that super is probably a bit op? Can lead to strats revolving around the op super/weapon in competitive matches like trials or maybe even IB. Came up against a team of sun breakers in clash and got wrecked. Constant orb and supers with high shields and crazy range. Died at spawn, died sniping, died running...I mean seriously!? Just the whole team being wiped over and over at spawn? No way out, no counter. Think of pantheon and memento... Edit2: +fast movement speed with titan skating! Edit3:- trials of osiris. Hammer pops near your team. What do you do? Run knowing likely at least one team mate will die? Is it near enough a gauranteed round if they pop it in cover really close and titan skate after you and have good aim? Edit4: you can throw what, 7-8 hammers? Without an exotic to buff it! Edit5:- I main warlock and have a Lvl 40 titan with a lot of the perks unlocked. My worry is if I want to main warlock in a competitive match a bit of electricity from my hands is easily countered with a hammer to the face. The hammer will still be going so why self red in trials. That leaves the only option of save a nova bomb and hope to hit the hammer of sol guy before he hits me or switch to main a titan in pvp. Which means titan is op. Edit6;- those nades too. Perfect for clearing thieves den tunnels. Great for zoning. Good damage and burn. Not one person has said how they'll deal with this in trials lol. We'll all be maiming sun breaker as they will dominate, you know that right?!?? Have all easily taken out noob hammers with everything from swords to storm trance to just hitting with primaries to double snipe head shots. But they clearly had the awareness and aim of a cave dwelling fool. Nobody cares about those fools. I'm talking about people with aim and map/radar awareness. Plus they have an increased auto aim perk...lol Really, it's not op? It's fun being op sure. And finally the titan is tanky like it should be, but is it not a little too far? Edit7:- so the perks of tracking hammers and exploding hammers are in different skill trees. That's pretty op. Also health regen and increased armor in different skill trees. That's a bit op. Exotic helm as great as it is...turns your prix rocket into a mini truth...for pvp that's a bit op. HoS is like the old The Ram meets blade dancer +++ lol You can even choose a The Flash fire strike melee whilst doing hammer turning you into a hammer dancer. Throw more hammers is also part of the exploding hammers perk?!? Wtf? Two perks in one! That's an exotic class perk right there! A good point about the better armor was made, saying blade dancers have more mobility. True-ish but titan skating + hammer dance melee pretty much nearly cancels it out. It's better than the new blink and probably better than the old. Sure it only lasts whilst in super but still... Also... Ever notice how everyone that says no assumes you main a hunter and instantly gloats that hunters die all the time from it now and it's about time...strongly hinting that it's totally op? Lol giving the game away a bit chaps. Others have said both no whilst admitting it's op and saying it should be!?!? Erm...no it should be a solid subclass but it should be balanced a little better. The other two titan classes weren't balanced well either, too under powered, hence the nerf blink endless whining. Well blinks nerfed. You guys want balance or just to be the one true op class? I guarantee 100% of the people near enough voting no on this were the loudest nerf blade dance, nerf blink whiners on the planet. As I said I main a warlock but I can easily main my titan...but how many weeks before that gets old? Playing sunbreaker all the time just like we ended up playing thorn all the time. That'll be fun forever, right? It's good when things are balanced, we get more options to play with. Edit8;- Sunbreaker 71 kills in pvp?!? http://youtu.be/hQrHGrwM_54 Edit9: is it the armor perk that drops on new gear for increased solar armor that gives Titans the bladedance plus pre patch ram +++ armor or is it their regular super? Could just be a way op armor perk after all! Edit10: been playing with my Titan in pvp quite a lot now. Yeah the perk choices are op. One hammer is a double kill that heals me and I can throw 8. They track so duck aiming. I can play like utter shite but if I get my super up twice and no skill the super I walk away with 1.5kdr at least at the end of the match...and I'm only just getting slightly better than average at pvp in last couple weeks. It's just a bit op. Perk choices need to be more like weapon perk choices, with meaningful trade off, the build is too strong right now. Edit11:- 90% of iron banner appeared to be Sunbreakers and 99.99% of mayhem clash appear to be sunbreakers too...those that voted no, get wrecked. If you think no please say why not in the comments. Cheers.