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Edited by YamatoV_1:
12/22/2014 3:36:35 PM
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I dont see why you would need a program to hide what you are doing/saying from anyone. You say freedom of speech and all that but don't we get away with saying pretty well whatever the hell we want without such programs as Tor. Call me stupid or whatever but if you need to hide your dealings then you probably shouldnt be making said deals anyway.
EDIT: Since this post I have been reminded by OP, aswell as a few others, that something which can be good shouldn't be taken away because bad people corrupt it.
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In free countries, under most circumstances you don't need Tor to speak out. Authoritarian systems however you do or you face persecution.
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True. When I posted this I hadn't thought about such circumstances and have since been reminded by OP. But probably the thing that altered my opinion was "there will always be criminals". We shouldn't take away something which can be good just because some people use it will ill intent. Guess I should edit my original post so as to avoid further confusion. :)
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Edited by YamatoV_1: 12/22/2014 3:53:22 PMProof that two people with opposed views can have a polite debate and that stubborn fools like myself can have their minds changed by a sound, logical counter arguement. :) Some faith in humanity restored.
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Tell that to activists in totalitarian countries or to people who whistleblow on illegal government activities you fucking shithead.
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I didnt insult your beliefs, no need to insult mine. Thats just my feelings on the subject. And I dont know, so legit question: aren't there other ways to whistleblow and fight back against crap dictatorships and whatnot? Ways that dont require a program that makes it entirely too easy to do more bad than good?
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Not really. This is the solution that was developed to solve that problem. The idea that we need to shut down the tools of free speech just because some people will abuse them is the mentality of a boot licking coward.
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I see your point but surely some part of mine makes sense aswell, right? People need a way to speak out and call governments and companies on their bs, that's not the aspect of Tor that I see fault in and maybe I was too general in my initial response. I'm not the most clever person in the world, or at my own house even, but surely there is a better method. Or perhaps something to protect against those negative aspects that Tor also facilitates.
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The whole point of this sort of thing is to allow unrestricted communication. Criminals will always exist no matter what you do. Getting rid of Tor would do very little to stop the bad people in the world. But having this sort of open platform is essential for free speech. Having a place where anyone can say anything is a beautiful thing, and if you really think that the negative outweighs the positive on such a platform, then you honestly have a pretty depressing opinion of your fellow man.
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I do have a pretty depressing view of my fellow man. But you have changed my mind. If I liken it to gun laws then I totally see it from your side. I'm not a "gun nut" but I do believe in the right to own a firearm. Just because bad guys do bad things with firearms doesn't make firearms bad, it makes those people bad. Tor isn't bad, just some of the people who use it. Well argued.
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Thank you. And sorry for insulting you. It's just disheartening to see so many people so willing to throw away the good things in the world out of fear.
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A lot of that fear comes from a lack of understanding. People like you help combat that type of fear. Small bit of my faith in humanity restored. +1
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Read the links you idiot.
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I didnt insult your beliefs, no need to insult mine. Thats just my feelings on the subject. And I dont know, so legit question: aren't there other ways to whistleblow and fight back against crap dictatorships and whatnot? Ways that dont require a program that makes it entirely too easy to do more bad than good?
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I never shared my beliefs I just called you an idiot because that's what you are.
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Well thank you then. And my response was meant as more of a general response to you and the op who did insult me. My bad for not being more clear on that. :)
