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9/22/2021 12:50:13 PM
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What are you people screwing up so bad that you're constantly getting shatterdived? Fr I only get hit by it maybe once every 10 or so games. Either y'all are really bad at positioning or are one trick shotgun ponies.
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I only got hit once by it all weekend. It’s still a problem though. When every encounter with a Hunter is: “I need to back off so I don’t get shatterdived into next week”… there’s an issue. Only saw 1 Hunter running something not stasis this weekend.
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I had a very similar experience. I don't think it's necessarily because of shatterdive itself. I think the stasis neutral game is just really good. My setup for trials over the weekend was stasis, but with coldsnap and touch of winter. Basically I used Tricksleeves the whole weekend to melt at about 12 meters and when enemies decided to try to encroach on my personal space (aka come running around the corner with a shotgun or trying to close in for the shatterdive) and when the rift campers with stag tried to post up, I would either coldsnap freeze them or cause them to back off of their position while melting with Devils Ruin, Peacebond, or Drang. It's a tool to compliment my primary game and not so much of a tool for cheesy kills. Obviously I can't speak for other stasis hunters.
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No that’s pvp… Every encounter you should be respecting your opponents loadout and planning out how to take them out. If they’re running HHSN you gotta keep that in mind for close encounters If they’re running arc web you gotta keep that in mind and not group up If the titan is running suppressors you gotta keep it in mind. Etc etc etc…
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[quote]No that’s pvp… Every encounter you should be respecting your opponents loadout and planning out how to take them out. If they’re running HHSN you gotta keep that in mind for close encounters If they’re running arc web you gotta keep that in mind and not group up If the titan is running suppressors you gotta keep it in mind. Etc etc etc…[/quote] Except all of those have downsides and counters. HHSN requires you to charge it up, and you can’t jump or shoot your gun. Arc web requires teammates to stick together Suppression grenades take skill to use. And have to bounce on the ground before activation Shoulder charge requires the sprint and you are stuck in it to continue it. Etc etc. Shatterdive + glacial grenade has no counter or downside. It comes out instantly and there is nothing you can do about it
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HHSN stops your jump… you can definitely jump with it… Arc webs abilities to force players away from each other for an easy pick is what makes it good… Hardest to use maybe… but it still can time out supers even if it doesn’t hit since the person in super HAS to respect it or risk losing their super and being an easy pick… It takes like half a second of sprinting and you can slide, shoot, and still get the shoulder charge off… Shatterdive combo is countered by literally knowing how to play. Map positioning, radar awareness, and gun play. Shatterdive has no range. Throwing a glacier and freezing someone out of range is useless since they’ll be out of it by the time you get there and shatterdiving it will be almost certain death. So it’s the same as dealing with other CQC weapon and abilities. It’s startup is its [b][i][u]JUMP AND THE BEGINNING DELAY OF THE DIVE.[/u][/i][/b] While it’s super killing potential is really strong… a way easier more effective and consistent way is shotgun melee on bottom striker… and if you’re close enough to shatterdive a super… you’re close enough to shotgun melee it…
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[quote]HHSN stops your jump… you can definitely jump with it… Arc webs abilities to force players away from each other for an easy pick is what makes it good… Hardest to use maybe… but it still can time out supers even if it doesn’t hit since the person in super HAS to respect it or risk losing their super and being an easy pick… It takes like half a second of sprinting and you can slide, shoot, and still get the shoulder charge off… Shatterdive combo is countered by literally knowing how to play. Map positioning, radar awareness, and gun play. Shatterdive has no range. Throwing a glacier and freezing someone out of range is useless since they’ll be out of it by the time you get there and shatterdiving it will be almost certain death. So it’s the same as dealing with other CQC weapon and abilities. It’s startup is its [b][i][u]JUMP AND THE BEGINNING DELAY OF THE DIVE.[/u][/i][/b] While it’s super killing potential is really strong… a way easier more effective and consistent way is shotgun melee on bottom striker… and if you’re close enough to shatterdive a super… you’re close enough to shotgun melee it…[/quote] Okay, so you can’t double jump with HHSN. Jumping doesn’t really help you much in situations. You have a great point about arc web. But it doesn’t prove anything….That doesn’t make arc web broken. That’s just being smart. Spreading the opposite team doesn’t guarantee that you pick them. Your point about suppression grenade also doesn’t prove much. If you time out a super without even throwing your grenade. Than that’s on user error. Not on suppression grenades. Suppression grenades can be baited. Shoulder charge taking a second to charge is one of the reasons no one ever complains about it. Not to mention that it is a high risk/high reward ability. Shoulder charge got its tracking nerfed and has to be precise. Also has less range than a shotgun. Meaning sidearms, smgs, even handcannons all counter it. Not to mention that every class has a shoulder charge, and it’s called felwinter’s lie. It’s one of the reasons why shoulder charge is one of the worst melees in the game. Also, if you are able to shoot, slide, and get a shoulder charge off. That’s skill. Not broken. Shatterdive + glacial grenade combo has not counter. Or downside despite being a ohk. Map awareness, radar awareness, and gun play are not counters. All of those require the Shatterdive hunter to simply be bad. Not because we are good at killing him. Big difference. First off, not a single hunter throws a glacial grenade to freeze someone out of range. Let’s not do the make up scenario thing please. If you are frozen, you are dead. That entire point is invalid. And I love that you brought up jumping. I knew you would. Which is why you proved my point. The best thing about Shatterdive is that you don’t have to Shatterdive instantly. If I freeze someone, and i am in the air. I can choose whether it is safe or not to Shatterdive. Although most hunters don’t do this as you will most likely shatter to get the free kill. You can freely shoot people while in the air and Shatterdive to safety and kill the person you froze. That cool down on Shatterdive doesn’t make a difference at all. And is not even what’s op about the combo. Shatterdive is completely fine imho. The problem is glacial grenade. It’s the fact that it comes out instantly and can accomplish everything. It can freeze, be used as cover, and for damage. Suppression grenades need to bounce on the ground first. Other grenades can be used for damage and area denial. Glacial grenade can do all. My suggestion is to give glacial grenade the same nerf that howl of the storm recieved. To simply make the crystals appear slower. This makes it so that you can react to the glacial grenade quicker. If frozen, you will still die. If not then the crystals can be used for cover or to break them to get your grenade back faster.
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You’re whole argument is that if you’re caught by it your dead… Well… I mean when something catches you in it’s best case scenario… it’s gonna be strong… The suppression scenario is just that… it can be “baited” so can everything else but it still has to be respected. Baiting a suppression grenade while mid super is still spending super time. To Shatterdive effectively 1. Has to be in range. 2. Has to freeze you (or you just have to for some reason stay next to the glaciers even when not frozen. 3. Not die while doing it… meaning they have to get close without just getting primaried down. The combos only questionable part is it’s super killing ability… what IS really annoying and could arguably need a nerf is exactly what you just stated… the glacier grenade as a whole… it can do too many things on top of being used as a bomb…
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[quote]You’re whole argument is that if you’re caught by it your dead… Well… I mean when something catches you in it’s best case scenario… it’s gonna be strong… The suppression scenario is just that… it can be “baited” so can everything else but it still has to be respected. Baiting a suppression grenade while mid super is still spending super time. To Shatterdive effectively 1. Has to be in range. 2. Has to freeze you (or you just have to for some reason stay next to the glaciers even when not frozen. 3. Not die while doing it… meaning they have to get close without just getting primaried down. The combos only questionable part is it’s super killing ability… what IS really annoying and could arguably need a nerf is exactly what you just stated… the glacier grenade as a whole… it can do too many things on top of being used as a bomb…[/quote] You are right that I am basing it off of the best case scenario. But it doesn’t make much difference because those abilities can be countered/have downsides. There is a reason why no one complains about suppression grenade, shoulder charge, HHSN, even Throwing Knife. And this was before beyond light even came out during worthy/ arrivals. Shoulder charger actually got it’s tracking nerfed in worthy and you have to be precise with it. Time spent being scared of a suppression grenade. Has less to do with the suppression grenade and more of user error, like I stated already. Suppression grenades force you to be smart without flat out limiting your options. Shatterdive + glacial grenade is just restrictive in all the broken reasons. Shatterdive is not broken, neither is cryoclasm. It’s glacial grenade that’s broken. Also, any nerfs to Shatterdive would just kill it. And we do not want that. I want balanced not the murder of a subclass. Glacial grenade can be used for [b]everything[/b] and comes out [b]instantly[/b]. Other grenade can be used for damage, Area denial, cover, platforming, and suppression(freezing), not to mention it comes out instantly. Suppression, skip, etc grenades require a bounce, meaning it’s not instant. Not to mention the explosion is not instant as well. Which provides a way to react to them and save yourself. Pulse, vortex, solar, etc come out instant, provide area denial, but do not serve as cover. And if you kill a Shatterdive hunter, that is not because you outplayed them. It is because they outplayed themselves. Shatterdiving in the middle of the map or where you make enemy contact will get you killed. That’s why it’s great that you can Shatterdive in any direction. It’s the fact that you can use glacial grenade and choose to Shatterdive it or wait. Same applies to cryoclasm just to a lesser degree. Which is why I think they should give it the same nerf like they did to the Titan aspect howl of the storm. If they make the grenade spawn crystals slower then it would make it have a downside. I have the unpopular opinion that killing supers isn’t op with the ability. I like that hunters can do it, it’s just that it’s too easy. So, I don’t mind that the damage and radius stay the same, just that the crystals spawn slower so that you can react to it.
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Yes, but none of those are as oppressive as shatterdive due to how quickly and safely a Hunter can just spam it. HHSN, just back up as the bolts spread out too far once you’re about 15m out. Arc Web’s damage and range is pretty pitiful. The only things that are as oppressive as shatterdive are Arc Souls and Dunemarchers. All have one thing in common: they give you a benefit with close to 0 risk.
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You have to be in proximity of multiple enemies for dunemarchers to be anything other than increased sprint speed (and you most likely died trying to get in proximity of the enemies).
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Edited by PapaSohan: 9/22/2021 2:02:47 PMlol, do you just camp in the back with a scout rifle the whole time? Or, are you another hunter which is always jumping with their stompees in the air? Shattercrutch is preposterously OP and if you can't see it you're blind, bottom line. Even my two hunter friends I play with and grew up with, who always defend their cheap hunter abilities, admit that shattercrutch is stupidly OP.
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Shatterdive is only op to players that lack primary skill… When a whole abilities usefulness is destroyed by common sense and a little bit of thumb skill it’s hard to call it op…
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Love it. A Dude who has a 3.8kd and 25% win rate with 7 kills per game (most blatantly obvious campy kd farmer) and a 0.8kd player are defending shitterdive lol
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And the quick play warrior that is barely positive in comp thinks it’s broken 😂 Use that Pali you got there. It’s highly effective at shutting down Shatterdive when you land your shots. [spoiler]You can’t believe this is my main account 😂[/spoiler]
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This Donny guy lol. "You're wrong because your KD is too high" "you're wrong because your KD is too low". Quickplay star lmao. So much tiny -blam!- energy lol.
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Exactly I don’t get it 😂
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and no i dont believe its your main account. you clearly made it to farm stats by hiding in back spawn in qp, getting 6 kills and then leaving any game that you might lose (hence the 20-30% win rate) so why should anybody be impressed by those stats lol
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Lol im sure the few games of comp you played at like 1600 elo back in season 2 were tough
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Actually I main sidearms! Drang and Sturm or Peacebond and Cloudstrike/Uzume. I'm always too close for handcannon users to deal with and too far away for shatterdive and shotgun users to deal with. Use stasis as a defensive tool of someone gets too reckless. Very very good. I position well unlike most of y'all apparently.
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you also have a 0.8kd lol you dont position worth -blam!-
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Really depends on the map and the opponents which is random. It’a not like it’s every game all game. Close range map against triple stacked 2k+ elo revenant hunters, you will have to play significantly smarter and harder than them. That’s just a balancing issue in that case and a valid one.
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Shotgunning shatterdive apes is the best counter to it. I mostly die to it while sniping.
