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12/22/2020 1:57:53 AM
32
Uldren Sov’s Transformation to the Crow
I hate the guy. He killed Cayde. But now that he’s Crow, I think that the way Guardians treat him now is kind of mean.
The dude has no idea who Uldren Sov is and he said that he doesn’t want to know. There are stories of Guardians who destroyed him as revenge and that’s exactly the reason the Spider keeps him as his pet Guardian.
Should we forgive and forget for the Crow’s Sake?
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4 RepliesNEVER forgive. NEVER EVER forget. He killed Cayde. Plain and simple. Every single time i or any other sane individual looks at his face, we will constantly be reminded of the man who killed the Hunter Vanguard and felt no remorse for what he did. Even after he got snapped out of his little brainwashing. He didn’t feel a shred of remorse or regret for what he did. Neither should we. I pray we get the chance to put a final bullet in him and his Ghost. So that he’d be dead for GOOD.
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5 RepliesForgive and forget? Crow didn’t do anything though. Uldren Sov did and I clearly remember putting a bullet in him
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2 RepliesEdited by GorlockTheDestroyer: 12/25/2020 1:53:50 PMWhenever I have to listen or talk to crow, I skip his dialogue he's not worth my time for what he did to cayde.
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It's not just mean for guardians to mistreat him; it's hypocritical too.
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Uldren is dead Crow is good people
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2 Replies(Just going to copy and paste what I said to someone earlier, sorry.) It’s kind of an example of Theseus’ Ship, except with his mind. If all the components have been replaced, can Uldren’s mind really still be Uldren? Yes and no. No in terms of physicality, as every piece, or “board”, of Uldren’s mind has been replaced with Crow’s mind. Yes, as the basis of the original boat still being the boat now, is up to the people who believe either way. In other words, if other people believe that it is the same ship/mind, it is the same ship. If they do not, they do not, as it is the attachment that makes something worth something to someone. So it is up to us. Crow/Uldren said that he never wants Uldren to come back (“Uldren is dead”), however obviously any level of faith has to come into play for someone to believe something. I genuinely believe that Crow is Crow, and equally a good guy, however Uldren has deceived Guardians in the past. We just have to believe he isn’t Uldren anymore.
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19 RepliesEdited by TheArtist: 12/22/2020 12:30:05 PM[quote]Should we forgive and forget for the Crow’s Sake?[/quote] You've already answered your own question. THE CROW hasn't done anything that has to be forgiven or forgotten. Its also obvious to anyone who takes the time to talk to him, that he is NOT Uldren Sov. The Crow seems older, wiser, more soft-spoken, more self-aware and empathetic than Uldren ever was. So the irony, is that he is an object lesson in the power of prejudice and bias. He is being persecuted/punished for what he looks like. For the crimes that someone WHO LOOKED LIKE HIM, committed. When the truth is that the actual guilty party is dead and gone. The story is giving those of us who don't have to live with these things in real life, a chance to see how unfair they are.
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Yes. Death is the ultimate punishment, and the emotional and psychological manipulation he has been put through by Riven, Savathuun, and probably even Mara Sov has shown that he never meant what he did. Who we see him as now, as the “Crow”, is a completely different person than Uldren, showing that Uldren’s personality and reaction to us in D1 and D2 was a result of his upbringing as Uldren in Reef Awoken society, his journey in the Black Garden, and manipulation by Riven. The innocent guardian we see today shows what Uldren could have been if he didn’t have the life he did before he died.
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I got mixed feelings. Uldren was a prick, he hated guardians, he screwed with them, tried to get them killed, etc. Hell, he tried to have that gate lord kill us on the first day of D1. That was long before he was under some mind control. Then he kills cayde. Shooting him in the face was something I wanted to do since day 1 D1, and if I could have done it every day I would start each destiny session by shooting him in the face before even hitting the tower. With that said, if he is indeed a different person, and it seems he is, I really don't like seeing him locked up in spider's sh*thole being used as a slave for that 4 eye jabba the hut, especially if he is a light bearer. Then again, maybe the traveler got a sense of humor and that's the fate he deserved for killing cayde and what he was before that. Spider said his ghost was boobytrapped, maybe we'll figure out a way of getting him out of there.
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Why would he eve give a fck about what people he just met think about him?
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He's been quiet so far. He's not bad. We know he likes meat (Pulled Pork, or Glint), so I have something in common with him. Meat alone is a reason to forgive. Sort of.
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we need to bring him to the tower and make him our waifu
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2 RepliesWell I hate him too especially after he gave me a Cayde-6 bond
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at the END OF THIS SEASON... we purchase him ... become his PIMP and he walks the streets working for the "LIGHT".... and if he doesn't "produce".. we keep our PIMP HAND STRONG.........
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He will turn on us in the end. Just wait and see.
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Well yeah, he's a different person
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We shouldn't forgive uldren sov. But crow is a completely different person in the same body. He hasn't done anything against us so there is nothing to forgive.
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he'll need to prove himself but hes grown on me
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What's there to forgive and forget? Uldren did those things, not Crow, so there's nothing to hold over his head. Both characters merely share the same face now; their personalities and attitudes are significantly different and most of the people who aren't overly attached to Cayde have already realized that.
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4 RepliesPay attention to the com dialogue at the end of Wrathborn Hunts. Crow is getting fed up with Spider and something is gonna go down to where he splits from Spider, he's outed for being Uldren Sov and is taken into the Vangaurd's fold and forgiven, OR...he gets his old memories back, goes batshit crazy and becomes the Super Villian he was meant to be... I personally am rooting for batshit crazy.
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Edge lord scene king forgot he did a no-no
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Forgive and forget. I'd dare-say that most Guardians lived dodgy lives of debauchery and varying levels of malevolence in prior incarnations. Besides, Crow is the single best character in the game now, hands down. It's not even close. Especially compared to Shaw's dipstick/poorly rendered newb speak. Crow's dialogue is also way more immersive & thoughtful than Zavala's constant whinging & moaning over the obvious. Add to that the voice actor for the Crow/Uldren is light years better than any of the others, with a possible exception being Nathan Fillion. The Crow is like some sort of trippy Vampire Lestat off in the far reaches, finding his inner Dalai Lama. The only thing the Stranger/Elizabeth has going for her beyond some cool lore story-time is that she sounds exactly like the voice actor for that Nightingale Karliah in Skyrim, so I get those retro feelz whenever I hear her talk. But lately she's not saying much of anything. #justsaying
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[quote]Should we forgive and forget for the Crow’s Sake?[/quote] Forgive, yes. Forget, no. Eventually he'll learn of what he did in his past life, it's inevitable. He'll learn his best friend guardian is the one who killed him... but he might thank us because if not for that, he himself wouldn't be a lightbearer. Crow's a good guy, ya hate to love him.
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Edited by Stuka Ju87D: 12/22/2020 2:00:12 PMWe as Guardians and light bearers dont remember who we were, so it stands to reason the same goes for Crow. I would venture that many Guardians had questionable ways in their former lives. Some of us may not like who we were. I shot Uldren. I dont know Crow.
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We should. Uldren’s revival shows that there is a good likelihood that plenty of Guardians weren’t saints either. We just don’t know it. At least he understands his other life was bad enough to earn it and so far isn’t holding a grudge. Although...some of his deaths are awfully brutal. Being left to die from internal damage is unusually cruel. We don’t do that to anything else.
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7 RepliesHere's the thing I wonder, how many guardians do you think Uldren killed directly/indirectly? I highly doubt Cayde was the first
