[quote]Destiny... Where you can be top 1% in ELO with a 1.15 KD in a playlist. Doesn't that sound a little off to you? Thanks for proving the lack of logic behind sbmm.[/quote] It's interesting that you're 1) ignoring that it's for Season 8. DTR ELO reset every season. 2) you're ignoring that kd stats are for D2 since launch, not specifically season 8. 3) I don't kd farm, I play objectives and to win. 4) I'm using a BOW for everything and still topping leaderboards in games regularly. [quote]I'm glad you're having a better experience in PvP, but I'm disappointed you turned your post into yet another rant about "top 1%" players... I put that in quotes because anyone on here with common sense knows you all like to classify any above average player against sbmm as the top 1% as to discredit them as being a vocal minority. The actual top 1% are normally the least vocal about sbmm because they're normally running scrims or gatekeeping in comp. I've never met a PvP player that likes sbmm. I've met a few that are indifferent to it, but for every one of them there's 15 - 20 that despise it, and for good reason.[/quote] It's also about the top 1% because the top PvP content creators have been on Twitter attacking the Crucible for the last 3 weeks non-stop. It's okay when it's the top players trashing a game regular players are enjoying but heaven forbid anyone have an issue with it. Also your "never met a PvP player who likes sbmm" is pretty much invalidated by the fact that a straight cbmm playlist exists still and the majority of the player base avoid it like the plague and instead choose the skill based playlists. [quote]It's interesting that you blame cbmm for your failures, yet you had around the same kd until Seasons 6 - 7. Ever thought using double bow was a bad idea? Now, you're still running a terrible PvP loadout, but are pushed to a positive kd because of sbmm. You also could have easily gone into literally ANY OTHER PLAYLIST besides QP in Seasons 6 - 7 when you were struggling, but for some reason decided to remain in the ONLY cbmm playlist, get your ass kicked, and then complain and ruin that playlist for better players.[/quote] Ever thought that you can still succeed and win without having to kd farm vs nobodies? Sure with cbmm you can use your Luna's/DRB/Wardcliff and farm kills and kd, and certainly I'm putting myself at a disadvantage in CQC scenarios, but I still win more than my fair share and don't need recluse, OEM or anything else the "top" players cry about "skill gap" over removed or nerfed. If they kill me, good for them, it's on me to win the next engagement. [quote]I chuckle at the fact you claim the parameters aren't strict because you didn't face an overwhelming amount of good players and lag every match. Again, your stats are still very average. Your ELO is high because you play a lot and it's a team game mode. I guarantee you that in my lobbies you would not maintain a positive kd... And I'm far from the top 1%, as most people are that push back against sbmm.[/quote] Pull up TrueVanguard's games and look at how few quality opponents he still faces. You can go back to last year's IB sbmm games for even more fun findings. Most of his opponents are still much lower skill. [quote]Using the 1.1 M pvp playerbase to support sbmm is disingenous because you know the game is free to play now and the PvE playerbase has doubled as well. The ratio of PvP players to PvE players is higher though now. [/quote] It doesn't matter where the players come from. More are playing this Crucible, that's all that matters. [quote]The people against sbmm haven't attacked anyone.[/quote] Are you kidding? I guess you haven't read the rest of this thread including the dude I blocked on Twitter months ago who now stalks/harasses me here and has posted dozens of personal attacks all throughout the thread. Do you want to see my dms with messages from anti-sbmm crowd telling me to kill myself. I posted about the game and didn't name any top players. Every post I make on here it's the same people for the last 4 years throwing shit at me. Hell, you're going after me personally in your response here, but yeah, the anti-sbmm crowd are saints. [quote]I always read threads about it when I see them, and more often that not the people against cbmm are the first ones to start attacking people with insults, saying "you just wanna pub stomp", "you're scared of playing other good players", and all that nonsense. I've personally seen [i]you [/i]do it. You even accused me and several others of having bad connections because your anecdotal experience with sbmm didn't bring you any lag. So if you're going to make a holier than though post accusing a group of people of attacking people on your side of an argument, you should display that behavior yourself. Until then, you're just being a hypocrite.[/quote] And you end with more personal attacks. Who would have imagined?

[quote]It's interesting that you're 1) ignoring that it's for Season 8. DTR ELO reset every season. 2) you're ignoring that kd stats are for D2 since launch, not specifically season 8. 3) I don't kd farm, I play objectives and to win. 4) I'm using a BOW for everything and still topping leaderboards in games regularly.[/quote] Nope. You have a 1.15 KD in control for Season 8. You have a 1.06 liftetime 6v6 KD. Doesn't matter if you're playing the objective or not, you should be a lot better than you are to have that high of an ELO. [quote]It's also about the top 1% because the top PvP content creators have been on Twitter attacking the Crucible for the last 3 weeks non-stop. It's okay when it's the top players trashing a game regular players are enjoying but heaven forbid anyone have an issue with it. Also your "never met a PvP player who likes sbmm" is pretty much invalidated by the fact that a straight cbmm playlist exists still and the majority of the player base avoid it like the plague and instead choose the skill based playlists.[/quote] Most of the top 1% aren't big content creators. That being said, you're correct that many of those that are have been calling out sbmm, but I agree with them. Going into a Control game once a week doesn't make you a PvP player. Not referring to you, just using the anaology. I guess I should've specified "GOOD PvP players" instead of just "PvP players" because when I say "PvP players" I'm referring to those who play PvP more than PvE and are usually above average in skill. [quote]Ever thought that you can still succeed and win without having to kd farm vs nobodies? Sure with cbmm you can use your Luna's/DRB/Wardcliff and farm kills and kd, and certainly I'm putting myself at a disadvantage in CQC scenarios, but I still win more than my fair share and don't need recluse, OEM or anything else the "top" players cry about "skill gap" over removed or nerfed. If they kill me, good for them, it's on me to win the next engagement.[/quote] You're deflecting from the point of the comment I made. There is obviously nothing wrong with using a double bow and geomags in PvP. However, it's objectively a terrible loadout. Running two of the same weapon offers you no benefit whatsoever and limits your engagement options, and geomags literally offer nothing for PvP. The point of my comment is that you were doing fine for the first two seasons after QP was made connection-based. Seasons 4 and 5 you had a 1.01 and 1.02 KD in Control. Then in Seasons 6 and 7, when you started screwing around with your loadout, your Control KD dropped to 0.66 and 0.76. That's an enormous drop. Now you're [i]still [/i] using terrible loadouts but your KD is higher than it was before you started using terrible loadouts. That exposes how ridiculous sbmm is. It's not just there to give bad players breathing room. It's a crutch. [quote]Pull up TrueVanguard's games and look at how few quality opponents he still faces. You can go back to last year's IB sbmm games for even more fun findings. Most of his opponents are still much lower skill.[/quote] TV literally made a video 2 weeks ago about how sbmm is the biggest problem with Crucible lmao. He specifically mentions that his 6v6 games are much sweatier than ever before. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpN08fW6LKw [quote]It doesn't matter where the players come from. More are playing this Crucible, that's all that matters[/quote] Ok? Again you're deflecting. I'm happy there are more players in Crucible and never said anything to the contrary. The way you presented those numbers was disingenuous. [quote]Are you kidding? I guess you haven't read the rest of this thread including the dude I blocked on Twitter months ago who now stalks/harasses me here and has posted dozens of personal attacks all throughout the thread. Do you want to see my dms with messages from anti-sbmm crowd telling me to kill myself. I posted about the game and didn't name any top players. Every post I make on here it's the same people for the last 4 years throwing shit at me. Hell, you're going after me personally in your response here, but yeah, the anti-sbmm crowd are saints. And you end with more personal attacks. Who would have imagined? [/quote] If you provide proof of someone harassing you then any respectable person will denounce it, regardless of whether they agree with you or not. Even still, a few individuals don't represent an entire group of people. I recall someone named Lost Sols going on a profanity-filled rant on a post about the Gay Pride emblem and saying they hope everyone that's against it gets permanently banned from Destiny. It was legitimately borderline psychotic behavior, even for the Internet. But I won't hold others on that side of the argument accountable for one crazy person's behavior. I know there are good people, bad people, trolls, and crazy people on both sides just like anywhere in life. I didn't attack you. I stated my issues with your hypocrisy. Didn't call you any names, tell you you're a bad player, or anything. Said you're an average player, have been vaulted to an extremely high ELO by the crutch that is SBMM, and you're a hypocrite because you have a reputation of being aggressive and unhinged online. Which I just provided more evidence of. Those aren't attacks. That's being honest. People can't truly have a discussion about something they disagree on if everyone tip-toes around the facts. If you can't handle that, you shouldn't be here.

Lmao he probably muted you like everyone else he dislikes 🤣. Nice points btw

[quote]Lmao he probably muted you like everyone else he dislikes 🤣. Nice points btw[/quote] Lmao I forgot he does do that. You should've seen that thread about the Gay Pride pin. People were just saying that they'd rather Bungie not get involved in politics and he just went UNHINGED... Accused everyone of being bigots and homophobes and saying he hopes they're all permanently banned. It was a sight to behold lol. Sad that the world is in a state where radicalism and suppression of thought is a common viewpoint.

Top 1% in control on his K/D demographic maybe? I dunno if the trackers pick up that kind of finite detail personally.

I don’t think so. His ELO in seasons 4-5 was much worse despite his kd being very similar.

I just wasn’t sure how the SBMM might be used. Like player A has a 1.0 K/D and he is a top 1% in control, but is he really a top 1% of control or is he the top 1% of his 1.0 K/D demographic in the control playlist?

He’s top 1% in Elo. Elo takes into account wins and losses, as well as individual performance. So he is winning a lot despite being very average.

What loadout do you run? I invite you to look at my games and how many final results I'm at the top of using a bow. It's funny that all the top PvP content creators railed against meta loadouts, recluse, OEM, etc and all they talk about is skill gap and I'm literally using the highest skill to be effective with setup in the game and still succeeding and you want to go kd shaming. It's a joke. No kidding I'm going to die more, I'm not trying to farm my opponents, I'm doing exactly what the top players ask, I'm running the most non-meta setup in the game and I'm giving my opponents a fair chance because if I ran bow+fusion, it would be stupid and then all anyone would say is "iTs oNLy cUz U cRuTcH fUsIoNs!" Go run my Class/Build and see how well you do. I like Cammy, but according to him it's impossible to play against the top weapons in the game right now without using them yourself. I am and I'm having no issues. But somehow it's my kd isn't 2.0 or the ultra tight sbmm isn't working just for me and everyone I play is a bad player or whatever excuse you want to pull. All I know is I'm pulling the same ELO as you this season playing solo with a bow 😉 Edit: I almost forgot "you can't play aGgResSiVe unless you're also running meta builds" https://youtu.be/q6zHoE4KZ1k

[quote]What loadout do you run? I invite you to look at my games and how many final results I'm at the top of using a bow. It's funny that all the top PvP content creators railed against meta loadouts, recluse, OEM, etc and all they talk about is skill gap and I'm literally using the highest skill to be effective with setup in the game and still succeeding and you want to go kd shaming.[/quote] This season I've messed around with Chattering Bone, Outbreak, Wishender, Crimson, Horror's Least, Recluse as primaries. My main special weapons are Mindbender's, DRB, Beloved, and Revoker. If I'm using an exotic heavy it's almost always Deathbringer, if I'm using a legendary it's either Sleepless or Hammerhead. Haven't been able to experiment as much as I'd like to this season due to sbmm. How is a bow the highest-skilled loadout lmao? Bows are incredibly easy to use. They're banned from sweats and tournaments because of how little of a skill gap they have. Using double bows is terrible because you have no short-range options, but the more passive you play, the less of an issue that is. Not once have I kd shamed you. I stated your KD wasn't nearly high enough for your ELO to make sense if it weren't for sbmm. [quote]Go run my Class/Build and see how well you do. I like Cammy, but according to him it's impossible to play against the top weapons in the game right now without using them yourself. I am and I'm having no issues.[/quote] Oh my God lol... Your lobbies are easier. I don't understand why it's so difficult for you to understand this. Even still, a 1.15 KD isn't exactly lighting it up. For me, that would be terrible. For Cammy, that's insanely low. [quote]But somehow it's my kd isn't 2.0 or the ultra tight sbmm isn't working just for me and everyone I play is a bad player or whatever excuse you want to pull.[/quote] Dude... It's common sense. The further your KD is from 1.0, the less players are in your skill bracket. My games are sweatier than yours and Cammy's are sweatier than mine. It's not rocket science.

Just let it be. This guy will never understand. He thinks that he,s the Robin Hood of this community when 99.9 % of the community thinks that he,s an embarrassing clown

I almost wonder if some of it also has to do with the lower Xbox numbers on his side as well... Wow there are so many different variables that could be brought up on this topic, lol. Damn analytical part of me wants to break it down piece by piece, lol. Ehh probably a waste of time. Thanks for taking the time to explain that it’s an ELO thing. Though the thing that gets me is, ELO goes up depending on the rank of players you beat, right? So if you beat higher ELO players, you get more rank bumps, and lesser if it’s lower or on par with you..... I dunno, maybe I’m not entirely sure how this damn ELO thing works entirely.

Yes, you steal ELO from higher ELO players. Xbox is actually known as being sweatier than PS4 due to lower population aka less casual players. I think you're overhthinking it lol. No matter how you try to explain it, a 1.15 KD and a diamond ELO are an egregious mismatch.

Bungie have an in-house elo type thing, it readjusts after every game, that's why the break lobbies up nonstop. It's just started happening in cod too, modern warfare now breaks up lobbies after every game, really strong sbmm. If he's playing control, he's judged on his flag caps, stuff like that. I remember in black ops 2 on wiiu, small community and we used to talk to a treyarch Dev online who played with us for feedback, I played in a team of 6 guys pretty much nonstop, they where mostly kill streak monsters and I'd cap flags, I'd never get near their kill totals but was up with them on the leaderboards because I was objective AF, and won a lot. I'd guess he's getting lucky regarding winning a lot of games, and he's probably taking their home flag a lot n flipping spawns. 1.15 isn't bad if you're super objective, and I guess top 1% is what that means. It doesn't show skill, or nothing to brag about, it shows he has common sense and knows when to push objectives. I was top 0.01% in D1 on time played, but it meant absolutely nothing. This is similar.

Actually what proves his point is that given a choice the overwhelming majority of players have chosen sbmm playlists. That’s why all the super stars are crying. No one will willingly play their shit show cbmm playlist so that they have less skilled players to farm. You may not like sbmm but clearly most other people do.