The biggest pass Digital Extremes gets for all the flaws and problems Warframe has, is that the game is technically still in beta. It's a perma-beta. I'd be willing to bet they're taking everything they're learning and compiling a roadmap for how they're going to build Warframe's sequel. Warframe is the testbed for their different ideas. Could it stand to be streamlined? Yes. Yes it could. And we've even talked about that over on their forums, talked about having better tutorials, easing players into new content and mechanics rather than just throwing them in head-first in a 'sink or swim'-like scenario. And in some ways they Have streamlined. The old mod system was a pain to work with, in how you leveled up mods and had to fuse multiples together to get a higher-ranked mod... the new system is a heluva lot better. And while it still has issues, the recent Focus rework for Plains has been generally applauded as a better system than the old version: now we just need easier ways to farm focus points and a higher daily focus cap. DE made the mistake of building Warframe for the 'current players'. That is, whoever is playing "right now" is who they build the game for. If you come late to the party, well, you're gonna have a hard time. Further, I dont think they quite knew what they wanted the game to be as they made it, which is apparent with the significant changes and overhauls to many of the core systems over the years. I remember when wall-running was a thing. You cant do that anymore: they took it out.You also see it in the early story missions with Vor: "Who am I, what's up with the universe, why am I fighting everyone (aside from the fact they're shooting at me), etc. These are questions that can't be reworked into the early game because DE themselves didn't know until more recently. These are things that have to be in the game from the start, but to do that now would require such extensive overhaul that it might as well be a new game. And as I said in my long post above, I don't mind the wait times. Like you said, there's always something to do so I just go and do other things while stuff is building. Destiny simply suffers from bad management. The studio heads apparently wanted to take the game in a different direction from what D1 had been. D1 was a 'shared world shooter,' basically what we thought was going to be the first MMO-FPS. It's story was lackluster but it's underlying mechanics were solid. All they really needed to do was fix a few outstanding mechanical issues, separate the PVP and PVE and tune them as each requires, and we'd have a great foundation for D2. Instead, the studio decided they wanted an arena-shooter game like Overwatch. But, they also wanted to keep the PVE mode, likely because axing it entirely would cut off too much of their playerbase. And with their dogmatic insistence on a unified sandbox combined with that PVP-first attitude, we got this watered-down, everything is weak version of Destiny. I have 2 characters through the story right now; havent started my third. Neither are max power. I just dont have any real desire or motivation to play, even though I;ve not finished all the adventures and world quests. I want to to Arecibo and learn about the warminds, but that means I have to actually PLAY Destiny 2, and that keeps me from doing it. It's sad that I love the world and the lore but the game itself puts me off it. Meanwhile, Warframe's got a new content drop and I feel like Im wasting my time not playing it. And yes, you feel powerful in warframe, and yes some enemies have bullcrap abilities like nullifiers and energy-sucking bubbles. I cant really comment on the Operator as I've not finished War Within yet, but I hear the Plains update has made them better and more viable. In fact, some content is actually designed to be done by the Operator, not the frame. I'm kind of eager to get there and try it.

[quote]Warframe needs to be streamlined. It throws quite a bit of content at you without too much introduction and very vague objectives at times. The mission types get a bit repetitive and the boss encounters aren't too memorable. You tend to do a lot of waiting for gear unless you spend money. They could do with a better quest/mission system while also introducing parts of the game better, but I enjoy that they don't do much hand holding. They could definitely decrease the time you spend waiting on gear in the foundry. The wait times are pretty much the worst part of the game. Destiny falls short in that the game really just seems to miss the ball on superhuman soldiers utilizing a cosmic force that can defy the laws f our universe; you're made to feel so weak and feeble that it's boring. You come by gear easily, but it's based far too much on chance, and the gear tends to feel lackluster and uninspiring. There just isn't enough to do, and what content is there just doesn't feel engaging enough to warrant repeating after a month or so. With Warframe, I'm always working towards something. Warframe just makes you feel powerful, but it does have bullshit enemies and status effects at times. The Operator isn't built for combat well at all, but you do get to choose what they say during the War Within.[/quote] Yep I agree on every point that’s one of the things I tried to make clear in my post but felt I was a little bit lacking in.

Your post is still spot on. I was just replying to it mainly. I prefer Warframe to Destiny 2, personally.