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11/13/2015 6:59:31 PM
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I think you've mistaken the word 'Cheese' for 'Strategy'. Similarly to doing Golgoroth with only one Orb, beating the Templar by cleansing your team instead of killing the Oracles, or doing a boos fight like the Saber fight while crouching in the corner to avoid Phase 3: these are all different ways to fight the bosses.
They're strategies, in comparison to a cheese. A strategy is a different approach to a fight. A cheese is purposefully belittling and ignoring multiple mechanics in a fight, like pushing Atheon and the Templar off the edge, jumping Lanterns in Crota's end, the Bridge skip in Crota's end, or trapping enemy spawns in PoE.
The no Knight strategy does not skip mechanics. It puts the timing of those mechanics so closely together that their affect cannot occur, if done CORRECTLY. When doing the No Knight strategy, if you kill an ogre too early, or don't reach your bubble fast enough, the night will get the bubble, causing it to be a failed run.
It's simply a different approach, with its own challenges, possibilities, and failures.
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[quote]eating the Templar by cleansing your team instead of killing the Oracles[/quote]Even that is a cheese but since it's an old raid, I suppose the rules don't need to be enforced. [quote]belittling and ignoring multiple mechanics in a fight[/quote]Or skipping enemies that are supposed to be killed so they don't get at your bomb. [quote]ely together that their affect cannot occur, if done CORRECTLY[/quote]So you admit that it cannot occur? That means you're bypassing the added mechanic of the heroic difficulty since they're meant to be killed.
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I bet your raid team hates you.
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Here's the thing, is throughout the fight you can mess up. They're still a factor. The Knights can still ruin your run. It isn't skipping the mechanics of the fight, it's delaying their spawn. There's a big difference.
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If it was delayed, they'd still be able to spawn and the strategy makes their spawn almost impossible.
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No, I think you've missed the point here. See, when the Runner grabs the Brand, all of the fireteam members jump up to the Blessings of Light bubble that one of the two Add control Titans placed. If this happened, then they could kill the Knights before the Runner ever even gets the brand. Assuming the Knights have 10,000 health, that's only a few shots from TOM, meaning that as the relic runner gets back to the group, these Knights could be taken out. You also need to remember that there is a good chunk of time to actually stagger oryx, meaning the Ohres can still have around a quarter of their HP left while still making it a successful run.
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Edited by DeusMortem24: 11/14/2015 12:41:46 AMIf it was delayed, they'd spawn in, the people shooting the ogres would down the Knights before ever killing the ogres, and the Knights still fail to serve their purpose. If anything, this also proves its, a Strategy. It's adaptable to a change. If you were to do something like add bumpers to Atheon's ledge, or add a kill wall to the bridge, those cheeses don't function.
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But you're avoiding a mechanic that's been implemented in the game for a reason. You're suppose to kill them but this strat doesn't allow that to happen.
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They're supposed to spawn in. Proof of this is the fact that the No Knight start works. If you wanted to, you could throw flash bang grenades at the Knights, which would blind them, and prevent them from getting the orb. This is how Oryx was 3 manned originally, on Normal. The Knights don't have to die, they're supposed to spawn in, and attempt to eat the orb before you detonate it, or kill them. No mechanic is really being bypassed here. They still spawn in, and they still attempt to eat your orb.
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This right here. Bravo.
