As a $hitty PVP player I like the CBMM. At least my hits register and there’s little “teleporting”

6vs6 and laid back modes should be cbmm since they aren't competitive Trials is not really cbmm, its win based mm, if you're on win 6 you'll match others at win 6. It's a tournament style knockout mode. Survival and elim are competitive and as such should either have rbmm (rank based as it was in forsaken) or sbmm. You now have a balanced pvp where players can pick and choose the type of mm they want...oh wait we had that the past few years and the bottom tier complained nonstop to get the casual mode have competitive mm so now pvp is dying again

You're arguing from the viewpoint of a top player, whereas most people are average players. SBMM for average and below average players usually results in easier games, whereas for top players, SBMM results in more difficult games Control is supposed to be enjoyable to everyone, and it uses SBMM as a means of achieving that. This comes at the cost of high-skilled players not enjoying it as much, but SBMM does a better job of meeting its core purpose than CBMM did Trials uses CBMM, because it's purpose is to reward skill. If Bungie ever changed to SBMM in Trials, rewards would have to be scaled for the core purpose of the mode to remain fulfilled. Regardless of how it is achieved, a high skill player should always recieve better rewards than a low skill player in Trials.

CBMM is the thing that has no place in a PvP game. Because a players connection shouldnt have an effect on a pvp game. You're missing the simple and obvious solution. Dedicated servers. This is not a new invention, and has been a staple of pvp games for a decade now, for a reason. With dedicated servers, anything to do with connection would be irrelevant, and the only thing making a mode competetive would be sbmm/not sbmm. I don't know why Bungie is so intent on sticking to an outdated, obsolete, method of connecting players.

WOO WALL OF TEXT TIME :D It's my opinion that SBMM should be globally applied in any PvP game, especially in Destiny 2's case where the difference of skill between top and bottom is so dramatically different. Specifically in Destiny 2, there's the major issue of Peer to Peer connection determining the player to player interactions. Your connection to one opponent might be fine, but 3 others could be lagged out and killing you around corners, or you could get kills on shots that had no right making contact. Without a dedicated server for everyone to ping off of, it tosses hitreg to the wind. CBMM is just a bandaid patch to prioritize people closer to each other regardless of skill in order to also create matches faster. It has no skill consideration, so even if lobby balance was active after the lobby was created, the skill variance can be so drastic that there's no chance in hell that any semblance of balance can be created except by pure luck during that first player grab. SBMM is (supposed) to be an algorithm that finds players based on a determined skill level and group them together where a lobby balance can further sort out each player to create the most fair game that it can. Ideally, as an algorithm, it can be adjustable (And Loose SBMM has been adjusted once already, so that's one checkbox marked) as required. For casual vs competitive, SBMM should remain. I don't care what playlist it is. The difference however, is how loose SBMM should be. Mayhem and Team Scorched for example should be SUPER slack on SBMM, those types of games do not matter on outcome as long as it's fun. But not pure CBMM either because that skill gap IS so wide that absolutely stomping a team is boring while being curbstomped in the "Fun" modes is not fun at all and disheartening regardless of how "easy" it is to get kills. Control, Clash, and Rumble should be a more firm SBMM. You want enough room to allow people of wider skills to fight and learn off each other without becoming a stomp-fest due to people too high or too low screwing up the balance of a match. Then there's Survival and Trials... again, ideally, you'd want the best of the best here. You want CBMM to ensure that your hits count, and there's nothing left to chance or latency. But you also should want SBMM here too because otherwise it's not really a competition if you're pairing high-skill with less skilled or Fireteams vs Randoms. If there was any sort of mode to require Dedicated Servers, it's these ones. Which means under CBMM there's no competition since anyone can hop in and sandbag whoever they play with or match against people far out of their range in either direction. And under SBMM now you're leaving latency behind which makes fairer fights statistically until a latency spike murders your team. And that's without considering the combat medals made by Bungie to award going on long kill streaks + Flawless Lighthouse which just do not have a place in SBMM. Honestly the entirety of Crucible needs a reset and rework to focus on what Bungie actually wants it to be.

It is because players think the “C” in CBMM means “Casual” when it means “Card or Connection”. The only players who think CBMM is better are the ones who exploited the system in a supposedly “casual” playlist ie Control. There is no such thing as competitiveness in this game without SBMM. Trials not having SBMM is a clear indicator of this. Most players who want casual play either want 5-0 matches or want to use whatever they desire to play in a casual looter shooter. SBMM needs to be the normal in every playlists and Bungie needs to use whatever they did for connection within CBMM to make the connection better within SBMM due to lack of dedicated servers. Switching between SBMM and CBMM is killing the population of players alongside lack of content and incentive to play. There is no such thing as a casual environment for CBMM because someone or some players have to suffer due to poor lobby balancing and matchmaking. If Bungie truthfully wanted to let CBMM be the system design for matchmaking, they should have worked more on fixing lobby balancing when the connection between players were the highest and most efficient. Address lobby balancing for CBMM by FORCING teams and groups against each other. Address connection for SBMM while FORCING teams and groups against each other. It should be rare that a group of solos are facing a stack of 4-6 players. If you are going to make a stack of 4-6 players face solos than those solos need to be 4-6 great to good individual solo players.

Like many others you are misusing terms for wholly different parts of your argument. Your logic is inconsistent. SBMM matches guardians of similar skill. That’s it. One guardians version of casual is not another’s. All crucible is competitive as in you are playing a game against another team with the same objectives and time restraints. The difference is that top tier players no longer get to run riot on the school playground. Now they are playing their skill set. To them, that’s not “casual”. The vast majority in Control and say Elimination are novice players. They don’t spend every waking moment playing Destiny. They are now playing competitive games with like skilled players. They are not getting hammered or worse not even getting practice to take down an opposing guardian because Uber player is running riot. Now that one player is like “this is casual” and the rest are like “this is not casual but a pub stomp.” You understand? I am so glad I cleared that up for you. And nice try CBMM player on another poor argument.

I’ve tried explaining this but you’re obviously better with words than me.

Comp should be sbmm (ranked, at least show people in which bracket they are, like other games do). Trials can't work like that because you need to win 7 games in a row. It would be nearly impossible for everyone to go flawless, that's why. Comp has 0 rewards, control has the same issue. That's the point for players in high bracket to play in sbmm? Queue is longer, connection is worse, rewards are the same. Bungie either should revamp comp or give something for better players, like more rewards, maybe even unique ones, even cosmetics would be fine