[b]Introduction[/b]
Auto rifles are in a bad place right now and have been for a while. They are ineffective in both PvE & PvP when compared to other primary weapons. I think this is an important thing to distinguish. Auto rifles can be used effectively but are not as effective as the other primaries in the same scenarios. They do not do enough damage and have poor range without heavy investment.
I am going to state objective facts here. Auto rifles need to be effective in mid range engagements and deal more damage in close range engagements. Because they aren't smgs. Primary weapons should not only be effective in one range zone.
Auto rifles are outclassed by every other weapon type. They just don’t do enough damage to justify using them. This is a serious issue because the entire weapon class isn’t even on the same level as the other primary types. That’s an entire weapon class that is borderline useless. Auto rifles are the only weapons that are bad even when playing on the few well-designed maps.
Each primary type has clear advantages. Scout rifles do good damage at long range. Pulse rifles are reliable and versatile. Hand cannons allow you to be very mobile. Auto rifles currently have no advantages over other primaries. They are supposed to be really good at close ranges but are outclassed by shotguns, fusion rifles, and the last word in their intended range. Yes, they are easier to use in close range than other primaries. But they don't do enough damage to be better in that range.
[b]What's bad about autos[/b]
Each auto rifle archetype falls short of doing enough damage in their optimum range. You’re probably asking why I’m complaining about the damage of auto rifles. Let me explain myself. There are a number of things working against auto rifles in any given engagement.
Let me start with a PvP issue, sight lines: is the target going to remain in my sight line long enough for me to get the kill? Why don’t you just get closer so sight line isn’t an issue you might be asking now. Well, that is because if I get too close I will either be killed by a special weapon, get hit by a primary/melee combo due to the high damage other primaries do with fewer bullets, or I can also be hit by a grenade easily in that range. If auto rifles did more damage those situations would happen less often.
Now a PvE issue. This is a simple one. Auto rifles do not do enough damage to justify being so close to enemies nor are they effective enough at longer ranges to avoid getting in close.
Then there is time to kill. This also falls into the category of not doing enough damage so I’ll keep this short. You have to get headshots to outgun other primaries in PvP. This is difficult due to the number of bullets that must hit in order to kill the target. Not to mention the ridiculous amount of flinch caused by the other primary types. Even if you are able to control the recoil you are still going to have a hard time keeping your reticule on the target. And with the low TTK to bullet/trigger pull ratio of other primary weapons vs the high amount of bullets it takes to kill an enemy player with auto rifles you’re just at a huge disadvantage no matter what situation you are in.
[b]How to fix them[/b]
So what do you do about this Bungie? Simple, increase the base damage of auto rifles so that they kill faster at close range regardless of whether or not you are hitting head shots. Then increase the base range of auto rifles and adjust the damage falloff curve.
Let’s say with a range scale of 1-10, currently; scout rifles work well between 5 & 10, pulse rifles between 3 & 7, hand cannons between 1 & 6, and auto rifles between 1 & 7 (with heavy range investment). We want to keep this ratio. So with that in mind, I’m going to add another scale, 1-10 but this time it is damage.
Autos have a ratio of 3d - 1r & 1d - 7r where (d) is damage & (r) is range.
Change this to 5d - 1r & 3d -7r.
Considering pulse rifles have 5d - 3r & 5d - 7r.
Essentially, auto rifles do at their optimum range what damage they should be doing at their maximum range. Auto rifles current damage should be pushed out to the end of their range stat. Then they should do more damage in their optimum range. This should bring them more in line with other primaries and actually make them effective in their intended range. Consider this more of an outline to base the actual numbers on. I’m going to leave the science to the actual weapon balance designers.
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Try Fabian. Fabian is great now.
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2 отв.Damage Body Head High fire rate 13 16 Mid fire rate 18 22 Low fire rate 22 28 Focused fire 31 39 With this, all autos can kill in .8s, but as you go down in fire rate, less and less armor is required to survive an additional shot. This means that while all autos can have the same TTK, the higher fire rate ones become a bit more reliable in terms of both DPS and TTK against high armored targets. This is necessary because higher fire rate autos have less range and are harder to control when compared to their slower fire rate relatives .
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I agree they are pretty weak.
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2 отв.I'm having no trouble. My answering cord melts pretty much everything
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my very best weapon is shadow price with rifled barrel, battle runner and counterbalance. it is a beast!
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Изменено (RAIST5150): 10/15/2016 1:45:53 PMSlight bump to crit damage is all they need. As mentioned in posts further down. Autos penalize you if you can't stay on target. They should give a slight reward for those that do. 1.25 to 1.50 for crit bonus should suffice.
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6 отв.Изменено (SoAnnoying): 10/11/2016 5:37:04 AM"Auto Rifles are underpowered right now, they don't do enough damage in cqc engagements" All of the weapoms in Destiny have been tweaked and nerfed so much, none of it make sense any more....
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All the games primary weapons are underpowered. NONE of them do enough damage to allow you to stand your ground and fight off someone who is rushing you to either shotgun you or use a cqc-oriented class ability/super on you.
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bungie should Nerf pulse rifle....
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1 ответFast pulse rifles shoot as fast as max fire rate auto rifle damage except pulse rifle does more damage and better range
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28 отв.Y play ARs when even side arms and fusion can get the job done better at medium range? Hell shotguns live at medium to close range leaving ARs pretty much useless. Doctrine was the last hope for ARs but they nerfed it instead of buffing other primaries. Bungie too scare to bring back the AR into meta like in vanilla destiny which was almost 3 yrs ago!
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Изменено (Ark): 10/13/2016 4:17:08 AMI always thought a nice addition would be to make ARs and Sidearms very strong while hip firing. I don't know exactly what changes to do, but I think making the automatic weapons more mobile might be a way to buff those weapon types without the buffing damage.
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Depends on the range of the engagement , they are very good close range
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7 отв.The auto rifles are fine. Any more auto rifle buffs and it will feel like cod. There are other weapons you can use. Besides buffs to an already balance weapon is not required.
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4 отв.Autos are for close to medium range. Read patch notes.
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Nonsense. They work just fine. 😊
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Изменено (GM KnightRaven): 10/12/2016 2:32:01 PMI used the Zhalo all through IB and trust me it did just fine. In fact there were very few games where I wasn't the top scorer overall when I used it. I did better on my Hunter than my Titan or Warlock but that wasn't because of the Zhalo, it is cause my Hunter is much faster and bladedancer is amazing. But then again maybe the Zhalo is an exception to the rule. I do agree that in PvE autos are horrible though. I will stick with my scout rifle there.
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No, autorifles are better than ever. Pukse rifles need to be nerfed at close range is the problem
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22 отв.Auto rifles in a bad place? Have you played pvp? I been killed by auto rifles more than anything else, in fact high fire rate auto rifles need nerf and the slow fire rate ones need a major buff
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1 ответAutos are incredibly effective when you are in shotgun range............................
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Autos need their crit multiplier back. Guns in this game do X bodyshot damage, and 1.5* X headshot damage... except autos. They do 1.25*X. This means they are forever C tier, they need this multiplier back. The doctrine needs a bodyshot nerf and spinning up needs a nerf to bring them back in line after this buff. That is literally the only way to make them viable for most players in Crucible. Autos require you to be exposed to kill a player: therefore they should also kill faster than guns that don't, to make those users need to actually use cover. That isn't what happens and it never will until they do proper headshot damage.
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Monte Carlo and Vision Stone type are fine. Range and stability buff for the rest, maybe up the aim assist.
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That would make them monstrously overpowered. They'll never be balanced while one hit shotguns are a thing, sadly.
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The worst part about all of this is that if you play any other FPS (aside from Halo) the Automatic Rifle is going to b a default weapon for over 80% of new and returning players alike. It should be a forgiving, simple weapon that players can then graduate from into more challenging weapons.
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1 ответi was doing pretty good in the crucible with the assembly 2 from new monarchy. Got one with armor piercing rounds. If you have a knock back round on your auto it works awesome.
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2 отв.Dude have you used the Iron Banner Autorifle?