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10/20/2022 9:18:20 PM
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Sorry if this seems a little off-topic - I agree with what you're saying, making random team-mates compete with each other to complete stuff is just... well it's NOT a team activity then is it!
But taking in the larger picture, this just seems to be the way that Bungie does the game in general:
Players are forced to 'team' up with (and compete against - for kills/bounties etc) random people for the easiest content that could for the most part be easily solo'd, but for the hardest content unless you have a group of friends for a [b]pre-made[/b] fireteam you're up that foul smelling creek with no means of propulsion ... sure you can try to solo [i]some[/i] of the activities, but that's likely about as much fun as (seasonally appropriate metaphor incoming) bobbing for apples in the aforementioned creek, without goggles or nose-plugs!
The reason for this (I assume) is that if players were simply allowed to solo basic Strikes etc. then they would be able to farm bounties too easily, the act of pitting "team-mates" against each other in a co-opetitive manner is a means to achieve the desired balance of 'game-pacing'.
For all the hype about 'LFG' [i]finally[/i] coming to D2 in an official capacity (and after how long? Seriously!) when there is already an effective mechanism for matchmaking fireteams in-game just smacks of WTAF ... wwhhyyyy? Just allow players to play the easy stuff solo (if they want to) and extend the existing match-making to include Dungeons, Raids, GM Nightfalls and basically everything else that currently says "Don't have a clan or D2 friends? Sorry this activity is not for you!" - You built a wall that wasn't needed that just kept (solo) players out, which forced third-parties to build a path that went around the wall, and now you're building a door in the wall... just knock down the damned wall!
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I just played a normal strike where a player raced through, left enemies for the rest of the team to kill, and died at the boss (naturally). It reminds me of a driver on the road, racing past you to be first at the....red robot. Back to the strike: It became a rushed sequence, trying to keep up with this neanderthal, no time to pick up power ammo, no time for your super to load, so at the end it's so much frustration. And then the player just up and leaves after you revived him and helped him kill the boss. Strikes/Raids/Crucible are TEAM based activities in Destiny 2. But, because 80% of the universal video gamers average an age below 20, you deal with behavior that's just....well, childish. Maybe you should treat them like children. If the "look-at-me-I'm-the-fastest" player don't wait for the team beyond a point/don't revive etc., a kick option the rest of the team can use AT THE END, becomes active. Meaning: If the rusher built up sufficient penalties during the strike, anyone of the remaining team members can kick him. He would earn no pinnacles/loot. The strike/raid/whatever would not have counted. For anything. Children do catch on, you know. Eventually. To play a video game should be a fun experience for EVERYBODY. So I agree that there should be options for players to play solo. Who says video gaming can't be educational? Teach 'em manners I say!
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You said you played a regular strike. Those are meant to be rushed. It's not like they are supposed to be a challenge, hence the lackluster rewards at the end. So it's best to skip the enemies and rush towards the boss as fast as possible to have a better time-reward ratio. And that guy left because he wanted fast runs and you wanted to take it slow. So you had different interests, that is all. No need to call players that play faster than you neanderthals.
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Marcipan018088により編集済み: 10/21/2022 1:29:11 PMNo one playing a "regular" strike should be allowed to dictate how fast that strike should be done. "..and that guy left because he wanted fast runs...". Regular strikes/Nightfalls are TEAM activities Dokkaebi. Hence the argument that these road runners should therefore do their SOLO runs and not join team runs as if it's their very own solo rushed job. Strikes "...are meant to be rushed..."?? Where does it say so? What about new players? If a newbie plays strikes for the first time, there's not even time to take a look at the scenery (which some developer slaved over at some point), there's no learning of how the mechanics work of that particular strike, because that one TEAM player decided all by himself he wants a better "...time-reward ratio...". Sounds a bit selfish doesn't it? And, Dokkaebi, "that guy" left AFTER we revived him and he received his loot. NOT before. Clear? Before you criticize my take on things, read the WHOLE thread here to see what options we want Bungie to implement so those neander....er, highly evolved players can rush through the game on their own. Please don't reply to this unless you actually have some more helpful tips on how to improve the game for everyone.
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xbroggiexにより編集済み: 10/21/2022 3:20:44 AM[quote]and extend the existing match-making to include Dungeons, Raids, GM Nightfalls and basically everything else that currently says "Don't have a clan or D2 friends? Sorry this activity is not for you!"[/quote] Because they aren't designed for non-premade fireteams? Well Dungeons aren't really since you are able to solo them. But no, random MM for Raids or GM's would not work... end of story. Literally the OP is complaining about the players he got matched with and you want the extend that into endgame content as well?
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I mean, I see your point ...and yeah from any sensible and pragmatic view you're correct. I'm just saying that from a technical stand point Bungie created a problem that required 3rd-parties to fix and has since taken them how many years to address directly themselves? Honestly, the mechanic by which fireteams are created isn't the issue it's people, and (forgive the double negative) there ain't no fix for that. Let me put it like this: Imagine that match-making had existed for raids from the start... would it be [i]that[/i] different to any other matchmade activity? You get some good teams and some bad, and let's face it - with the mechanics and teamwork required for raids people would soon learn that they need to communicate and co-operate or no one gets anywhere. It might even have served to educate the game's player-base in this regard, making players more aware and familiar with the concept of actual teamwork. [i](or maybe I'm being too hopeful and expecting too much from people)[/i] x'D Honestly though with certain caveats I think it could work, at least no worse than any other game feature. Some entry requirements (e.g. level gated), a warning about the time commitment and likely wipes involved (limitation of expectation), require a mic for comms (obvs) and allow players to be kicked if they don't co-operate. The rest would take care of itself. Is it ideal, no... But tell me a part of the game that is.
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[quote]Imagine that match-making had existed for raids from the start... would it be that different to any other matchmade activity?[/quote] There would be no difference because then they would design raids to be able to be completed by randomly matchmade teams and therefore would basically be no more advanced than a 6 man strike. [quote]Honestly though with certain caveats I think it could work, at least no worse than any other game feature. Some entry requirements (e.g. level gated), a warning about the time commitment and likely wipes involved (limitation of expectation), require a mic for comms (obvs) and allow players to be kicked if they don't co-operate. The rest would take care of itself. Is it ideal, no... But tell me a part of the game that is.[/quote] And this couldn't just be achieved by adding ingame LFG? Then there is the obvious questions with your proposed systems... What do you do about players leaving or being kicked mid raid/encounter? What do you do about checkpoints? Do you MM always fresh or from your checkpoint, if you MM based on the checkpoint it would mean your wait time would be even longer and Bungie would need to design a new MM system basically just for raids. Random MM really is not needed when ingame LFG will be added to the game.
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[quote]I mean, I see your point ...and yeah from any sensible and pragmatic view you're correct. I'm just saying that from a technical stand point Bungie created a problem that required 3rd-parties to fix and has since taken them how many years to address directly themselves? Honestly, the mechanic by which fireteams are created isn't the issue it's people, and (forgive the double negative) there ain't no fix for that. Let me put it like this: Imagine that match-making had existed for raids from the start... would it be [i]that[/i] different to any other matchmade activity? You get some good teams and some bad, and let's face it - with the mechanics and teamwork required for raids people would soon learn that they need to communicate and co-operate or no one gets anywhere. It might even have served to educate the game's player-base in this regard, making players more aware and familiar with the concept of actual teamwork. [i](or maybe I'm being too hopeful and expecting too much from people)[/i] x'D Honestly though with certain caveats I think it could work, at least no worse than any other game feature. Some entry requirements (e.g. level gated), a warning about the time commitment and likely wipes involved (limitation of expectation), require a mic for comms (obvs) and allow players to be kicked if they don't co-operate. The rest would take care of itself. Is it ideal, no... But tell me a part of the game that is.[/quote] It would NEVER work for raids and would be a waste of time and resources. I used to have the same complaints and then I started raiding and quickly saw why it wouldn't work. First of all, you can't really complete raids without everyone communicating. Yeah, a good team where everyone knows what they're doing could, but average players absolutely could not. Then the second problem would be quitting. As soon as the going got tough, which would happen pretty much immediately, people would start quitting. So, if you matchmake into a game are you going to only match into a fresh raid, which will 99% of the time have no chance of being completed, or will you get matched into the slot of a person who left somewhere in the middle of the raid? If they don't throw in a new player to a team that lost a player somewhere in the middle of the raid that team is screwed and I guess gets to start over and have it all happen again. They do need an in game LFG though. I absolutely agree we shouldn't need third party apps to find teams. I HATED LFG, there are so many toxic people out there. But over time I kept adding the few really cool people I met until finally we have a group that plays regularly that is large enough to organize raids so we thankfully no longer have to ever LFG.
