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#feedback

Editado por zaffy2005: 6/29/2018 7:01:45 PM
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Have a seat, Bungie, we need to talk

Let's talk Destiny 2. You know, that game more than half of your studio seems to have completely forgotten the existence of in order to lay into Destiny 3? Yea, that one. The State of Destiny 2 is decaying. We got problems, Bungie, and too many of them are being completely ignored. Let's talk Factions first. NOBODY asked for this "renown" garbage. Absolutely no one was sitting around thinking "You know what would make Faction Rallies better? A massive debuff being applied while trying to trudge through this already tedious bitch of a grind." Can you even begin to grasp WHY the first few Rallies were marked by the community flocking to any "exploit" they could find to speed up the token-gathering process? The answer is absurdly simple: return on investment. Crap rewards offer no incentive to invest time nor effort. Making it take longer with this "Renown" garbage just to get ornaments and reskinned weapons 10+ levels BELOW what we would need just to break even is NOT an improvement. Removing the vanilla items we can get from ANY legendary item source would have been an improvement. Making Rallies a source of "Powerful" gear that moves us towards the cap would have been an improvement. This "Renown" nonsense is not an improvement. A sequel is supposed to IMPROVE the franchise by BUILDING UPON the foundation created by the first installment. Instead we launched D2 for the first time to find that everything we loved about D1 was gone,and in its place was sheer disappointment. We had to wait for you to bring things back that never should have been cut in the first place. I mean something as simple as Vault space, you should damn well know by now that unless you START with giving us enough space to store five slots of everything you're going to have to add more, and we're going to be kicking down your door demanding it for day one. But there are other, more subtle features that you removed that never should have been touched. Slot-based infusion, for example. I would really like to know who needs to be thrown under the bus for this one. D1's infusion system was a workable solution (not the best, but workable) to the problem of RNG, the stingy bastard that it is, constantly flooding our inventories with garbage drops we have no use for. I, for example, have no use whatsoever for SMGs. Scout Rifles, on the other hand, I love. With D1's infusion system I could be turning all those useless SMGs into fuel for something I'll actually use. And in D1's system I never had to worry about any of my characters falling too far behind the others, as I could take the armor "cast offs" of the frontrunner to boost the straggler. Still no answer from you as to why this decision was made but it doesn't matter. It was a bad decision. And you should be ashamed, but that doesn't mean jack, so just fix your damn mistake. Now, credit where it's due: hand-picked armor mods was a good idea, you just didn't go far enough with it. D1 armor had effectively 3 mods. Give us two more slots on D2's armor and you're heading in the right direction. Individual shader slots was another good idea but Bungie, pick one: either make them consumable or have them cost glimmer to apply. Not both. Same goes for Transmat effects. And when our weapons/armor already HAVE a Legendary mod on it it that should reduce the cost of applying another Legendary mod the same way it costs less to infuse an Exotic into a Legendary than it does to use a Rare item as the infusion fuel. Here's a crucial change that needs to be made: STOP listening to the blat-ass, cry-baby try-hards who want to be "special little snowflakes." Clan Raid and Trials engrams offering clan members a SINGLE piece of gear each week was a great idea and it should be left to the sole discretion of the CLANS to decide whether a member is taking advantage of them. Those who DO run Raids/Trials get MULTIPLE pieces of gear each week. THAT is their reward for stepping up to the plate. And that applies to the level cap whiners, too. Those who have had to rely on Clan Engrams because they simply do not have the same amount of time to throw away as other players do should NOT be shafted out of reaching the level cap. The cap is NOT about prestige. It's just a gate mechanism. They want something to brag about they've got Glory Ranks and Nightfall Top Scores. They can go be sweaty over there. You had a good thing here and you killed it because some insecure jackass who gets his self-worth from a damn video game felt threatened by a 1:5 ratio. Stop listening to these self-centered little shits. They are not good for your game. I really think you should look into the Gear Forging I have dedicated a previous thread to and others on Reddit and other venues have proposed. Could solve a lot of problems in a lot of areas. It'll give us something to grind for after milestones are done, something to work on in the downtime between content drops, it'll give BACK the feeling of a personal connection to our characters and our gear that was never fully realized in D1 and completely taken away in D2, but most importantly it will give people a reason to keep playing your game, and there's not a whole lot of that going around these days. But not every problem can be solved with some magic wand solution. Your lazy, complacent, narcissistic approach to content cannot be fixed by a simple patch. And it is this problem more than any other that has people all over the internet warning others NOT to buy Destiny if they haven't bought it and encouraging current players not to waste their money on Forsaken. And that all comes back around to what I said at the start: return on investment. The sparse amount of actual content this DLC represents is not worth the $40 price tag. It isn't worth the $20 price tag you put on the previous DLC. Taken King and Rise of Iron were barely $10 expansions yet you charged nearly a full game price for them. A piece. The total cost of playing D1 from launch was over $200 for a game that after three years of expansions STILL felt barren and incomplete, and I'm saying this even after pointing to many ways in which D1 was infinitely better than D2. That should concern you, Bungie. The fact that you all seem to think you're hitting it out of the park with every update is very concerning to us. We gave you a lot of leeway with D1 because it was your "first" game in a genre that hadn't really found its feet yet. But we're seeing the exact same pattern, the exact same RELATIVE size of content, and the exact same prices in D2; "relative" being the key word there. Compared to their respective base games the expansions have added roughly the same relative amount of content. But, if you remember that you have more than just ONE year of feedback to review here you might remember that the lack of content was the principle complaint throughout the entirety of D1's existence. D2 offers significantly LESS content than D1, while demanding we pay the same price as we did for D1's content, which was significantly less than what we felt there should be. Severe reduction of product while demanding the same premium price is not sound business strategy. And that's something we really need to talk about. Expectations. You people at Bungie LOVE to play with our expectations. You LOVE the hype game. The problem is it feels like you've forgotten you're addressing gamers, and you come off sounding like you've never played a video game in your entire lives. When you say "Epic story" we expect it to rival Final Fantasy, or at least Skyrim. You could fit the current four years of Destiny in the first disc of FF-9 and it would rattle around like a peanut in an empty oil tanker. When you say "personalize your character and your gear and make the experience truly your own" we expect a creative suite on par with the WWE "Create a wrestler" feature and immersion deeper than Fable at the very least. Reach was more personalized than this, and we never even saw Noble-6's face. When you say you want to tell a story we expect the campaign to be something we can savor and enjoy, not some half-assed, disjointed narrative we absolutely MUST steamroll through as quickly as possible (not that you made THAT all that difficult to do) in order to get to the rest of the game's content (only to find that there's damned little to be found). And when you say that you LISTEN to your community, we expect you to take feedback from someone other than -blam!-ing monetized YouTubers who get paid to shill your game whether it fails or not. We've been asking you to fix RNG for years. We've been complaining about the lack of rewards and the shitty returns on time invested for years. We've been demanding some REAL story and some REAL end-game content for years. And all you do is focus on putting out the NEXT game while the "B" Team half-asses some filler for three years. I'm going to be very blunt here with you, Bungie: you have not given your community any reason to believe your game is worth investing in anymore. The "Grand experiment" is over. We will not pardon your dust, the growth period has long passed, you are not rank amateurs and we expected better from you because of that. And you failed. You failed to heed the massive decline of your community's population as a clear indication that you were making the wrong choices, and instead you doubled-down on those poor decisions. We are far beyond the point of "gently banking to one side to get back on course." You need to hit the brakes, throw this sonuvabitch in reverse, and turn the -blam!- around because you blew it and you blew it big.
English
#feedback

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  • You don't speak for me or everyone here. If this is your view only, don't act like everyone here agrees

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    • Agree with 95% of what the op posted bungie need to take notice and start listening to the majority of players.

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    • Hi there, I have a non-stressful way if farming tokens: I go to to earth, Winding Cove, if you have full faction gear it will be a breeze! If not it’s also very easy... so I do the patrols there in Winding Cove, then by the time it’s over there’s a public event flag that pops up, bam hit that flag, shoot the ship equals heroic, kill boss bam 5tokens, 5renown bam go to the lost sector just next to it, relaxing easy snipes, kill boss bam 10tokens, then go out after three or less minutes and the pub event flag is back again... bam rinse and repeat... hope this helps anyone. Have a nice day, ~Leone

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      • That was well written and well said. I actually agree with you one hundred percent. All the atrocious decisions that went into Destiny 2 really felt like a slap in the face after enjoying the first game for three years. Unfortunately, I feel like nothing any of us say is going to make any bit worse of difference. In my eyes, Bungie no longer cares about giving a quality experience to their consumers, but instead cares only for their own top dollar. It’s why I stopped playing this game, and refuse to spend any more money on this company. I really, really, really, wanted to like Destiny. The way it was advertised sounded like my dream game. I mean, a first person shooter rpg?!! Hell yes. From the makers of Halo? I was in for the ten year haul. Then the lies started to become apparent. Okay. It wasn’t the game they advertised, but the crucible in D1 was fun as hell and even though I hated every business decision Bungie made, I kept playing and buying the expansions. I bought the big D2 bundle because I thought the game would play like the original with more expanding to it. Instead it felt nothing like the D1 at all. It felt like a piss poor version of it that should have came out ten years prior. It is obvious that Bungie’s ten year plan is simply “milk the customers’ money” and I refuse to be a part of it anymore. I don’t care what they add or change, I’m not coming back.

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      • My biggest complaint is, how hard is it to make sure things work properly? Let's look at the requirements for ornaments and catalysts for example. The latest one I have encountered, dead orbit arm ornaments for hunters lol. Kill hive with fully charged melee abilities lol sounds simple enough, nope, you have to use very specific melee traits basically to get it to work it would seem, other than that it seems like a crap shoot. There are tons of things like that in this game, and we shouldn't have to figure out our own work around to finish it, or wait half a frickin year to see it fixed. At least word it properly to give us more of a clue if it is suppose to be like that lol.

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        • Just save your breath, man. I've been you. We are all/have. Just start playing other games. Let it go, you'll be happier.

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          • This is an absolutely asinine post coming from some D1 elitist. I absolutely hate it when people try to be "the speaker" of the Destiny 2 fans. Here's what I know, talking with people that actually enjoy this game: *People are BEYOND excited for Forsaken. Nobody in my clan has expressed any reservations. They just want the DLC out NOW because they're that excited for it. *The people that actively play and enjoy this game agree, there were some great moments in Destiny 1, but Destiny 2 is also very fun. The handcrafted raids, raid lairs, and stories are great, no matter how short they are. *The new weapon slots are different, but not any worse. People just really aren't complaining about that. *Shaders everyone agrees need to be changed. Bring back infinite shaders, or at least let us dismantle the ones that we hate into components to buy the ones we want. As for the glimmer part, no one cares. *Faction rallies are improved, but need more work. Basically no one in my clan cares about the Reknown. It's easy to get 12 tokens in ~5 minutes with or without a full faction set. It's easy to clear out the sectors by yourself. Bring a shotgun and run straight for the boss. Pack something that heals your or keeps you alive longer (invisibility). The reason people found exploits to tokens wasn't because it was "so boring" it was just because they wanted to get it done as quick as possible, just like every other thing in this game. They want to be the first ones with the new stuff from the factions. First ones with new ornaments, and first ones with catalysts. Because people like to one phase Calus, that must also mean Calus is boring or bad in some way? In conclusion, the "fans" that are actually playing the game, don't really care about anything you said. Sure there can be improvements, but D1 was also pretty bad at times too. We know Bungie will make things better, we know what to expect when we buy these games. We don't overhype the game, then fall on our a$$ because our hype bubble was popped. This game is meant to be grinded and done with clans, and since this game launched on PC, I've been playing it heavily. I don't regret a dollar of my purchase. So stop trying to talk like you know what's best for everyone, because in all honesty, people are still playing this game and enjoying it.

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            • Editado por XizWhoA: 6/30/2018 1:06:38 AM
              Ummmm. Renown did make faction rallies better, world's better, actually... So did adding weapon catalysts.

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              • Honestly, If everyone here keeps comparing D2 to D1, you will have what we have above. A Butthurt fan who wants the game to be perfect. D2 in it of itself is a great game, amazing artwork, soundtrack, weapons and characters. It is an amazing universe, and the new stories are not bad either. Play it for what it is, dont play it trying to compare it to Final fantasy, you will be disappointed every time, that doesn't make D2 bad, its just not final fantasy.

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                • [quote]Here's a crucial change that needs to be made: STOP listening to the blat-ass, cry-baby try-hards who want to be "special little snowflakes." Clan Raid and Trials engrams offering clan members a SINGLE piece of gear each week was a great idea and it should be left to the sole discretion of the CLANS to decide whether a member is taking advantage of them. Those who DO run Raids/Trials get MULTIPLE pieces of gear each week. THAT is their reward for stepping up to the plate. And that applies to the level cap whiners, too. Those who have had to rely on Clan Engrams because they simply do not have the same amount of time to throw away as other players do should NOT be shafted out of reaching the level cap. The cap is NOT about prestige. It's just a gate mechanism. They want something to brag about they've got Glory Ranks and Nightfall Top Scores. They can go be sweaty over there. You had a good thing here and you killed it because some insecure jackass who gets his self-worth from a damn video game felt threatened by a 1:5 ratio. Stop listening to these self-centered little shits. They are not good for your game.[/quote]NO. Endgame rewards [u]should[/u] be reserved for players who run endgame, when you hand out rewards you totally diminish the value around them; absouloutely 100% NOPE to it, there shouldn't be hand outs to those unwilling to out the time and effort in. No, no, no.

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                  • these kinds of posts are just so annoying to me. its just the most annoying whiny shit ever.

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                    • Bungie is just like Disney with Star Wars now. They are too big and removed from the fan base to give a sh!t.

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                      • Editado por Groovinator: 6/30/2018 6:15:36 PM
                        The only thing that keeps me coming back is PVP. Iron Banner is a lot of fun, and I grinded my butt off last week for those ornaments, which happens to be my favorite armor in the game. I feel accomplished. The following week, however you shove me into a week long PVE token grind, where the most interesting item is hidden behind an insane rank of 50. I have neither the time, the patience, nor the will to grind those boring public events all day. It's just NOT fun. Just go back to making factions something we can work on week to week like Destiny 1. Don't make me farm those stupid tokens all day. Faction rallies is the worst times event ever. P.s. It might help a little if you would just allow us to turn off the cringy dialogue on these public events. Just a little.

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                        • ARE you on serious drugs? you may need help there buddy. no one can read that year long wall of text and your attitude is such in title and first sentence that anyone reading that will hate your guts. just an fyi

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                          • Nothing personal but I didn't read all of it. The best answer I can give knowing Bungie's track record? [spoiler]The game is working as intended...[/spoiler]

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                            • I stopped reading halfway through after you demonstrated the pot calling the kettle black. The issues you mentioned with crucible have ABSOLUTELY NO RELATION TO THE REAL PROBLEMS PLAGUING CRUCIBLE TO THIS DAY! I put that in all caps because you're rationalizing over some person just playing to exploit the clan engrams. Ok...only me and a friend of mine have been the only two members in our clan playing. Everyone else including the owner and creator of our clan quit after Curse of Osiris. On top of that you talk about the unbearable grind of Faction Rallies...Dude...I literally have 700 dead orbit tokens sitting in my inventory and I already have turned in 69 packages. You wanna know what the real grind was? The Ornaments and guess what I got all of that done too. This is just some post of you rationalizing of your preferences not even acknowledging the real issues plaguing the game. Crucible really meaning something other than an casual playlist on top of Faction Rallies meaning something. Here I'll pitch an idea thats actual worthwhile feedback. I'm done trying to understand your emotional bull butter. Crucible + Faction Rallies need to = something meaningful right? Ok take the PC game Turf Battles. They had a PvE PvP system. You could PvP to fight over control of a patrol space to farm like Mercury. There. Thats an idea that could make the game better for everyone.

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                              • D2 is a shite game that anyone with half a brAin could tell was going to be shite from the beta the fact that you bought it is your problem not bungies.

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                                • Bump!

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                                • As a massive fan of this franchise b4 now, I can say from the bottom of my heart that it has become the most anger inducing, frustrating game I have ever gotten into. I hate it more & more with each recent decision & I'm so friggin done. I don't want to b. I keep hoping some1 at bungie gets some sense all of a sudden & realizes there's nothing fun anymore in d2. They have run every activity into the ground & the few playable things have been stripped down to pointless bcuz they took away every possible grind for progression. Why? Cuz some ppl use farming methods? Why t.f. is that my problem? I have always put in grind to earn my progress & rewards. Stop punishing the true fans & players cuz cheap players want to rush. I left the game hoping to rtn less frustrated and I immediately hated the experience again. I won't buy another destiny dlc or game unless this changes & I know I am not alone cuz ev1 talks about the good ol days & what a massive failure thus current state especially is. This isn't coming from negative ppl. It comes from huge Destiny fans who can't wrap their head around how developers can go from beauty to the most annoying, frustrating, least rewarding & least fun experience from 1 game to the next. Potential for days but constant neutering, nerfing, holding us back has completely destroyed this franchise. Completely discouraged & Disgusted.

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                                  • "Pardon our dust", damn, I haven't heard that in a long ass while.

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                                    • The biggest problem is that they keep changing things that nobody asked for. Like renown for example. Or revive tokens in raids and PvP. Or removing daily heroic missions. Consumable shaders... seriously who TF thought these were good ideas.

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                                      • I keep struggling with wanting to love this game. I get into it for a bit when new content drops then shortly thereafter I realize it's generally still crap. I'll still jump on once in a while, but basically once I get my fix of the general game mechanics (I do love the way the game feels) there's just nothing left to keep me amused. As you said, getting gear 10 levels below me gets old real fast. Removing Iron Banner as a path to leveling was a huge mistake, zero point in leveling with vendor, there's just no incentive to play once the basic milestones are done. Everything else is all low level useless garbage. Even exotic engrams are useless now for leveling. Seriously, they had D1 sorted at the end, there was a path for everyone to get max gear, there was always something to grind for, a reason to play, be it a god role or just higher powered gear. They can do whatever they want this fall, but if they stick to the crap gear drops I'm not buying it. How short are their memories? They went through this same crap in D1 only to arrive at the point where with Age of Triumph things were in good shape. Then they throw it all away and start over... Honestly there is no excuse for where this game is at.

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                                        • I can agree with most of what you wrote except for the clan engrams. You should hand out what is expected to be endgame gear.

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                                          • And you've [i]still[/i] got sponges buying 10 dollar ornaments and emotes.

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                                            • The problem as I see it, is that destiny 2 should have been an expansion of D1 with all the features it had at its last update. Instead we got a totally different game that is actually lesser than its predecessor. I dont understand all the changes that were made and why so many features were removed. I guess they wanted to make it so vanilla that everybody could win all the time at every activity. All the items are generic and the gameplay is bland and stale. Maybe they got more players at launch because of the changes, unfortunately the changes also eliminated any reason to continue playing. Light level was a secondary goal in D1, earned weapons and gear to make your guardian feel customized for your play style were the primary draw. That all seems to have been lost in the sequel and maybe its too late to bring back features now that should have been here from the beginning

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                                              • I agree, Bungie has made a fortune off the accolades received from the Halo series, now they deliver a far inferior product and continue to make hundreds of millions dollars on the hopeful expectations of faithful gamers of whom expect an equal product... only to realize that we have been gamed by a corperate mogul that only cares about the bottom line, and they do not care one iota about the game play experience. Bungee only cares about our addiction to gaming and their addiction to dollars

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