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7/11/2016 5:01:17 PM
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I'm still not seeing how this council can be effective. Cozmo has already stated that this council would have no direct access to the Devs and wouldn't be treated any differently than any other forum member and what they post as feedback. Nor is this the only place they get their feedback from.
So now this just appears to be an elite club in the minds of its members and the false hope of other forum members that will think your club will have priority when it will not.
And just out of curiosity. Since we have already established this council has no higher authority or single influence in the feedback delivered to Bungie. What will be the consequences for the council who fail to deliver all the things submitted to them by the hopeful members that voted for the council when nothing changes with how Bungie operate's their company and produces their game?
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If they wont listen to the main you tubers/twitch streamers about the game then they wont listen to any council. if they want to hear the views of the general population they should just listen to you guys on the podcast. its just that simple. but then they may have to do something with what was really suggested.
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I remember the 90s! All of Megaman and Super Mario that is... what do you know, you 99' pleb!
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[quote]So now this just appears to be an elite club in the minds of its members and the false hope of other forum members that will think your club will have priority when it will not.[/quote] Yeah why have two of them going around huh...
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Priory will come after forcing it in. Play nice earn bungie's trust. Then start tapering feedback and filtering any one who does not support them. If it's not just taken over at the start. No down side for the GC (just do a name change and no one knows you was member). Any failed ideas can be blamed on bungie "we tried but they did not care". In the end bungie will take the hit for this if they are clueless enough to let it happen.
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I paid to play Destiny, not earn Bungie's trust. When Bungie starts showing some professionalism and engaging in more active dialogue with the community (sorry Cozmo but your attempts are not effective at all), then perhaps their image as a company can go in a more positive direction. As of now, I don't trust Bungie one bit.
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You paid for a product. There was no contract that that product would be tailored to your desires. It's like juice. You bought it and you didn't like it so you go buy a different juice. You don't write a letter to the juice factory asking them to change the juice.
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You just reiterated my point. I paid to play Destiny the product. If I start drinking Minute Made orange juice and give praise on the quality, I don't go kissing Coca Cola's (they bottle MM oj) @$$. I simply choose or not choose to continue purchasing nd consuming their product. If their oj starts tasting like $#!t, I just buy a different high-quality brand. At the end of the day, Coca Cola has my money already just like Bungie does for Destiny. I don't consume their product to suck up to the manufacturers. So again, I pay to play Destiny, not suck up to Bungie. As the quality Bungie's product degrades, I move on to bettwr games.
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BREXIT!
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Council members will not be submitting their own feedback. They are essentially vetting submissions before they go to Cozmo. Communicating and voting on so that only the best ideas are submitted. It's still up to Bungie to do their own vetting and investigation into what's being submitted BUT submissions from the council should be taken as more 'quality' submissions than the usual. No change in [b]priority [/b]but a change in [b]quality[/b]. You're usually fairly objective RWG and most know that I'm not the biggest Mal fan but it seems to me you really haven't read (or understood) what the basic duties are. Not trying to be confrontational just point it out before others do. PS...I"m not saying I'm even a proponent of this but I'm trying to understand fully and correctly it to see if it can actually help. [quote]And just out of curiosity... [/quote] Your last paragraph is interesting. There should be some outline into holding accountability for [b]doing the job.[/b]
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[quote]They are essentially vetting submissions before they go to Cozmo. Communicating and voting on so that only the best ideas are submitted. BUT submissions from the council should be taken as more 'quality' submissions than the usual.[/quote] This. The GC picks only the ideas they like and want them summited with the understanding they are of "better quality". 10 people want the power to say "here is the important ideas. Ignore the rest. We have picked what we view as the best". Trust us we are more quality players. We know what's best.
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So, ill ask you again and see if you don't avoid the question like you have every time. What idea do you have that would work to establish a better communication with Bungie? [b]So far in 2 years no one has been able to do this and hasn't even tried to come up with a idea that would work. So please do explain how you can do this. Because all you have posted since the first council has been posted has been (nothing but you against it) but no other solution...[/b]
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People have gave ideas. You can look them up. But I'll give you 1 STOP TRING TO DEMONIZE THEM OVER EVERY LITTLE THING. It tends to stop people from talking to you. Bungie could do q&a weekly. They built a twitch studio how about using it. We talk to them. THEY NEED TO TALK TO US not a small group of 10 who think they speak for every one. You wanting to be in the limelight as a "Cosmo replacement" will help no one and nothing. Sorry.
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[quote]Bungie could do q&a weekly. They built a twitch studio how about using it.[/quote] Good idea, go make it happen? What's stopping you or anyone else from trying to explore that avenue at the same time this is going on? Having more than one thing being worked on is actually rather smart. Don't tell me you're expecting me to do BOTH, though. That would just be ridiculous, have you not seen how crazy these Council discussions get on their own? O_o
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[quote]People have gave ideas. You can look them up. But I'll give you 1 STOP TRING TO DEMONIZE THEM OVER EVERY LITTLE THING. It tends to stop people from talking to you. Bungie could do q&a weekly. They built a twitch studio how about using it. We talk to them. THEY NEED TO TALK TO US not a small group of 10 who think they speak for every one. You wanting to be in the limelight as a "Cosmo replacement" will help no one and nothing[/quote] [b]You have repeated that same line 20 different times that (People have gave ideas) You continuously keep avoiding my quest. I asked (you) not everyone else because you only have an opinion that is against this. You don't have a solution do ya? but you seem to have the answer on why it wont work. Explain to everyone why you only have one so-call way of answering to this topic but not the other???[/b]
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I'm not the only one against this, just the most vocal. I never said I have all the answers. I have gave answers to your questions. You refuse to accept them. 10 people having private talks in private forums don't help the community.
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[quote]I'm not the only one against this, just the most vocal. I never said I have all the answers. I have gave answers to your questions. You refuse to accept them. 10 people having private talks in private forums don't help the community.[/quote] Well everyone that post don't spend as much time as you disagreeing with everyone. Thank you for showing everyone you can't do it, but you can type away on why not because it's the only thing you can do. Great job chump...
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[quote]This. The GC picks only the ideas they like and want them summited with the understanding they are of "better quality". 10 people want the power to say "here is the important ideas. Ignore the rest. We have picked what we view as the best". Trust us we are more quality players. We know what's best.[/quote] No that's not right either. I swear no one has actually read anything that has been proposed.
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I have. With the responses. Even here you still have some already wanted to be elected to push what they think is best.
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That's the thing. You are expecting Bungie to accept the council as an authority on the quality of the feedback. It has already been noted by Cozmo that it will not. So again, we will have forum members who will be expecting an outcome based on a false premise. And to reiterate. I'm not against the few here who wish to band their ideas together and make a post under their leader of popularity. It should just not be a designated formal representation of the forum community at large.
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I was all on board for this until it was said that members will be elected by a vote. That basically ensures that people will misuse this. It will turn this into a popularity contest members who are big on twitch or stream or even friends of people like that will use that as a way to get elected. Oh need a flawless np vote for me :) Let's think back to hs was the best person ever elected or chosen for things no it was the popular kid. Vote for me pizza everyday, all that bs this also makes it so people who are great players with great knowledge of the game may never be a member unless they have a big fan base?
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[quote]Remember, these are rough drafts, nothing written in stone. This is for the sole purpose of generating conversation and getting feedback.[/quote]
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Then I would say that's the biggest issue I see with it as of now, and not sure how exactly to fix the selection process. It really needs to be kept from being a popularity contest anytime you make it about votes it will make the possibility of misconduct even greater.
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True, although I don't see a possible way to avoid such in any situation. If you think about it, any kind of election process is basically the same way. It all boils down to who the voters like most. Others in previous discussions were against the idea of the Community having any kind of say in the elections at all and that Bungie should apparently be the ones to select Council Members. But even then, that just passes the buck as then you could say the same thing about Bungie in that situation, that they only picked the people they liked most. The other problem with that in that situation, the Community's control over the Council then becomes undermined since the people are surrounding their right to choose to a company that has a bad habit of making bad decisions. I don't see how we could possibly make it so that its NOT a popularity contest. The only idea I had was the one I've been working with, which is to make the job itself rather difficult which, I mean, it is. Personally, when you consider all the kind of work the Council will be expected to do, the time and effort required of them to get the job done and always being scrutinized by the Community watching your every move? Not to mention the amount of hate so people are sure to get from various trolls in the forum just looking to bust chops and create conflicts? I really can't picture anyone willingly putting themselves through that for the sake of just being popular. If anything? The job of a Council Member is less about popularity and more about respect. If you are on the Council, and manage to do your job, the only way to succeed with it is if you are capable of being committed to the task at hand and devoted to its ideals and the Community. To always keep your calm and maintain a stance of neutrality at all times. It will be mentally exhausting, perhaps even emotionally taxing as well. Anyone who can handle that kind of responsibility would, in my opinion, definitely be worthy of respect and admiration. But its also more than that as well. They would act as a role model for everyone else in the Community, something that we can all aspire to be. And to me, that's a good thing. It builds pride and demonstrates that even though this is just a game, we can unite and come together for common goals. I'm always looking to encourage that. If nothing else, if we can manage to empower this Community to take action and work together? Then no matter what this will have been a success, even if it doesn't end up working out in the end.
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[quote]You are expecting Bungie to accept the council as an authority on the quality of the feedback. It has already been noted by Cozmo that it will not.[/quote] I still don't feel you're looking at it in the right way. It's not about "Authority". It's about representation. [quote]It should just not be a designated formal representation of the forum community at large.[/quote] To follow up my last sentence, with all the mishmash of post in here that are meaningless but force the quality posts down the queue, why wouldn't you want a bit more formality in communicating to Bungie?
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Mal don't let any member of the DTC be eligible to run. These guys are the forum "ladies of the night," and are led by the biggest flip-flopping space feces around.
