I've played destiny since the beginning. From one of the first teams to beat VoG, to constantly deleting and remaking characters to get all the Crota gear, to winning my first 29 Trials games. These weapons take all the diversity from the game due to the sheer power and abilities. I've looked at all these whiny thorn nerf posts, and it's just kids who go negative whining that they get killed. But in reality, something needs to be done about Thorn and The Last Word, along with a few other things I'll mention, and no it's not because I'm bad, or because I want every gun to be shitty. There are actually reasons. Trials of Osiris has actually added an MLG effect to the game. Multiplayer that is truly competitive. But what's the fun when everyone in the game uses Thorn? You can't compete with a team of Thorns, combo'd with Felwinters Lie with rangefinder or Ephridotes (<-- Don't know the spelling) Spear with final round, and then a Legendary Rocket with Tracking, coupled with a warlock void walker or Hunter bladedancer with Blink on. You [i]cant[/i] compete. Nor does it take [i]any[/i] skill to use a 2 shot hand cannon or blink with a sniper shotgun like Felwinters. [b][i]Auto Rifles/Suros Regime[/i][/b] People complained about Suros Regime for the longest time. Sure enough, it got nerfed specifically (Lower bottom half of the magazine damage for "Suros Regime" upgrade), and was followed by a base damage nerf for auto rifles in general. But why did Suros get nerfed? Suros was never overpowered. All these people saying "everyone ran around with Suros before it was nerfed" must be a newly Thorn fanboy, because I've been playing for a while, and there were very few people each game using it. In a 12 person game mode, you might see 1-3 people using it. So at most, 25% of players. In its prime, it would be a 6 shot kill to the head, with a slowed fire rate. About a 3-4 second kill. Looking now, Thorn is used roughy by 4-7 people in a 12 person game, so at most around 62%. Suros was not overpowered, nor were any guns at that time. Hand cannons would still outgun most guns close range, fusion rifles were decent, ect. The game had balance. But Nerfing Autos isn't the only reason why this game is unbalanced. [b][i]Buffing of Hand Cannons Base Damage/ Individual Thorn and TLW Buffs[/i][/b] At the same time Suros itself and the Base Damage of all Autos was nerfed, the Base Damage of Hand Cannons was increased, and Thorn and The Last Word were buffed individually also. Let's go over the effects. [b]Thorn[/b] Thorn used to be a fair gun. Take it from someone who has been in Cruicible from the beginning. There was nothing wrong with Thorn. 4 headshots would be a kill, 3 with MoD (Mark of the Devourer). Considering its rate of fire, and the fact that you take poison damage over time, I don't see how this gun needed a buff. It's range still exceeded Suros, and it's DoT takes you out of the fight for 6 seconds. Let's go over the Buffs. [i]Increased DoT for MoD[/i] Mark of the Devourer has always been annoying in Cruicible, but never so much pre-buff. Thorns MoD used to do 4 damage per second over 6 seconds. That's still 24 damage. Sure, that wasn't a lot. But you're not considering the already 66 DpS that you got for a headshot with Thorn, along with how you can't regain your health during that time. The buff from 4 damage per second over 6 seconds, to 7 damage per second for 6 seconds has had a hugely negative effect for many reasons. You're losing health at a remarkably higher pace (about double), and Thorns base damage already being buffed has caused huge problems. [i][u]Thorn's Gameplay After Buffs[/u][/i] A once fair gun, has been buffed to the point where you can't go without one. With the MoD buff, and base damage raised, thorn has a 2 shot to the head capability, 3 to the body. This is absolutely ridiculous. When you get hit by Thorn, you also flinch, so getting headshots on them with Red Death, or other guns is harder then heck. One headshot brings you down to half health, meaning an Arc Bolt, or Solar Bolt grenade will one hit kill you instantly, as you really have no time to dodge. When you are battling a kid with Thorn, let's say you take 85% of his health out, and he takes 85% of yours out. If you somehow survive getting poisoned over time, guess what? You'll be at 2% health for another 2-3 seconds before your health starts regaining, and he will already be blinking at you with a Felwinters at full health. How is that balance? I really don't understand. Suros, Vex, Fusion Rifles were never close to being like Hand Cannons now. Send it also allows Thorn to outgun snipers, as the range and accuracy are increased, meaning no fall off damage, and getting hit by thorn makes you flinch so you can't line up head shots. [u]My Suggestion[/u] Reduce MoD from 7x6 to 3x5. Take "Send it" off its perks to eliminate the "Sniper Effect" and fix the glitches out there allowing for easy kills. [b]The Last Word[/b] Nobody really notices TLW in Trials because it's easy for everyone to use Thorn and pick people off like you're sniping. But in regular playlists, TLW is the most used gun. There are plenty of reasons why, and like Thorn, this gun throws off balance to Cruicible. [i]"Last Word" Upgrade Buff/Damage Boost[/i] The Last Word has always been good, but when they buffed hand cannons, and individually buffed The Last Word upgrade, this gun became way too annoying. The Buff saw a huge increase to all body damage when hip firing, not just precision damage like it says. TLW's stability was hugely increased, and it's Fire Rate has always been too quick due to fanfire. With this buff (or glitch) allowing increased hip fire damage to the body has caused TLW to kill in 3-4 body shots depending on if it's hidden perk kicks in. Due to its rate of fire, this is way too fast of a kill, as it can kill in 1-3 shots to the head. Yes, TLW can one shot. Here's the reason. [i]TLW's Hidden Perk[/i] "Luck in the Chamber" Yes, I confirmed myself that this is a real thing. I recorded a clip myself of actual gameplay where I one shotted a kid in the head with TLW from full health. No teamates anywhere around, and the DpS on that shot was 287. Luck in the Chamber allows one bullet in the magazine to cause considerable bonus damage, allowing TLW from close range to kill in one heashot, and 2 body shots. [i]TLW's Range/ADS Damage[/i] Considering its range is nothing, how is it that it can 3 shot to the head from across the map? And not just a 3 shot while hip firing (that wouldn't be a problem) but while you ADS. When ADSing on this weapon, you have a 3-5 second window where the gun doesn't register that you are Aiming Down your Sight, and it gives you the increase damage while you are aiming down. So you don't even have to hip fire with the gun for increased damage. This causes the gun to have long range capability, as with most hand cannons, there is no fall off damage from far range. [i][u]The Last Word's Gameplay After Buffs[/u][/i] If you read and truly think about this gun, you'll understand why it's so cheap and easy to kill with. With Fanfire and buffs, this gun will 3 shot you in the head cross map, and will 1-2 shot you up close. With its ridiculous fire rate, and range this gun needs balancing to help make it balanced. [u]My Suggestion[/u] Lower range; take away its hidden perk and fix the ADS glitch. [b]Final Round Snipers[/b] I won't go into much detail, but we all know this a problem, especially in trials. Kids abuse it, shooting off 2 of there Spear's bullets to get the one shot kill at the start of each round. Instead of fixing it, all you did was take "Final Round" off the reroll list when reforging snipers. That's great. Now everyone who doesn't have a final round sniper won't ever have one, while everyone who already had one can keep it. Good work. [u]My Suggestion[/u] Take "Final Round" off all snipers and replace it with something else. [b]Felwinters Lie/All Reforged Shotguns[/b] I can't stand this. Kids with these shotguns like Felwinters, Party Crasher, or The Matador have such a huge advantage in Cruicible. Reforging until having either Shot Package or Rangefinder, Coupled with Aggressive Ballistics and the new Hammer Forged (Increases Range/Lowers Mag Size) makes these Shotguns have way too much damage from range. Nerfing fusion rifles has made it so you literally have to hit every last bolt from close range to get a kill. Well when kids blink at you with Felwinters I don't see how you're supposed to counter this. There's no reason they need this much range. [u]My Suggestion[/u] Either: Take Rangefinder and Shot Package off shotguns Or Nerf Shotguns Base Damage and Range [b]Abusing Blink[/b] Blink has started becoming abused since shotguns were buffed. Yes, blink has a cool down after you use it twice, but it needs to take way longer to blink. It can be used way too often, and it causes opponents to be completely disoriented. Kids using Ranged Shotguns have a huge advantage when they blink, as they can get right in your face, well, close enough to one shot you within seconds, while dodging your bullets. [u]My Suggestion[/u] Increase the cooldown between each blink to 4 seconds, stopping kids from abusing it.