I didn't write this. Jharv01 did in a response to another thread, but more people should read and agree with it: Edit: please nobody comment saying strange coins are earned. We know this. We do not disagree. It is the value of those coins they is in questions or, if you prefer, the price of the best exotics in the game being the equivalent of 60 minutes play...So understand the points actually being made rather than argue against a position only an ignorant few hold. Thank you. [quote]Sorry Deej, but the gear that is purchased with coins is not earned. Face it, coins are a currency with no value. Everyone has so many coins, that they literally mean nothing. You could give me Xur's gear for free every week, and it'd be the same as me purchasing it. I have so many coins I don't know what to do with them other than buy a bunch of nothing that I don't need. Now, if people had to actually budget their purchases like they do in the real world, then coins would have a ton of value. If we only received on average 30 coins per week, but needed 100 to purchase one item, well then I think we'd have a different conversation and a lot of people complaining about how it's unfair that someone who puts in time and saves gets to buy a piece of gear they really want. Sound familiar? Sounds like the real world to me, and it works. But you've opted for a system where your currency means nothing and everyone is essentially given everything. So no, Xur gear is not earned with coins. Xur gear is basically a freebee. Doing Atheon 3 times a week for 3 months and finally being lucky enough to have a certain exotic drop is more "earning" than Xur is. Xur gives everyone a hand-out. Farming bosses until they finally drop what you want, although lucky, at least requires time. I'm not saying it's the best system in the world, but it is better than having Xur give gear away. I have 4 Gjallarhorns. Two I've received from Atheon Hard, Two from Deathsinger. If Xur sells it, will I feel ripped off? Absolutely. Not because I'm some special snowflake who should have it and you should not. But because I take the time to run Atheon hard 3 times per week, and run Crota at least on normal 3 times per week. If you choose to not put in that time, like someone chooses to slack off in school and play video games through their undergrad career, there's no sympathy for you if you don't have the [u][b]"CHANCE"[/b][/u] to get a good job in the future. At the same time, there are exotics that I don't have. Do I feel entitled to being handed them simply because I exist? No. I'm happy to continue to run all of the high chance exotic bosses and chests in this game every week until I do get them. Or maybe I never will. So what. What ruins games like this is people feeling they should be entitled to everything just because you exist. It doesn't work in the real world. People who work harder, or at least put in more time, will have a higher chance than you at getting what they want. It's no guarantee, but it does raise their chances. The same is true of drops in Destiny. The loot system isn't perfect, I'd love to see more rewards, but I absolutely do not want to see more hand-outs. Xur is just hand-out vendor. Complain and bash me all you want, it's going to fall on blind eyes and deaf ears. Destiny is really just a hand-out kind of game that wants everyone to be happy and have everything. Because when you all have everything, you all feel special. But sadly, it also devalues what you have, especially for the people who put the necessary time into acquiring them. Doing Atheon for Gjallarhorn is hardly earning, but it's more earning than Xur is. Because you have to put in that time. For Xur purchases, you do a simple 15-minute strike a few times a week. Boom, enough currency to buy everything he carries next week. This is why you cannot equate coins in this game to money in the real world. Real money has value because people aren't sitting around with so much that they can buy everything they want. Most people have to budget. There's no budgeting with Xur. Everyone just buys everything off him. Hence the hand-out discussion. I'll stop the rant there. Maybe Deej will read it. Maybe he wont. But anyone who is a good player and wants a good system in place that provides incentive, reward, and at least some level of chance influenced by time will agree. It works in every other game that has such a system: A Strong player vs weak player gap. A distinguishable difference between who puts in time and who doesn't, based on rewards and accomplishments in that game. WoW lasted for 10+ years and is still going. The best players in the world will have gear and accomplishments you never will. Cry about it. I wish Destiny had the same system that rewarded time and effort. "Effort" doesn't seem like it'll be happening any time soon. The game's so easy it's almost a joke. But at least reward time. Not a weekly Tuesday 15-minute strike run and Friday log-on for Xur hand-outs. This game is not sustainable with that kind of system in place. [u][b]TL;DR [/b][/u] Destiny has no economy. Destiny has no real "earning", the closest thing is to earning is farming bosses and chests for a chance at a drop because at least that requires the "time" component, and even that is devalued when those items are handed out the following week to the community in exchange for a useless currency everyone has too much of. End of story. Deal with it. [u][b]Edit:-[/b][/u] And since I hate complaining about problems without proposing solutions, Xur should just sell items for 100-150 coins a piece. Now it becomes a lot more like real world currency. Some people acquire it very slowly and have to save for months to buy one thing. Others put in a lot of time and will acquire it faster. Is it unfair? Sure. Unfair is great. Unfair provides incentive. Me having more than you leads to you wanted to work harder, put in more time, etc. And time should be rewarded, like it is in the real world. Xur gear should need to be budgeted. Can I afford that this week? Should I wait for next week? I can't have it all, I need to pick and choose what I want. What a fun time that would be. But oh wait, all the crappy players who want freebies would be inconvenienced. Can't have that! Hence the whole flawed system. The real world doesn't appease the bottomfeeders of society. You'd all be quite happy with gangbangers rotting away on the streets. But when it comes to Destiny, The weakest link must have all exotics in the game! It's only fair! Can't have one person who puts in time being different than a guy who doesnt! Good logic. [u][b]Edit 2:-[/b][/u] Just so you know, this isn't for you, this is for Deej. A couple years ago Kripparian puts out an hour long video for Blizzard on how Diablo III was failing and people were losing interest in the end-game grind. He talked about something called "Champion levels" and how it would restore interest in the grind and give people something to work for. A reward for their time, but not something so game-changing that it'd leave those who didn't put in the time that much worse off. What was Blizzard's response? The introduction of "Paragon levels" into their game. People still play WoW, people still play Diablo. Do you think it's because Blizzard ignored their player base and just kept pushing a flawed system that benefitted the weakest links? Do you think it's because they looked past the suggestions of their stronger players? No, they listened, they responded, and they delivered. Something I still hope that Bungie can do, but am not hopeful for anymore. I still want Destiny to succeed, but it's just going to end up a game for casuals that fades out for everyone else. Stronger players are already feeling like "OK now what?". There has to be something in it for stronger players to work on, and weaker players to aspire to. Paragon levels were perfect for Diablo III. In Destiny, from gear acquisition to raid challenge, this game just doesn't have that "I put time into this, I worked on that, I aspire to some day achieving more because this" factor that a game needs to be successful long-term. This Xur discussion is just the tip of the iceberg.[/quote]