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9/23/2025 7:41:38 AM
15
Spread shots need to be put in their place
This type of hand cannon being introduced is in terrible need of a rework or balance. To be constructive about this, they need to be viewed as shotguns
Spread shots should not be capable of being a shotgun that allows you to shoot at range. They should be an alternative shotgun with significantly less range than the average shotguns even with full range spec. Specifically just because they are primary ammo weapons
Here’s some bullet points on why they are overpowered:
-they have too much range
-infinite ammo (primary)
-can 2 tap way too consistently
-allows for unfair cleanup kills
Basically, the range of The Chaperone with half the damage
Now for the simple changes:
-range should be no more than 5 meters for full damage with full range spec
-reduce base mag size to 4 and increased cap to 5
Some alternatives:
-change to special and only give 2 shots on spawn, 1 shot on ammo pickup
-lower damage significantly in pvp to keep the range and ammo type without giving the ability to kill from too far away. Make them 3 tap at full damage
-reduce rate of fire to make them slow fire, high damage, but not enough to allow easy ranged melee cleanup
There could be more to do about this weapon but as of right now, it’s way too strong and can allow for team kills without much effort since you can shoot, melee your way through multiple people. High skilled players can clean through people easily. Low skilled players can too easily pick up and put out.
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[quote]This type of hand cannon being introduced is in terrible need of a rework or balance. To be constructive about this, they need to be viewed as shotguns Spread shots should not be capable of being a shotgun that allows you to shoot at range. They should be an alternative shotgun with significantly less range than the average shotguns even with full range spec. Specifically just because they are primary ammo weapons Here’s some bullet points on why they are overpowered: -they have too much range -infinite ammo (primary) -can 2 tap way too consistently -allows for unfair cleanup kills Basically, the range of The Chaperone with half the damage Now for the simple changes: -range should be no more than 5 meters for full damage with full range spec -reduce base mag size to 4 and increased cap to 5 Some alternatives: -change to special and only give 2 shots on spawn, 1 shot on ammo pickup -lower damage significantly in pvp to keep the range and ammo type without giving the ability to kill from too far away. Make them 3 tap at full damage -reduce rate of fire to make them slow fire, high damage, but not enough to allow easy ranged melee cleanup There could be more to do about this weapon but as of right now, it’s way too strong and can allow for team kills without much effort since you can shoot, melee your way through multiple people. High skilled players can clean through people easily. Low skilled players can too easily pick up and put out.[/quote] Edit: what I gathered is majority people don’t want a problem being fixed. They want, instead, to carry around special weapons constantly and fight with them over using primary weapons. Because we’d actually want special crutches over balance
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1 ответYeah lets just rephrase your ideas "lets nuke spread HC so i can so back to camping with a pulse or mida" If anything spread HC just shows the special economy is messed up and needs to be turned back to how it was before. (The shadowkeep/beyond light era naile it special ammo wise)
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2 отв.Spread Shot Hand Cannons are as lethal as Sidearms and Submachine Guns should be. Close-range guns should absolutely shred people.
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1 ответSo just kill off the entire archetype? Those changes would make the guns worthless in both PvP and PvE.
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1 ответas someone who didn’t use them and finds them irritating, I disagree.. the issue is special ammo economy, not the potency of sg hc. Its identity should be preserved
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1 ответspreads aren't an issue when there is enough special ammo.
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2 отв.Would like to see the special ammo generation and starting special ammo buffed in PvP first, then we can talk about nerfs. Because the lack of special ammo in PvP is why I switched to an AR/Shotty HC build, not the 'damage appeal'.
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4 отв.Careful what you wish for. Even with maxed range, they only do full damage up to around 17 meters, but they don't have a tight enough spread to 2 shot beyond probably 13-14 meters, which I believe is just in range for a slug shotgun to OHK or barely out of reach, and they're definitely in fusion ranges. They're not going to adjust the damage to the point you need crits with a weapon like that unless they also enable bullet magnetism for them or adjust the ROF because if they take 3 shots to kill, that's a ttk of 1.2 seconds. And if you need crits to get the optimal ttk on a weapon like this with little to no BM, it would only make more sense to just convert it into a 120 or use a slug because that would just cut the range in half. If they convert it into a special, which I highly doubt will happen considering the several weapons they still have yet to do this with like Darci or Queenbreaker, at least 2 of such weapons still gets almost no usage anywhere, it would be getting a lethality buff to compensate. As for ammo, it would definitely be getting a lot more than 2 shots to start and 1 per brick. Every other special that can't OHK gets enough ammo to kill 1 player and 1-2 more shots on top of that. Why should these be the exception? You would definitely be better off with an actual shotgun if these can't OHK and only get 1 shot, especially if their full damage range is reduced by 2/3 of the current amount like you suggested. They're not going to adjust the ammo because that won't accomplish much if anything if you're already killing everyone in 2 shots or finishing them off with a melee after 1. And at least in PvE, would demand a VERY sizeable buff to justify losing half their potential damage per mag. As for nerfing their ROF, again, damage buff, which would also mean range buff by extension. Their ttk is 0.6 seconds, barely any faster than TLW while being as limited in range if not more so due to how the range stat is balanced for it and the fact it's damage is split into 12 pellets with, again, little to no bullet magnetism. The most they'll probably do is a spread change which could result in a buff because while you'd be hitting fewer shots at range, you wouldn't need to be as accurate to land the shots and more pellets could potentially hit the head while you're aiming in the same spot you currently would.
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2 отв.All these changes are pointless. Want spreadshots in their place? Fix the special ammo economy. Boom problem solved.
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2 отв.They should just revert the ammo changes. It changed the meta sure, but also brought back the worst one ever. Was special ammo even a problem? Spawning with 2 rounds wasn’t that big of an issue back then.
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1 ответNah or make stuff like shotguns ammo economy viable
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1 ответWould you say that to smg and sidearms? Because their effectiveness are very similar.
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While i agree they are strong there are also a million ways to 2 tap people rn. Gun stat should not effect pvp damage imo. There should be nothing in pvp that kills you in 1-2 hits other than maybe a super. PvP balance has been trash for a while.
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Solution 1: Don’t get close. Run from them. Create distance. Solution 2: If the prior solution fails, use shotgun.
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Buff the Felwinters Lie to Chaperone range, let it one tap at range including the ability to one tap supers, give it 4 in the magazine and always spawns with ammo, grant it a special ammo shot per kill. There ya go, best way to fix the spreadshot hand cannons, [b]overbuff all shotguns[/b], and then nerf all scout and pulse rifles to force the Hand Cannon and slide Shotgun Meta.
